Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

[Mincer]

Re: Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

Let's knock this off, ok?

[Charvel1975]

Re: Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

Wow!!! Wasn't expecting an all out war to ensue with my post!!

[Charvel1975]

Re: Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

ICTGoober, thank you very much for the information!!

[Chris Pile]

Re: Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

You are most welcome.

[Obsessive Compulsive]

Re: Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

Who cares about performance, image is everything.

Kahler is fugly, as simple as that; same reason the P rails don't sell a lot...rumor has it. I don't use Floyd other than occasional dive-bomb fooling around, but I have 6 with double locking trems (Floyds, Original Edge, Edge Zero II) cause the guitar looks a lot cooler with it.

Now for a better performance, there is the Evertune, but like Kahler it looks clunky and takes a lot of real estate, so I reckon it's not doing well in the market.

[GuitarDoc]

Re: Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

MAN - where do I begin? Your grasp of history is loose because you weren't there - so you assume (poorly).

I already had a couple years under my belt at the bench before Floyds even existed. Floyd Rose sold trems to anyone before Kramer ever made a deal with them, and they kept selling them because money was to be made. Other makers didn't want to pay for them, and since it was cheaper to develop their own - they did. There were plenty - Schecter made a great locking system when it was all in Texas, I installed several for clients. Gibson jumped on the Kahler bandwagon early, having theirs branded as Gibson. I installed the first Kahler ever put on a Les Paul in the state of Kansas before Gibson offered it the next year. And finally - Kahler is STILL in production and selling to the public and guitar makers - not just flatmount trems, but other bridges and trem parts as well.... https://www.kahlerusa.com/

Now as to quality, I can tell you the Floyd is a poor design by a guy who made jewelry (yes, Floyd Rose was a jeweler). Initially - it didn't even have fine tuners, and the locking nut used to make the strings go sharp when tightened. They fixed that, I'll grant you. The mounting studs used to be wood screws, and they had some spectacular failures over the years. The inserts and machine screws work better, but aren't perfect. The bridge lacks adjustability for individual string heights, and their production parts have very sloppy tolerances. I know because I've measured plenty of times over the years. I even took 3 of them apart and measured (my industrial training was as a tool and die maker - a super machinist), so I know what I'm doing there. Their dimensions vary widely from published factory specs. Even the German made Schaller stuff varies in production quality from unit to unit. Don't even get me started on the licensed stuff. Ibanez makes the best Floyd style trem in my opinion, but most brands have their own various problems. Finally - mounting the locknut requires routing a shelf at the thinnest portion of the neck - making it even thinner. I can't tell you the number of necks I've had to repair that cracked or broke off at the shelf. As least most of them now offer the choice of mounting via 2 small wood screws from the top, instead of drilling and counterboring for allen screws from the rear of the neck. And, if you poll guitar repairman across the country - nearly all of them hate Floyds because of the difficulties of installing, setting up, and maintaining these systems. In a Guitar Player interview Eddie was asked how he likes Floyd Roses and his answer was, "I hate them, and I don't." So the guy who made them famous had his doubts, OK?

My recommendation to my clients who want Floyds? Use them if you insist, but use locking tuners and I'll make a nut that will stay in tune.


Kahlers have proven to have much better dimensional variances, and are far more adjustable for individual tastes of the client. They are also easier to install, setup and maintain. They last longer, don't require as much wood to be routed from the guitar, and perform better in my opinion.They LOOK better, but that's just my opinion. Floyd Rose the jeweler should look to them for his next inspiration. The main difference between a Floyd and a Kahler while playing is this: On the Floyd, the string is locked at both ends and when the bar is depressed, the string length remains absolutely the same. Only the string tension changes. On a Kahler - the string length increases and lowers in tension - it does sound different because the harmonics move on the string. They don't have to on the Floyd.

Back in the late 80's I wrote a series of articles about installing and setting up stock Fender whammies, Floyds and Kahlers for String Instrument Craftsman - which was published by Guitar Player magazine at the time. It eventually was sold to the Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans which published as Guitar Maker Magazine. It was intended for professionals, but many amateurs purchased it. In his first book about guitar repair, Dan Erlewine recommended it as required for any professional luthier who worked on or built electric guitars. That's a FACT. Kahler even used my article about maintaining Kahlers for their in-house customer service technicians.

Now then, you can think whatever the hell you want - but if you're smart, you'll look this stuff up and ask around about me. Back then I did business as Six String Fever under my real name - Chris Pile. At the luthier conventions I attended back East they used to refer to me as "that heavy metal guy" because I knew WTH I was talking about. Don't doubt me.

Well, let's not get too arrogant. While I admit that many times I DO agree with things you have said, most of the time you have missed the mark, stating as "fact" what was really only your "opinion". And when called on the carpet about it, you blindly and narcissistically hold to your opinion and deny any other points of view. However, that being said, I actually agree with much of what you have just said.

[GuitarDoc]

Re: Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

Certainly "ugly" is a personal opinion. I don't have an opinion about Floyd type bridges, but I DO like the P-Rail. It's certainly unusual, but maybe that's why it appeals to me. I also really like the "Fuglybucker", a forum designed pup which is one staples type coil and one heavy rail type coil. Very different looking. However, with the right magnet and in the right guitar it can sound exceptional. Same with the P-Rails.

A comment about the LSR...
The guy who sold it to you and/or installed it should be fired for his unethical habits and should be required to refund every penny you spent. Not that the LSR isn't a really good nut, but that when you have a string lock behind the nut, it is superfluous/unnecessary at best and idiotic/stupid at worst.

[dystrust]

Re: Replacement Nut For Charvel Model 5fx

The Kahler behind-the-nut clamps suck. I've had several, and none of them would stay in tune with any sort of whammy abuse. I don't know about the LSR nut, but I tried a Tusq-XL nut on my Charvel Model 4 with Sperzel locking tuners, and that didn't stay in tune very well either. IMO the break angle behind the nut is too sharp for that to have any hope of working. IMO again, the Floyd Rose shelf suggested by Gtrjunior is the best option. It's what I did with the Model 4, and it stays in tune great now.