Split bucker and single coil polarity

[Stratoplayer]

Ok, I know this question was asked, but I don't remember ever seeing an answer, so someone please tell me if you know... in a HSH guitar, if you use the single coil and a SPLIT humbucker at the same time, does the single coil have to be RW/RP or not?

[Sykes]

Re: Split bucker and single coil polarity

does the single coil have to be RW/RP or not?

I doesn't HAVE to have it. What RW/RP does is hook those pickups in a humbucking mode. But there's a trade off here. Humbucking cancels "hum", but also cancels some crispness. Just depends what you're into.

[Stratoplayer]

Re: Split bucker and single coil polarity

I doesn't HAVE to have it. What RW/RP does is hook those pickups in a humbucking mode. But there's a trade off here. Humbucking cancels "hum", but also cancels some crispness.

Ok cool, thanks Sykes, I just didn't know if it had to be RW/RP to cancel the hum or not. I have heard from plenty of people that the hum, unfortunate as it is, adds to the overall tonal quality. I'm sure I'll just get a normally wound pup, NOTHING can hum as much as a Squier!

[wasteofo2]

Re: Split bucker and single coil polarity

Having 2 pickups that are reverse wound to cancel hum doesn't alter the tonality at all, it's when they have an opposing polarity that the tone changes.

When you have 2 pickups wound in the same direction and wired together, the ambient noise signals are oriented the same way. When you have 2 pickups wound in opposing directions, the ambient noise signals oppose each other and cancel each other out (or at least diminish each other).

When you have 2 pickups with the same polarity and wired together, the signal from the guitar's strings are oriented the same way, and the signal is louder and fuller (something you don't want with hum, but might want with our string's sound). When you have 2 pickups wired together with opposing polarities, the signals "fight" each other, and becomes weaker, loosing alot of low end.

Look at it this way:

2 In phase signals:

\\
//
\\
//
\\
//
\\
//

Signals don't conflict each other, signal is strong, bad for hum, subjective for tone.

2 out of phase signals:

/\
\/
/\
\/
/\
\/
/\
\/

Signals conflict each other, signal is weak, good for hum, subjective for tone.

[Fresh_Start]

Re: Split bucker and single coil polarity

Back to the basic question - if you split a Seymour Duncan humbucker the "normal" way by grounding the red/white connection, it leaves the slug coil hot. Wired normally (again), the slug coil is effectively RW/RP so you would want a standard single coil in the middle to get humcancelling.

I'm not sure what WasteofO2 was trying to get at (don't want to be rude, just trying to help). If you have 2 coils that have the same magnetic polarity but you reverse the electrical polarity (i.e. winding direction), they will be "out of phase". It has a radical effect on tone.

If you have 2 coils, one "normal" and one RW/RP, the tone will be identical to 2 normal coils except that the 60 cycle hum is cancelled out. I don't understand the electronics theory, but have messed around with single coils & split humbuckers & deliberately putting 2 pickups out of phase enough to be sure of this.

Chip

[Kent S.]

Re: Split bucker and single coil polarity

Ok, I know this question was asked, but I don't remember ever seeing an answer, so someone please tell me if you know... in a HSH guitar, if you use the single coil and a SPLIT humbucker at the same time, does the single coil have to be RW/RP or not?

It all just depends on if the other coil has an opposite magnetic polarity ... if one coil is north and the other is south, then a hum cancelling effect can be obtained by inverting the signal's phase of one coil (or if one coil happens to be wound in reverse direction from the other one, then it's phase is reversed to begin with). Simply put, unless each coil has an opposite magnetic polarity you can't get the humcancelling effect ... Phase can be compensated for electrically, magneitc polarity can not ... depends what manufacturer decides to stick where and when, as far as what polarity any given coil has on any given pup (HB), and the polarity of the single coil involved.

[wasteofo2]

Re: Split bucker and single coil polarity

I'm not sure what WasteofO2 was trying to get at (don't want to be rude, just trying to help). If you have 2 coils that have the same magnetic polarity but you reverse the electrical polarity (i.e. winding direction), they will be "out of phase". It has a radical effect on tone.
p

I was bassically just trying to educate him about polarity stuff, showing that elimination of hum doesn't have to affect your tone.

[Fresh_Start]

Re: Split bucker and single coil polarity

Here's a StewMac page on pickups http://www.stewmac.com/cgi-bin/hazel...eeinfo/fi.html If you scroll down to the bottom, there's a chart that shows what combinations of magnetic polarity and winding work - either humcancelling or not.

Chip

[Kent S.]

Re: Split bucker and single coil polarity

Here's a StewMac page on pickups http://www.stewmac.com/cgi-bin/hazel...eeinfo/fi.html If you scroll down to the bottom, there's a chart that shows what combinations of magnetic polarity and winding work - either humcancelling or not.

Chip

Edited .... Never mind ... I wrote something here, then thought about it, then drew it out on paper ... Like I said ... never mind what I wrote if anyone read it before this edit, I just had a bone headed moment over the issue of getting hum-cancelling while out of phase.