Output comparison: DiMarzio Super D in parallel vs. Gibson Deluxe MiniHB in series

[Aceman]

Re: Output comparison: DiMarzio Super D in parallel vs. Gibson Deluxe MiniHB in serie

No way. A SupeD in parallel is gonna be about single coil output. Mini HB is gonna be a 59 at least....

[idsnowdog]

Re: Output comparison: DiMarzio Super D in parallel vs. Gibson Deluxe MiniHB in serie

Gibson and GFS are the only Deluxe style mini's that I have tried. I received the GFS second hand and it had been direct-mounted in the bridge of a barncaster. It sounded OK in that role. I tried to use it in the neck of a Tele with a Rosewood fretboard and it was too dark. The brass baseplate probably wasn't a negative with this pickup since minis tend to be bright and raspy sounding. Brass baseplates round off the treble and thicken the midrange and bass. However, the cheap brass cover was a negative.

[freefrog]

Re: Output comparison: DiMarzio Super D in parallel vs. Gibson Deluxe MiniHB in serie

I'll RE check ASAP how a P90 sized Super D wired in parallel sounds comparatively to a mini-hum. Not easy since I'm busy.

In the meantime, let's share a few theoretical things (I write fast and the working day has not started yet so let's do it).

A P90 sized DiMarzio Super D has practically the same resistance and inductance than a full sized one. It has the double thick ceramic mag. It has the brass BP. The only difference is in the smaller bobbins, closer to each others, with a different "coupling" factor affecting slightly the upper harmonics. It's a wee bit weaker too, because of the narrower magnetic windows, but height settings should cure that easily.

In series, it would measure something like 13k and 6.5H to 7H (out of my head, from memories).

In parallel, it should measure +/- 3.25k and an inductance of 1.75H.

In split mode, it would deliver +/- 6.5k & 3.5H.


A Gibson mini-hum measures around 6.5k or 7k and 3.2H (if memory serves me).

A Tele bridge PU would typically exhibits 6k to 10k (depending on the AWG used) and 2.5H to 4H. Let's say 3.2H for average inductance: it's the same than a mini-hum and it explains partly why a mini-hum can appear as "Tele sounding".


What these observations suggest:

-IMHO, there's no need to route a guitar for a full sized Super D when a P90 sized one would do the same job @ 95%.

-If the target is the resistance and inductance of a mini-hum and/or of a Tele bridge SC, the Super D will have to be split: @ 6.5k and 3.5 H, it should mimic a large part of their voicing.

-The Super D in parallel would have a higher pitched resonant peak, giving a thinner tone. It wouldn't necessarily be that weaker thx to its double thick mag...

As usual, the value of all these numbers is RELATIVE: the tone of each PU and mode will depend on the host guitar and on its wiring/pots.

FOOTNOTE - everybody knows that I love useless footnotes that nobody reads nor understands :-))

I've here some TV Jones classic measuring +/- 4k and a tiny 1.6H to 1.9H. They SHOULD sound weak with such a low inductance...
But they have double thick mags and big mag poles, just like a Super D (and I think that Larry found the Super D original recipe in the architecture of Filter'Tron's, anyway).
When I put a bridge TV Jones Classic in parallel with a 3.3nF capacitor to ground, it sounds almost as loud as a regular P.A.F. replica... and the cap "tunes" the voicing in a convincing P.A.F. way.
So, if a Super D in parallel seems too trebly, a workable solution might be to put a small value cap in parallel with it. :-)

FWIW. See ya!

[Dave Locher]

Re: Output comparison: DiMarzio Super D in parallel vs. Gibson Deluxe MiniHB in serie

Got it - you want to install the Super D that fits the guitar route, along with series/parallel switching?

It is definitely worth a try. Super D in parallel is pretty twangy Tele sounding to my ears. And in series it is definitely not thin or weak. I actually prefer the split sound so maybe try that if parallel doesn't do it for you.

[dr.barlo]

Re: Output comparison: DiMarzio Super D in parallel vs. Gibson Deluxe MiniHB in serie

Vow thanks!

I did not know the Mojo's and GFS'.

I was talking about the Super D soapbar. Nowadays, the search of the forum is weird and not working. But anyways, I could fish out the following thread:

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/showthread.php?274170-The-anatomy-of-1976-Gibson-Deluxe-mini-HBs

Haussel makes some pricey PAF clones to go into Deluxes. Duncan Custom shop also offers HBs to go under a p90 cover and into a p90 route. TV Jones is another alternative but... It's TV Jones... I've used a Rio Grande BBQ and Texas for a while like 15 years ago. At first I've liked them, but then than "texas sizzle" whatever... got to my nerves you know. I've started hating that excessive uppermid push. This guitar has a maple neck, so this uppermid thing could be really pronounced on this guitar. So I don't wanna go Rio Grander because of that.

I wanna keep the current tone of this guitar (already have an ant II neck mini deluxe - love the stock neck so I am not sure if I'll get to use it in this guitar). But "add" the HB mode you know. So inherently I am a bit worried about the Super D.

Any feedback on that?

Thanks in advance!

B

[idsnowdog]

Re: Output comparison: DiMarzio Super D in parallel vs. Gibson Deluxe MiniHB in serie

I wouldn't route it for a full size humbucker because that would ruin its value. The problem with the Deluxe style mini-humbucker is that it's not built like most other pickups. The bridge coil has screws while the neck side coil has a large metal blade with a bottom mounted magnet between the coils. Firebird pickups are built entirely different and have their own tone compared to the Deluxe. The Dimarzio soapbar style humbuckers also have very different construction. Dimarzio now has Deluxe style pickups but I haven't heard any of them. Mojotone has a Deluxe mini with 11K and an alnico 8. GFS does make Deluxe style minis and I have one that's 9.2K but it has a brass baseplate and brass cover which alters the sound. I have thought about putting a silver steel baseplate and cover on it but I don't have a use for that pickup and I'm not sure it would be much of an upgrade? Basically the problem is once you start substituting different ingredients you end up with something very different.

https://www.seymourduncan.com/products/pickups/electric/offset-other

https://www.dimarzio.com/pickups/soap-bar

https://www.dimarzio.com/pickups/mini

https://www.mojotone.com/HumbuckerPickups_x#/

https://www.riograndepickups.com/mini-humbuckings

https://www.guitarfetish.com/Gibson-P90-Soapbar-Style-Mini-Humbuckers_c_237.html

[dr.barlo]

Hi all,

About the same? I know that if it were to be an a5 PAF kinda pickup, the parallel mode would be quite weak. I don't want that. I know (thanks to freefrog) in terms of the clarity, SD in parallel would be quite good.

You see, my problem is the following guitar (76 deluxe with stock pickups):



I love it's bridge tone (stock pickups measuring 6.15K). It can do the tele kinda tones such as



and real LP tones



I don't wanna lose the clean bridge, tele kinda tones. So if I go for the DiMarzio SD... I am afraid the output may suffer when clean.

Or... I will have to go to custom shop asking for a tapped Deluxe kinda mini HB that can do both... But that's pricey.

Dilemmas!!!

B