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Wiring for a 2-way toggle Mod [series/parallel] into HSH +1-vol/1-tone/5-way blade?

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  • Mincer
    replied
    RW/RP isn't really for an out of phase sound- it is for hum cancelling with a non-RW/RP single coil pickup.

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  • Deim0s
    replied
    Thanks for clarifying Mincer,

    It does make sense to use the middle pickup for an out-of-phase mod, but I was wondering if it's relevant to consider than the SSL-5 is RwRp (Reverse winding, Reverse Polarity) when using it to get an out-of-phase sound and just for wiring in general.

    Also, the wiring diagram I'm going to use has an extra 2-way switch for the bridge pickup being active at any time, so if I had the N+B pickups active (on position 1 + bridge switch active) I couldn't have them out of phase, right?. That's why I was thinking of using a phase switch for both humbuckers. Maybe it would be better to have the middle and bridge pickups being able to change their phase.

    I'm mostly interested in experimenting with the out-of-phase sound for Brian May's sound in some solos and maybe funk guitar rhythm.

    For the bridge pickup I mostly want easy pinch harmonics and less mids (for a more "aggressive" sound), so I guess I could swap it for an Alnico 5, but would it be better than its current ceramic magnet?

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  • Mincer
    replied
    Swapping the magnet on a Custom with an A5 gets you a Custom 5 (less mids, tight bass and treble) or swap with an A2 gets you a Custom Custom, which has a lot of mids, less bass and treble (a really great sound, too).
    As far as phase switching, you'd only need 1 switch on 1 pickup, usually just the middle, so when used in combo with another in-phase pickup, you get the thin & hollow out-of-phase sound. I'd use it on the middle pickup if anything, but it isn't a popular sound. Worth trying, though, if you are curious.
    A pickup is out of phase with other pickups, not with itself.

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  • Deim0s
    replied
    Thanks Mincer! I'm really excited about this project, and I'm really happy with the improvement so far. By the way, I took some pictures of the pickup installation and cleaning of the guitar, so I wanted to share them here. The SSL-5 really packs a punch, I didn't expect a single coil to be so loud, but to me it sounds really good mixed with the other two pickups. All the 5 positions in the switch are strikingly different from eachother, for example, it was interesting to me that the 4th position (neck split + single coil) gives a really "acoustic" sound, it almost sounds like a piezo but with less attack on the strings. The Jazz model does have a some noise and I'm not sure where is coming from. I'm hoping it goes away when I use new parts for the wiring. Also, I hope the copper shielding will help a bit with the SSL-5 noise too.

    I was thinking of using two push-pull pots (vol and tone), could it be possible to use each for the humbuckers so they both could be out of phase with the rest? Or maybe I'm just confused on how phase switching works. Would it make any difference using two push-pulls? Or one would be enough? Also, Should the output of the pickups go first into the series/split/parallel switch and then into the push/pull phase switching?

    One last thing I wanted to ask Mincer, when you mentioned swapping out the TB-5 magnet on a previous post, did you mean changing the ceramic magnet for an alnico V? What would that do to the sound of the pickup?
    Attached Files

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  • Mincer
    replied
    Congrats on the most excellent looking guitar! As far as phase switching goes, are you looking for one of the humbuckers to have a phase switch? That could be in a push-pull before the pickup goes to the 5 way switch. You could then have it in phase or out of phase with any of the 2 other pickups. As far as the noise, did you end up with the SSL-5? That pickup will certainly hum, being a single coil pickup. It is a loud single coil pickup, so the hum would be louder. The Jazz, however, should be as quiet as the other humbucker.

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  • Deim0s
    replied
    Hello again, everyone!
    I wanted to post here again to update on this project for anyone interested.

    Today I finally got delivered the last item (copper tape) i was missing to start modding my guitar, but since this is my first time doing soldering and also because I couldn't wait to try them I've already installed the pickups on the guitar, so I could practice some more soldering before installing the new pieces and try out the sound of the pickups. I also did some very needed cleaning.

    Here's a picture of how it's looking now:
    Click image for larger version  Name:	WhatsApp Image 2020-09-24 at 11.11.20 (8).jpeg Views:	0 Size:	38.4 KB ID:	6018982
    The sound of the pickups is just amazing, really bright, clear and crisp. I was pretty amazed at how much of a difference it made from the stock pickups, it really feels like a different guitar. Also the difference in output was another thing that inmediately caught my attention, I used to simply lose sound at below 30% of the volume before.

    I really loved the sound, though the neck and middle pickups have some buzz even when slightly distorted, but the bridge pickup doesn't have any. I first thought that since I'm still learning how to solder properly, it could've been that the ground solder into the volume pot for the new pickups wasn't that good, so I redid the soldering, but the noise was still there. I also tried lowering the pickup height but the sound started losing too much sustain before there was a noticeable change in the buzz.

    So now I'm thinking that since these pickups have higher output than the old ones, maybe the old electronics can't handle them or they pick more interference from wifi or cellphone signals here in my apartment. I hope the copper shielding will solve it.

    Also, for anyone interested, those old Headhunter Seymour Duncans had 3 wires (black, red and yellow) and I couldn't find that color code anywhere, it took me a while but I figured out that red was north and south finish (red and white), yellow was the hot output (black) and black was ground (green and bare) in the current 5-wire color code.

    I was also wondering if anyone could help me figure out how to do phase switching for the humbuckers with push/pull pots. I was thinking of somehow adding that into the previous wiring diagram I posted.
    Last edited by Deim0s; 09-24-2020, 07:36 PM.

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  • GuitarDoc
    replied
    I would personally choose the SSL-5 over the L59.

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  • Deim0s
    replied
    Originally posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    Nothing wrong with the Neutrik jack. Yes you can always wire up the p/p portion of the pot later if you want (it functions as a DPDT switch). You could use a .033uf cap but my choice would be .022uf.
    The Lil 59 in the middle position should be fine. You don't need to be concerned about the voltages. It's only important if you plan on using them in high voltage situations...a guitar is not. For wire, I use 24 ga stranded pre-tinned with silicone insulation. It's very easy to work with (way easier than wire with pvc type insulation). But any stranded wire 20-28 ga will be fine.
    Like this:
    https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07JB5G82W...v_ov_lig_dp_it
    Thank you so much GuitarDoc! That was really helpful. I will search through the Mouser catalog to find some good wires. I'll get both a .033uf and a 0.022uf capacitor to try them and see which delivers better tone range.

    Another thing... they're still preparing the pickup order in the store and I realized they have an SSL-5 Custom Staggered RwRp. Would it be better than the L59? I believe it would be way more versatile to have a true single coil, but I'm not sure that the RwRp configuration will work with humbuckers? I know it does with other single coils.

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  • GuitarDoc
    replied
    Nothing wrong with the Neutrik jack. Yes you can always wire up the p/p portion of the pot later if you want (it functions as a DPDT switch). You could use a .033uf cap but my choice would be .022uf.
    The Lil 59 in the middle position should be fine. You don't need to be concerned about the voltages. It's only important if you plan on using them in high voltage situations...a guitar is not. For wire, I use 24 ga stranded pre-tinned with silicone insulation. It's very easy to work with (way easier than wire with pvc type insulation). But any stranded wire 20-28 ga will be fine.
    Like this:
    https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07JB5G82W...v_ov_lig_dp_it

    Leave a comment:


  • Deim0s
    replied
    Thank you Mincer! I'm gonna buy the TB-5 Duncan Custom then, I'm assuming the sustain and harmonics part is covered.

    I'm really having trouble picking the correct pieces from the Mouser store. I'm thinking about changing all the electronic parts, and I have so many questions about them that I'm just gonna list the electronic parts I chose so far and hope somebody will tell me if I messed up (please )

    DPDT ON-ON-ON Switch: https://www.mouser.cl/ProductDetail/...JSRC79EQ%3D%3D

    Potentiometers (I chose Push/Pull to experiment with Phase switch in the future, I guess they can be wired as a normal potentiometer?): https://www.mouser.cl/ProductDetail/...h16LTryQ%3D%3D

    DPDT ON-ON Switch: https://www.mouser.cl/ProductDetail/...rk%252Bw%3D%3D

    Output Jack (2 options): 1.- https://www.mouser.cl/ProductDetail/...S%252B4A%3D%3D 2.- https://www.mouser.cl/ProductDetail/...lTuIE4TA%3D%3D

    And I'm not sure which wires and capacitor to buy, the latter was recommended as 0.033 uF from the creator of the wiring diagram I posted, but there are several options at that capacitance with different voltage ratings. The wires also have different voltage ratings, gauge and stranding so I don't know if there's a "standard" for guitar wiring components.

    I'm very interested in learning all this stuff but I'm not sure where to start. I really want to make the most out of the sound my old guitar can make, while learning useful and interesting "hands-on" knowledge. I'm trying to make the most out of "social distancing" by learning, so if anyone knows good study material for electronics I would greatly appreciate it
    Last edited by Deim0s; 07-31-2020, 07:39 PM.

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  • Mincer
    replied
    Originally posted by Deim0s View Post

    I could try that. Though I don't know how complicated it is, I might need some help or references on how to do it. Also, for the bridge pickup I really want good sustain and easy pinch harmonics. Would this still be good for it?
    Magnet swapping is not hard....even I can do it! There are a ton of threads on this forum about it. Here is one.

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  • Deim0s
    replied
    Originally posted by Mincer View Post
    An option is to get the Custom and swap the magnet out.
    I could try that. Though I don't know how complicated it is, I might need some help or references on how to do it. Also, for the bridge pickup I really want good sustain and easy pinch harmonics. Would this still be good for it?
    Last edited by Deim0s; 07-30-2020, 07:04 PM.

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  • Mincer
    replied
    The Full Shred is brighter with less bass than the Custom 5. An option is to get the Custom and swap the magnet out.

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  • Deim0s
    replied
    I was just told in the store that they didn't have the Custom 5 in stock... They do have the TB-5 Custom. What aboud a TB-10 Full Shred? It's medium gain, would it be better than the TB-5 / JB / Distortion?
    Last edited by Deim0s; 07-30-2020, 04:11 PM.

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  • Deim0s
    replied
    Originally posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    First of all: you want bright and versatile...the Distortion is neither.
    You want a SC in the middle and bright...the Lil 59 is neither.
    The 59 does also come in a 4 conductor version.
    You have the switch positions backwards...pos 1 is bridge and pos 5 is neck.

    For neck: Jazz is a good choice
    For middle: Mincer gave a good suggestion.
    For bridge: a C/59 hybrid or a Custom 5 would be a better choice (you may like a JB, but it's not very versatile...output is too high but mostly it has that upper mids nasal tone going on that you can't get rid of).
    A on/on/on will give you series/split/parallel. I suppose it is available in a 4PDT, but I would suggest having 2 DPDT on/on/on switches so you can control each humbucker separately (like in your diagram).
    Thanks GuitarDoc! I've did some research and the Custom 5 seems like a great pairing with the Jazz for Neck. Unfortunately, I'm buying from a local store here in Chile, and it doesn't have the Classic Stack in stock, so I'll have to go with the Little 59'. The Seymour Duncan web says that the SH-5 pairs well with a '59 so it will probably go well with the L59 in middle position.

    So wrapping up, I'll be buying:

    Neck: SH-2n Jazz
    Middle: SL59-1b Little '59
    Bridge: TB-14 Custom 5 Trembucker

    Once I get them and the electronic parts I'll get hands on with the wiring... So I'll probably be asking for help again.
    Thanks again to everyone for the pickup suggestions!
    Last edited by Deim0s; 07-30-2020, 11:59 AM.

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