Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

[Bubba Z]

Hi all!

I signed up for the Seymour Duncan forum the other day and posted in the pickup section, so this is my second post. Nice to meet you all! A couple of months ago, I jammed with a drummer friend and brought my Orange OR15. It seems to be a common question from people interested in the OR15, "Is it loud enough to play with a drummer?" Absolutely. Here are some videos from the jam showing how the amp sounds cranked up at full volume and how it can keep up with a drummer (These videos were before my Les Paul had Black Winters and still had the 498/490 combo):

Video 1:

[Bubba Z]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

Video 2:

[Surgeon]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

Thanks for the video, I like your tone.

It's funny, people who don't own an OR15 wonder if it'll be loud enough while everyone who does, know how effin loud it is. When I'm at home I run mine through my Rivera rockcrusher for Pete's sake!

Well done!

[Bubba Z]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

Thanks for the video, I like your tone.

It's funny, people who don't own an OR15 wonder if it'll be loud enough while everyone who does, know how effin loud it is. When I'm at home I run mine through my Rivera rockcrusher for Pete's sake!

Well done!

Thank you, much appreciated! The OR15 is an absolute beast. I think since 50-100 watt heads have been so popular for many years, people can be hesitant to trust a 15-watt head. They definitely should not be, cuz this thing roars.

[Rex_Rocker]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

What cab were you running it through?

[Bubba Z]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

What cab were you running it through?

I was using the Orange PPC212 closed-back cabinet. It was on the floor about a foot in front of me, I just put the OR15 on the dryer so I could easily tweak the EQ.

[Rex_Rocker]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

I was using the Orange PPC212 closed-back cabinet. It was on the floor about a foot in front of me, I just put the OR15 on the dryer so I could easily tweak the EQ.

I see. Well, a good cab like that also makes a world of difference.

[crusty philtrum]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

What about some clean chords ?

15 watt amps will keep up with a drummer, dimed and dirty, and will be great fun to play for rawk, but there simply won't be enough headroom for clean sounds alongside a drummer.

[Bubba Z]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

What about some clean chords ?

15 watt amps will keep up with a drummer, dimed and dirty, and will be great fun to play for rawk, but there simply won't be enough headroom for clean sounds alongside a drummer.

Depends on how you define "clean" in this context. While I don't generally have pristine Fender cleans, I can roll down the volume on the guitar and get it to a gritty clean while still being loud enough to be heard. However, a lot of the volume issue can be directly related to the drummer as well. For example, if I'm playing pure clean chords or jazz, I'd expect that the drummer would also lower his/her volume to fit the music. If I'm playing clean and the drummer is bashing away at the drums as though the song is thrash metal, then the amp's headroom isn't the primary issue. That being said, normally when I jam with my buddy, I don't need clean tones because we tend to play heavier styles of music and I don't have the need to transition back and forth from clean to dirty. If a person needs to jump from clean to distorted frequently, then the OR15 might not be the best option regardless because it's a single channel amp.

[crusty philtrum]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

Depends on how you define "clean" in this context.

Clean is clean in any context ... not clinically sterile, but Fender-like perhaps. And having a drummer play more quietly to match the amp's limitations is not a solution, it's a poor compromise at best. Some music requires the band to play at their regular level whilst the guitar sound is clean (as opposed to 'gritty'). Under such circumstances, a pair of 6V6s or EL84s (i.e. 15-20 watts) is simply not enough power to attain the desired results alongside an average drummer. 30-40 watts is needed for such music. If it were not so, virtually nobody would ever need more that 20 watts.

Conversely, a larger amp cannot achieve dirty tones at lower volumes, and would lead to situations either requiring the use of two amps (larger for clean, smaller for dirt) or, as started in the 1980s, attempts at multi-channel amps that could provide both. OR ... more old-school ... bigger amps with a dirt pedal up front.

However, that was then ... nowdays most guitar-wielding people don't seem to know what clean is or have any use for it, so my points are irrelevant to most, anyway. But the fact remains.

[Surgeon]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

Clean is clean in any context ... not clinically sterile, but Fender-like perhaps. And having a drummer play more quietly to match the amp's limitations is not a solution, it's a poor compromise at best. Some music requires the band to play at their regular level whilst the guitar sound is clean (as opposed to 'gritty'). Under such circumstances, a pair of 6V6s or EL84s (i.e. 15-20 watts) is simply not enough power to attain the desired results alongside an average drummer. 30-40 watts is needed for such music. If it were not so, virtually nobody would ever need more that 20 watts.

Conversely, a larger amp cannot achieve dirty tones at lower volumes, and would lead to situations either requiring the use of two amps (larger for clean, smaller for dirt) or, as started in the 1980s, attempts at multi-channel amps that could provide both. OR ... more old-school ... bigger amps with a dirt pedal up front.

However, that was then ... nowdays most guitar-wielding people don't seem to know what clean is or have any use for it, so my points are irrelevant to most, anyway. But the fact remains.

Look out your window, the damned kids are on your lawn again...

[Rex_Rocker]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

Yeah, lol. Not everybody needs pristine Fender cleans in his amp.

[Bubba Z]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

Clean is clean in any context ... not clinically sterile, but Fender-like perhaps. And having a drummer play more quietly to match the amp's limitations is not a solution, it's a poor compromise at best. Some music requires the band to play at their regular level whilst the guitar sound is clean (as opposed to 'gritty'). Under such circumstances, a pair of 6V6s or EL84s (i.e. 15-20 watts) is simply not enough power to attain the desired results alongside an average drummer. 30-40 watts is needed for such music. If it were not so, virtually nobody would ever need more that 20 watts.

Conversely, a larger amp cannot achieve dirty tones at lower volumes, and would lead to situations either requiring the use of two amps (larger for clean, smaller for dirt) or, as started in the 1980s, attempts at multi-channel amps that could provide both. OR ... more old-school ... bigger amps with a dirt pedal up front.

However, that was then ... nowdays most guitar-wielding people don't seem to know what clean is or have any use for it, so my points are irrelevant to most, anyway. But the fact remains.

I'll agree to disagree. I'll address each of your points below:

1) Clean is not the same in every context. Some styles of music (stoner/desert rock, psychedelic, blues rock, etc.) utilize "clean" tone that has grit or dirt on it, where some styles of music (jazz, funk, etc.) utilize clean tone that has no break up or grit. The context for "clean" changes from genre to genre and guitarist to guitarist.

2) Regarding the drummer playing quietly to match the guitar, I don't see it as a poor compromise at all. Rather, if I'm hitting the amp hard and it's full-on overdrive, but then I roll back the volume knob to change the direction of the song, I'd expect the drummer to bring it down a notch as well to match the flow of the song. It's part of making a fluid jam or song.

3) "If it were not so, virtually nobody would ever need more that 20 watts." Or people are just stuck in their ways and assume they need 50-100 watts. However, that trend has been changing. There have been many posts all over the internet from people who are interested in the "lunchbox" style amps, but they're concerned about whether or not a 15-watt amp could play with a drummer. That's part of what inspired my initial post, I wanted to provide an example of how a 15-watt tube amp could be heard clearly when jamming with a drummer for those who might be interested.

4) "nowdays most guitar-wielding people don't seem to know what clean is or have any use for it" Not sure what kind of music you listen to, but I hear plenty of contemporary guitarists using sparkly clean guitar tones within their songs. I personally opt for my Roland Cube 80 when I want that jazzy, no-grit type of clean. The OR15 is a fantastic amp for metal, rock, and dirty blues tones, but I don't really use it for super clean tones at low volumes, let alone high volumes.

[guitfiddle]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

What about some clean chords ?

15 watt amps will keep up with a drummer, dimed and dirty, and will be great fun to play for rawk, but there simply won't be enough headroom for clean sounds alongside a drummer.

To put it simply, high volume clean tones are not what you buy an OR15 for...something about using the right tool for the job. I have a 150 watt Music Man amp that will do perfectly clean tones at volumes that will peel the paint right off the walls. When I want that tone, I use it, and not my OR15. Ironically enough, the MM will also do a great rawk sound.

Seriously, this argument is like saying you don't like a hammer because it doesn't turn screws well.

[Bubba Z]

Re: Orange OR15 Cranked (Full Volume) with a Drummer

To put it simply, high volume clean tones are not what you buy an OR15 for...something about using the right tool for the job. I have a 150 watt Music Man amp that will do perfectly clean tones at volumes that will peel the paint right off the walls. When I want that tone, I use it, and not my OR15. Ironically enough, the MM will also do a great rawk sound.

Seriously, this argument is like saying you don't like a hammer because it doesn't turn screws well.

Agreed completely. The OR15 isn't a "clean" amp even at low gain and volume settings, let alone cranked up to 10 on every knob. I love this amp, just a complete monster.