Aliexpress Yngwie Malmsteen Strat / Scallops

[Aceman]

That's a separate argument I see. "It's illegal so it's crap". NOT the same thing.

The place where those things start to cross over is when the quality is equal or better. At that point, you have a legitimate business problem. And saying it is illegal is not a universal truth - it's a point of view that is highly focused on your own borders.

I personally have no ethical problem purchasing one of them. If I did - it wasn't any money I was sending to Fender/Gibson. They missed nothing, and I would never sell it as a real Fender/Gibson. Might even mark it as such.

But I am purely asking / talking about the quality it is. A Squire* Yngwie....at least. Need to get a hold of real one. Or better yet, have Dave play them, because he can!


* Just for you Brandon.

[Aceman]

I love the different ways people try to rationalize support of counterfeiting.

As I love the ways people try to rationalize being lazy, riding off an idea forever, and believing that you owe them exorbitant amounts of money just because they had an idea once....

Again - no rationalizing of counterfeiting. But are we going to try to say a "sound" is IP? If Ali-buckers rock, they rock. At some point they ARE as good as Duncans, and maybe even better. And when that happens, they will brand them as such, and Duncan, DiMarzio and the rest will either have to step up to the plate and figure out how to produce the same or better quality at an equal or lesser price - or die. And China gets closer and closer every day.

Someday Ali may own both companies, and provide all Chinese parts, resulting in higher quality, lower prices, and less of a need for workers. Ask GM how that works.....

[superpete]

i don't think anyone here said otherwise.

[Mincer]

I don't think it is the case of the copies ever getting better than what they copy. Especially since the #1 priority is cheap materials and cheap labor. You 'top out' quality fairly early if that is your only concern. Companies aren't willing to pay for better materials, so all they have is design with inferior materials. They are copying the designs from another company, right down to logos and trade dress. It really isn't 'free market' until the copycat company can build something of their own.

[ehdwuld]

The Chinese Grote guitars are nice for the money
about on par with Epiphone
Got some unique offerings as well

[Aceman]

Back on topic, I think the name on headstock of a guitar should not be an outright lie.

Actually, the topic is Scalloped fingerer boards.

[Obsessive Compulsive]

I don't think it is the case of the copies ever getting better than what they copy. Especially since the #1 priority is cheap materials and cheap labor. You 'top out' quality fairly early if that is your only concern. Companies aren't willing to pay for better materials, so all they have is design with inferior materials. They are copying the designs from another company, right down to logos and trade dress. It really isn't 'free market' until the copycat company can build something of their own.

Isn't it peculiar that in the guitar world, if the company making the copy is from China, you call it 'copycat'; but if it's American like Suhr or Tom Anderson: 'Oh they make their own version of Strats that are far above Fender in terms of craftsmanship, sound, playabiilty." And guess what? People pay 3 large for those 'better Strats' or about twice the original.

[Lovegun]

I wonder if the main markets for these counterfeits are non western worlds? In the western world we have laws against these counterfeits and strict customs laws. Sure we can buy them, but I think it is not very profitable for them for the afore mentioned reasons. I think in asia there are easier markets for them to make more money.

Why are these counterfeits getting better? I think it is, because they make them in some factories where they make legal instruments and then the "night" shift makes these counterfeits. It is easy just to program the machines to exact specs and place the wood in the machine. Making them like this requires so little work by hand.

[ErikH]

Isn't it peculiar that in the guitar world, if the company making the copy is from China, you call it 'copycat'; but if it's American like Suhr or Tom Anderson: 'Oh they make their own version of Strats that are far above Fender in terms of craftsmanship, sound, playabiilty." And guess what? People pay 3 large for those 'better Strats' or about twice the original.

You miss the details. The Chinese copies are copies down to the headstock shape AND logo. They say "Gibson" on the headstock. That's a no no. The Suhr and Anderson Strats and Teles have unique headstock shapes to their brands and have "Suhr" or "Anderson" on the headstock. The reason the Chinese companies, and even those in Europe or anywhere else outside the U.S. border, can get away with making these exact copies is because the copyright laws of the headstock shape and likeness do not apply in those countries. It's very hard for U.S. makes to enforce there.

[Ascension]

Being I worked for so many years in Pawn Shops IMO every one of those guitars need to be confiscated and burned. those who import them marked as USA built Fender, Gibson and PRS guitars need to be put under the jail and every site that sells them removed from the internet. Easy way to fix this is enforce the law! have no issue with the guitars existing as a brand of their own but out right forgeries like that do huge amounts of damage in many ways. Talk to the corporate folks at Duncan on what the headaches are from the out right fraudulent forgery of Seymour Duncan products most coming from China.
This kind of stuff is SO rampant across such a wide range of items it's CRAZY!! It's the bane of existence for Pawn Shops as you see any thing from fake Rolex Watches to these to fake high end rifle scopes to almost anything you can name on a daily basis.
It needs to ALL be stopped cold and those involved put in PRISON!

[Ascension]

You miss the details. The Chinese copies are copies down to the headstock shape AND logo. They say "Gibson" on the headstock. That's a no no. The Suhr and Anderson Strats and Teles have unique headstock shapes to their brands and have "Suhr" or "Anderson" on the headstock. The reason the Chinese companies, and even those in Europe or anywhere else outside the U.S. border, can get away with making these exact copies is because the copyright laws of the headstock shape and likeness do not apply in those countries. It's very hard for U.S. makes to enforce there.

You are correct here to a point. Out right forgeries built with the intent to deceive are however illegal as HELL! Similar shapes and designs are one thing and it's up to those company's to enforce the copyright standards if they choose. Openly marked items imported marked as an official product from a legit company are a totally different thing. Most have no concept on how widespread and devastating this all is. Those who work for Duncan i guarantee know it however as do I have worked in the Pawn Shops for years.
These products are designed to deceive and steal from the legit companies period and those who bring them here are scum who need to spend years in federal PRISON!

[Mincer]

Thing is, you can't arrest people in a different country who don't live under our laws. The only way to stop this is to go after the people in this country who possess all of these items. And that opens up a whole 'nother can.

[Ascension]

I wonder if the main markets for these counterfeits are non western worlds? In the western world we have laws against these counterfeits and strict customs laws. Sure we can buy them, but I think it is not very profitable for them for the afore mentioned reasons. I think in asia there are easier markets for them to make more money.

Why are these counterfeits getting better? I think it is, because they make them in some factories where they make legal instruments and then the "night" shift makes these counterfeits. It is easy just to program the machines to exact specs and place the wood in the machine. Making them like this requires so little work by hand.

Problem is in the US the laws on the books are not being enforced. Will say once again it's not that the actual guitars exist it's that they are designed to deceive. they are branded as a product of a legit company and as such are criminal to import.Simple solution would be just brand them as what they are. if there is a copyright issue then it should be up to the copyright holder to pursue. Out right forgeries are despicable I will never own one and every one should be confiscated and burned.

[Securb]

if there is a copyright issue then it should be up to the copyright holder to pursue.

It is next to impossible to sue for copyright infringement in China. We in the software industry deal with it all the time. They won't even recognize the suit.

[Top-L]

It is next to impossible to sue for copyright infringement in China. We in the software industry deal with it all the time. They won't even recognize the suit.

If we could enforce copyrights and eliminate piracy, USA would own China outright. Thats why the US debt to china seems so wrong. They steal from us, they sell it back to us, and now we owe them REAL money!?