Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

[Dave Locher]

I run a Randall RG 100 ES. That is my distortion sound. I've never paid any attention to fuzz pedals before, but I just heard some videos on YouTube they were very intriguing. If I were to try fuzz pedal into my amp, would I get that smooth, creamy sound, or just a big heaping mess of feedback and screeching? I get the impression they are usually run into a clean amp but maybe I am wrong about that?
None of the shops in my area have a fuzz pedal in stock, and none of them have an amp that sounds anything like mine anyway. I've been going with the " Buy it, try it, and flip it if you don't like it " plan but it's getting kinda old. Before I give this one a shot, I'd at least like to have some idea what I might get.

[Dave Locher]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

I can tell from listening to clips that most seem to be running into a clean amp. I guess I am asking two questions: 1) would it sound like a fuzz at all if it were running into a crunch channel? And 2) would it just be too much gain and turn into a squealing mess?
So #1 is how might it sound, and #2 is should it even be done?

[Demanic]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

If you want to do it, run it into the clean channel or at most, the distortion channel with the gain turned way down. Otherwise, yes it will sound like a mess.

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[Demanic]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

+1

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[Chickenwings]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

Fuzzes sound great through old style non master volume amps like JTM marshalls, twin reverbs, dual showmans etc. To really get the massive tone and rich harmonic colour you need plenty of headroom. Fuzz is a world of its own and needs a completely different approach to what you might use with a high gain amp or even how you use overdrive pedals.

[devastone]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

Doesn't the RG have a clean channel?

[hydro]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

In my experience fuzz can take an overdrive (i.e. tubescreamer) in front of it, if the overdrive is low; and that can focus the fuzz tone and remove some flabbiness. But fuzz into a dirt channel will unleash the unholy. Unless that's what you are after...

Also look at the bass muff type fuzzes, in my opinion they are better behaved; less feedback and keep more lows/low mids.

[Demanic]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

Everybody thinks that they want to unleash the unholy.
Very few can actually make use of the consequences.

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[Gainstage]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

I think any pedal designer/maker will say that uber gain dist pedals and fuzz were meant for a clean channel. Adding that to an already distorted amp results in distortion mush that could not reasonably be called musical. Overdrives are for gained amps and pushing a cleaner amp on the edge of breakup. Overdrives will tighten up and add some articulation to high gain amps allowing you to back off some on the amp gain and make use of the overdrive to increase the gain level which by anyone with decent ears will sound better and is justifiably used in studio recordings of high gain amps.
Fuzz can be EQ'd to taste and there are a million of them with various intensity and clipping factors. If your gain level is so intense that you cannot even discern a note that amounts to pretty much noise and something used to hide poor playing. I like high gains at times as they are just a blast to play but I need to hear the note definition and articulation which for me results in a better pedal like the Palladium. Fuzz is highly variant in intensity and overall structure it usually gets so fuzzed out one cannot do but maybe two string simple chords usually single note lead stuff.
Fuzz can range from smooth, to a sputtering raspy buzz saw. Depends on what you like, but into a gained up amp, I say a big no.
So you have three basic types of gain:
Amp Gain (options of various overdrive or clean boost)
Pedal Dist gain using a cleaner channel (options of various overdrive or clean boost)
Fuzz pedal gain using a cleaner channel, usually a fuzz is so intense you would not want to hit the front of it with anything but after it has some options, many like an EQ to shape it.
Some like compressor pedals but when using high gain the overall gain structure already has a compressive nature. I would also say running a fuzz into a distortion pedal is also like a gained up amp, I suppose there has to be someone out there that would like such a thing, but it is a real cringe tone for my ears.

[PFDarkside]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

Fuzzes sound great through old style non master volume amps like JTM marshalls, twin reverbs, dual showmans etc. To really get the massive tone and rich harmonic colour you need plenty of headroom. Fuzz is a world of its own and needs a completely different approach to what you might use with a high gain amp or even how you use overdrive pedals.

I agree with Gibson here.

There are many pedals called "fuzz", but other than an intense square clipping of the signal, they don't have much else in common. The two "classic" fuzz types that many refer to are the Fuzz Face/Tone Bender styles and the Big Muff style.

Big Muff: nearly always needs to be run into a clean amp. The amp's natural EQ profile should compliment the EQ of the specific muff. The classic Muff tone stack is a huge mid scoop, and it needs a pretty mid heavy amp EQ to sound good. Otherwise you risk having no mids and harsh treble. A ridiculous amount of "boutique" fuzzes are now based on the Russian Muff (bigger bass than the original) that they modify for more midrange allowing a wider range of natural amp EQs to work with them.

Fuzz Face: Nearly always works better with an amp that is at least compressing, if not distorting. (Now I don't mean 5150 or ENGL distorting, I mean a light Plexi crunch distorting). The nature of these fuzz pedals is that they generate a lot of high harmonics due to the square clipping. The compressing, rolled off tone of a breaking up tube amp compliments and limits these harsh harmonics and you get the classic smooth yet raspy fuzz tone we know and love.

As others have mentioned, an overdrive can be a secret weapon when dealing with fuzz, especially if your amp is not the ideal candidate for a fuzz. The classic overdrive circuit:
-rolls off bass
-adds midrange
-rolls of treble (if desired)
-adds soft clipping

By pairing an OD with a Muff, you can fill out those midrange frequencies that missing. By pairing an OD with a Fuzz Face you can smooth out the harsh high harmonics and reduce the bass of a germanium fuzz face. Try different ODs before and after the various fuzz pedals to see what works best with your guitar/pickups and amp. Also remember to back off the volume on your guitar with Fuzz Face and Tonebender type circuits. That can function as an awesome overdrive type tone as well!

This is coming from a "classic rock" type view of fuzz. When you get into alternative and modern rock styles, the rules go completely out the window, and ANYTHING goes!

Finally, remember that fuzz is a nasty effect. It's supposed to be uncontrollable and wild. A Tube Screamer into a Blackface is a very polite, neat and controlled sound. Fuzz needs experimenting to get the most out of it. Have fun on your journey!

[Darg1911]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

Brian Wampler

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imUQE2ZWk1g

[Dave Locher]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

Doesn't the RG have a clean channel?

Technically yes, but not really. One channel goes from sort-of clean to crunchy, the other goes from snotty to highish gain. But they are voiced very differently so that switching on stage with the giant switch box doesn't work well. I just run both channels all the time, with the cleaner channel a bit quieter. It adds fullness and low end to the brighter dirty channel.
I could run the amp clean and use pedals for dirt but have never found one that sounds as good to me as the amp's own gain.

[ThisDyingSoul76]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

Many legendary players put fuzzes through overdriven amps. Some like them in clean amps. One thing I've found is certain pedals sound better with certain amps. For example, a big muff through a really clean Fender Twin might sound harsh but sound huge through a Marshall at the edge of breakup. (I use the clean fender vs crunchy Marshall based on the fact most Marshall amps break up fairly early).

[Silence Kid]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

Some fuzz pedals like distortion or stack with other pedals well, others do not...

For fun I've been messing around with Devi Ever pedals; some stack quite nicely and are available paired for that purpose. Others sound like ass (and are still available paired )

[Progbusters]

Re: Amp distortion + fuzz pedal = ?? (Not clear on fuzz use)

clean channel with single coils