I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

[B2D]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

I read a bit of whatsisface's post history - so much on there about how most people cannot appreciate X if they have a cheap Y, or how "this sound is more evolved than this", or about how Boss pedals are doorstops, refining this and that.

I love a good filet mignon with bleu cheese and bacon, but I like an In'n'Out hamburger every now and then, too.

Play with your ears and fingers, not your eyes. If it sounds good to you, enjoy, if not, move on.

I've been in the music gear game for a bit now, both professionally and casually, and 95% of those cork-sniffier types can't play their way out of a paper bag and their sounds are aggressively average. The other 4% sound and play pretty well and maybe 1% of those guys are gigging and a fraction of that are making money.

I've never met a professional musician (as in, they pay all of their bills with $$ generated from mad geetar skizazzles) who was a brand snob. They have preferences, yes, but they know what works for THEM and they don't worry too much about other people.

[PFDarkside]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

^Lots of those "boutique" guys would have nothing to clone if it where not for Boss and Maxon

And EHX! Although they are playing the clone game too now.

[Darg1911]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

Lots of those dirt cheap pedal companies would have nothing to clone if it wasn't for the boutique companies offering tweaks based on the circuits of Boss and Maxon ...

[devastone]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

And most of them starting out by modding the lowly DS-1, SD-1, or one of the TS variations.

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

^Lots of those "boutique" guys would have nothing to clone if it where not for Boss and Maxon

[devastone]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

If we are judging by price, then TC, MXR, etc... pedals are "bargain" also. I don't consider Boss or TC and "cheap" pedals, I consider the MIC clones that you can pick up for $30 a pop as "cheap" pedals.

Look up pedal boards and pedal drawers in racks of the pros, you'll see plenty of Boss pedals on them. I love John 5's tone and he uses 3 or 4 Boss pedals an that's it, maybe he spends too much time playing to shop for pedals A lot of the music you grew up listening to, especially if you are into 80s and 90s hard rock, was probably a Boss pedal into a Marshall amp (Vai, Lynch, Satriani, Wylde, etc...). In fact the DS-1 and SD-1 were probably some of the most used pedals, and variations of them still are.

Besides, if it wasn't for Boss, there might not be as many choices out there today.

[crusty philtrum]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

Most of the time the trouble is......that people are way to serious about it all, and put too much emphasis on gear.
Plus I am also curious about how much of todays socalled highend stuff, that still works in 30 years

Yup, yup, yup and yup.

The listener can't hear the difference between pickup choices, pedal choices, amp choices most of the time. Making the big-money jump from acceptable to boutique is mostly about making the player happy, and if the player is happy, they'll play better, and that is a difference a listener can hear. Some players are perfectly happy with lower-cost stuff, or are in situations where their budget is very limited, but they are happy with what they are able to cobble together, and they play well because they are happy with how they sound.

Sadly, many or most people wielding electric guitars don't give a poop about the listener, they think it's all about them.

Very few of these people ever mention listeners or songs, and many call themselves 'musicians' but can't even read or write the language of their professed vocation.

Most music stores stock lower-level (i.e. less-costly) equipment because that's what they sell the most ... student and intermediate-level stuff. For every Fender Stratocaster sold on the planet, there are probably ten copies of varying quality sold. For every boutique pedal sold, there are probably ten Boss pedals sold. That's the market, whether you like it or not. There are occasionally 'high-end' specialist outlets, and if you want to be surrounded by that level of gear, you will need to seek out such places.

That's simply the reality of music retail and the music world in general. Bashing these facts simply because you can afford better helps no-one, although it can tend to diminish the standing of the fool who utters such things in the first place.

Although this is a gear forum, gear is not the be-all and end-all, it's only the start. Neither is the electric guitar or the player the focal point in music. It's the music itself, and that may well not be all about you.

For all the thousands of players with high-end gear and that level of attitude, not a great deal of them are out there making good music or providing anything of value to an audience. I get the feeling that most of them hang around forums playing the one-upmanship games, hoping to be revered in some way.

The way to get noticed or be successful is to play well and make good music. (And by 'play well', I mean playing appropriately for the task at hand). From what I've heard, some peoples' boutique budget could be better spent on music lessons.

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

Most of the time the trouble is......that people are way to serious about it all, and put too much emphasis on gear.
Plus I am also curious about how much of todays socalled highend stuff, that still works in 30 years

[ArtieToo]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

^ +10 (to Bloodrose)

. . . and a less expensive brand may be the grail to them.

Why the heck did I ever sell that little $10 Arion Tubulator? That sucker rocked!

[BriGuy1968]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

I have to admit it... I really like to buy things cheap. Money is usually pretty tight in the BriGuy household as my income is the only one for a family of seven, and it isn't a particularly high income at that. It basically means that more expensive/better gear is simply out of reach most of the time, but that doesn't mean I can't find my sound (which is a constant work-in-progress)... it just means that I have to be very cautious about what I buy because if it doesn't work for me I don't have the means to just go out and try another one.

All that being said, I think there's also a lot of reverse gear-snobbery that goes on... people who view others who love their high-end gear as stupid because "I can make my cheap gear sound as good as their expensive junk."

I bought a $99 Epiphone Les Paul Special I P-90 a few months back. It really plays and sounds pretty good, and it's a fun little guitar, but I don't hold onto any illusions of it being comparable to a $2000+ Gibson Les Paul!

I guess my point is that we all have our desires for different types of gear, and we all have our obstacles that keep us from said gear in varying degrees. It's really best just to be happy for anyone who finds that something-special addition to his/her arsenal... no matter what the cost and no matter if it's our own cup of tea!


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[BloodRose]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

I don't bash other people's gear and choices. A) I try to be positive and try to live by the credo that if you don't have something nice or constructive to say, dont say anything... B) Also, and more importantly, I understand that for some people, either due to budget restraints and also choice restrictions (since we have people here from all over the world) may not be able to get the boutique brand stuff and a less expensive brand may be the grail to them. Also, as said, all companies are capable of making good stuff or else they wont stay in biz long, so someone may find "their tone" or joy with a certain brand. So, kudos to them.. I often have to go to the net to find many things as we dont have many, if any local shops and even my closest GC only stocks lower end stuff as that is what the local market dictates..

That, and as someone who is still chasing "my" sound, Im genuinely happy for folks that find theirs, especially if they can do it without breaking the bank! Ive tried different brands of pedals. Some brands have the tone I find useful for X sound and some don't. Doesnt mean the brand stinks.. Just X pedal didnt meet my needs.

[dystrust]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

They're older and MIJ, but currently I have a CE-2, DD-2, and long chip DD-3 on my board. I've owned a bunch of chorus pedals over the years, and none of them sound as good as this CE-2. I've also tried a bunch of delay pedals, and these are my favorite. They're technically digital, but the converters are awful by today's standards, so they have a lo-fi, almost analog sound. My favorite "feature" is that this roll-off only occurs once, unlike the repeats fading into murk like they do with real analog delays. They also offer 800ms of delay time which is plenty as I have the DD-2 set for maybe 150ms and the DD-3 for about 400ms. I don't like every pedal Boss makes, but they make decent and very usable ones with plenty of gems here and there.

[NjuiMusic]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

I agree with this lol, my favorite tone is a Fortin Modded Marshall plexi and I have a plexi but kept getting people saying that I shouldn't mod it even though that's the tone I want and I bought a $3k (CAD) amp just to have a $1200 (CAD) mod done to it

[Mincer]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

I get it, but it is a good thing there are choices. I ain't carrying a 1x12, 2x12, or 4x12 to any gigs anymore. Yes, they sound great, but they just don't work for me. I embrace cheap as well as expensive pedals, but you have to have the money to buy things, try them out at home in your rig, and then be able to return them if they don't work. Music stores carry what sells to people who come in, and they generally know their customers well.

That being said, at least 2 of your favorites above have moved on to Fractal (modeling) for their effects while on tour.

[Shooter.556]

Re: I have a few words about brands and people who judge them.

Every company makes good stuff and every company makes crap from time to time.. I don't judge entire brands..
Effects are probably the most cutthroat market share in the music industry. Everyone builds pedals, especially dirt pedals.
I buy things of all brands all the time and if I don't like em, I sell em and I am honest about it. Just because I didn't like it doesn't mean someone else wont love it.
Boss was the first thing I ever owned and back in the day, Boss was high end stuff in the 80s and 90s..
I have graduated onto higher end things but Boss makes good pedals that sit in the mix well for not a lot of money.
I modded a DS1 and an OD1 with Monte Allums kits that ended up on recordings in Nashville the producer liked them so much.
Boss with a $20-$30 kit and some soldering time will hold it's own with anything boutique and tone snobbery..