Put New Tubes In My Marshall - WOW

[Leon Of Late]

I have a DSL40C currently that has the bright mod done on it. I currently have a 65W Creamback speaker in it, and I have a 75W Creamback for it as well. A little backstory.

I bought the amp in 2016. I had a matched pair of what I thought were NOS Sylvania EL34’s. Turns out they are Siemens EL34’s made by RFT in Germany. Anyhow, when I bought the DSL I took it and the Siemens to my tech and he tried to install them, but said they were too hot for my DSL40C and he could not bias them in. So, I had to get a different set of tubes and ended up with Groove Tubes “R” variety in a 5 hardness. I’ve never liked the GT’s. They lacked balls, definition, crunch and detail. I compensated by hitting the front end with pedals and just lived with it because I don’t play live or with a group.

I finally decided to re-tube it this winter and ordered a pair of Tung Sol EL34B’s. I took it to a new place yesterday because my old guy moved out of town due to COVID. I took the Siemens on a whim, just to ask the new guy about them. One more opinion to really make sure they wouldn’t work and I was going to sell them.

Originally the guy said leave my amp and I could pick it up Monday evening. But when I told him my old tech said the Siemens were too hot for the amp, he said “that guy sounds like he is full of crap......let’s find out right now.” So he put the Siemens in, checked them with his meter, , tweaked the bias just a bit and we fired the amp up. HOLY HELL.

What a completely different amp I am playing now. Granted, it is not and will never be my old JCM 800, but this amp sounds better than it EVER has. Full and rich, crunchy and detailed, I can hear every note ring out even with the gain up damn high....and there is very little noise. The amp is so much quieter. Even the clean channel sounds better and more detailed. Richer, more highs and a bit glassier.

To compare, we put the new Tung Sol’s in and he biased those up. They sounded pretty good too, much better than the GT’s, but no contest with the Siemens. The Tung Sol’s were brighter, considerably. They had more sizzle to the tone, and there was not the clarity and warmth you could hear with the Siemens. Compared to the old GT’s, the Tung Sol’s were still a 6.5 or 7 out of 10.....they were a vast improvement. But the Siemens just hit the nail right on the head for the sound I want to hear.

And they went into my amp with no issue, they are not “too hot” for my amp and this guy says he has no idea why the other tech would say that. He said he has been working on Marshall’s and Fenders for 35 years and this set of tubes is just fine in my amp and he agreed that they hands down sounded the best by far.

So, I’m super stoked to have my amp sounding great, and like a Marshall.....and as good as a DSL40C can sound. I am still jonesing for a Friedman Runt 50 or a Splawn Quickrod 50, but until I can afford something like that....at least I have a decent rig again.

Sorry for the long post, I am just so excited that I am able to use these $200 NOS tubes after sitting on them for nearly 10 years.

[Hsb]

Sweet, glad ya got to use and try both sets of tubes. I just swapped out the GT EL34S for Mullards, so much better, but the GTSs had been in there since the 90s, think they were tired.

[esandes]

It's good you got a second opinion with the amp techs.

now try the 75 creamback. It has the mighty H magnet.

[80's_Thrash_Metal]

If the 40 is like to 100 ,it's a pain to bias... Seems like the left and right sides are backwards.... Can be tricky.

Glad you got em in and running! New tubes are like Christmas time!

[Leon Of Late]

Sweet, glad ya got to use and try both sets of tubes. I just swapped out the GT EL34S for Mullards, so much better, but the GTSs had been in there since the 90s, think they were tired.

Yeah....this was the first time ever I was able to play my amp while the tech was right there and could make adjustments, swap tubes and also give me an unbiased (no pun intended) opinion on which set and setting sounded best. It was a great experience.

I’ve never been lucky enough to play on real Mullards, I bet they sound sweet. These NOS Siemens are as close as I have been. I also had a set of these in my 2205 when I had it years ago. I always get my NOS tubes from Mike @ KCA NOS Tubes. Great guy.

[Leon Of Late]

It's good you got a second opinion with the amp techs.

now try the 75 creamback. It has the mighty H magnet.

I’m actually glad you brought that up, as I was thinking of starting a different thread, but I’ll just ask here. What tonal differences will I get between the 65w Creamback and the 75w? Is one better for the “ Marshall” sound? Maybe you could compare each speaker to another Celestion I know, like a Greenback, V30, G12H...that sort of thing?

The tech kept saying that the 65w Creamback had really early breakup and was a bluesy speaker. I just kind of wrote that comment off a bit as he was a little older. Maybe that was wrong of me?

[Leon Of Late]

If the 40 is like to 100 ,it's a pain to bias... Seems like the left and right sides are backwards.... Can be tricky.

Glad you got em in and running! New tubes are like Christmas time!

Yeah, I know NOTHING about biasing at all. But you are exactly right about new tubes being just like Christmas. I am so excited about how these sound I can’t stand myself right now.

[esandes]

I’m actually glad you brought that up, as I was thinking of starting a different thread, but I’ll just ask here. What tonal differences will I get between the 65w Creamback and the 75w? Is one better for the “ Marshall” sound? Maybe you could compare each speaker to another Celestion I know, like a Greenback, V30, G12H...that sort of thing?

The tech kept saying that the 65w Creamback had really early breakup and was a bluesy speaker. I just kind of wrote that comment off a bit as he was a little older. Maybe that was wrong of me?

I'd say the H mag (75) is more transparent and less mushy than the M (65). The H is more mid/upper mid and tighter with less mush.

These videos are great to give you a sense:

the h just sounds clearer and more in your face to me.

here's a v30 and 75 creamback

Both have the same magnet but the 75 has way more mids. The gritty chords at 1:05 really shows the difference.

[Leon Of Late]

esandes, thank you for those videos. Now that you posted those, I remember watching that first one when I bought my Creamback 75. I liked its brighter, clearer tone with a tighter bottom end when I bought it.....the 65w was in my Marshall when I bought it. However, after the tube change the amp sounded bad, so switching back to the 65 gave me a slightly warmer, thicker tone out of what I had to work with. Over time, I completely forget about the differences between the two speakers.

The 75w is going back in tonight.

[JMP/HBE]

Tube Amplifiers 101 : yea tubes make a difference.

[esandes]

esandes, thank you for those videos. Now that you posted those, I remember watching that first one when I bought my Creamback 75. I liked its brighter, clearer tone with a tighter bottom end when I bought it.....the 65w was in my Marshall when I bought it. However, after the tube change the amp sounded bad, so switching back to the 65 gave me a slightly warmer, thicker tone out of what I had to work with. Over time, I completely forget about the differences between the two speakers.

The 75w is going back in tonight.

Let us know how it goes. I think the M mag has its merits with the lower wattage greenback brethren for blues but if you want tight, clear definition, an H mag is where it's at. I have vintage g12m UK greenbacks and they nail that Hendrix vibe which is great. The M creamback to my ears is utterly outclassed by the H creamback in every way.

[Leon Of Late]

Just a quick update. I put the Creamtone 75w speaker back in my DSL40C, and it really tops off the sound. It’s a bit louder with that speaker in, on the same settings. The highs are more detailed and the lows are tighter and crunchier. I turned my presence control down a bit, dialed in a few more mids and otherwise left my settings where they were. I really like the way this speakers voice complements what is going on with these power tubes. My amp sound as good as I think it can sound for what it is. It’s not an expensive amp, but it punches above its class now. Even my wife really notices a difference in the tone for the better.

This is the biggest difference I’ve ever heard a set of power tubes make in the sound of an amp, ever. I’ve had tube amps for close to 20 years now. My NOS pre amp tubes really shine now too. I have an RFT in V1, a Bugle Boy in V2, an RCA Blackplate in V3 and a GE Long Grey Plate in the PI slot. I need to mix up V1 and V2 to see if that makes any difference.

I bought some Tung Sol gold pin 12AX7’s and an EH Gold Pin as well. All three of those were noisy in every position but the PI slot, which was very disappointing. Those were over $25 each....so they are going back. I mean, I can’t believe how much hiss and background noise there was. At first I put all 3 new tubes in and left the GE in the PI slot. When I turned the amp on it was ok clean, but when I kicked on the drive channel, just Red 1, gain at noon, I thought the damn amp was broken. Took them all out, put the old ones back in, back to normal. Slowly rotated each new tube thru V1 and V2.....(didn’t mess with V3), and had noticible hiss on the drive channel every time and even on the clean channel with the volume past 4. I guess they were just bad tubes, but two different brands from two different stores? Good thing I ordered them on Amazon so I can return them. I won’t order tubes there again.

Anyhow, amp sounds great, I just want some different pre amp tubes to experiment with, to save my NOS batch.