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Lets talk about "stock" pickups

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  • Masta' C
    replied
    Oh yeah, the Super 58's were solid! I had a couple Talmans with those and they were great! The later "Super 58 Custom" models weren't bad, either

    An honorable mention should also go out to the G&B pickups in PRS SE & S2 models...really solid pickups for "stock", as well!

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  • ArtieToo
    replied
    Masta' C reminded me of the Super 58's that came in my Ibby Jetking. Killer open, airy, PAF-ish pups that sold on eBay in an instant. I regret selling them. Look for them.

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  • Masta' C
    replied
    I'll give this a shot...

    1) I can agree with your comment about some designs "trying to make a point". Of course, this largely depends on what you perceive as the starting point for what pickups should sound like. Designs like the Tone Zone and Evo were designed for a specific purpose, so their somewhat non-traditional sound and response is completely intentional and, if that works for what you need, they are tough designs to beat. I'd wager 80% of DiMarzio's pickups today are artist models, so they were obviously built to meet the needs of a specific person/guitar/rig and don't always have maximum versatility for all musical styles in mind. Personally, I think having access to different "flavors" is a good thing. Over the years, I've had some picky guitars that needed pickups with these odd characteristics to get things just right.

    2) I think it's important to define what you mean by "stock pickups". It seems you are referring to budget-oriented models that typically bear a house brand, rather than "big name" models that come stock in MANY guitars.

    Anyways, what you are calling "stock" pickups are not always made to the construction standards of Seymour Duncan, DiMarzio, etc. Ibanez has had a wide range of quality "stock" pickups over the years, from cr@p to gold. But so have many other guitar companies, which makes the term "stock" a bit vague. Sticking with Ibanez, many of their highly regarded designs have been made by DiMarzio or Seymour Duncan in the U.S. or by Gotoh in Japan. Very few of their other "stock" pickups have found favor with the majority of players. That said, there was a huge quality jump in the early-00s when Ibanez started using Korean-made pickups for their lower-end models. These were better constructed and more reliable in service and tended to mimic the sound of popular designs (especially DiMarzios) more closely. They've since moved their pickup production to China, but the manufacturing processes are much improved from what it meant to be "Made in China" in the '80s and '90s.

    As for internal components, there are also wide grades of quality when it comes to magnet wire, magnets, manufacturing tolerances, etc. Regardless of where something is made, better quality almost always comes at a cost. When it comes to the "big names", you're generally getting the best quality materials and getting them consistently, which also has "value", as you suggested.

    3) There is indeed value in knowing what you get, but that's not the only "value" of a product. Naturally, you are welcome to use whatever pickups suit you and your needs. Often, there is no need to buy aftermarket pickups and many players fall down the rabbit hole of aftermarket designs, only to end up back at stock at some later date. Personally, I have had guitars with a Seymour Duncan in the bridge and a stock Ibanez Infinity pickup in the neck because that's what sounded best to me. It is definitely easy to fall under the belief that aftermarket are always "better". Sometimes they are, sometimes they aren't.

    4) You and I both kind of focused on Ibanez' designs here, so I'll give you some to check out...If you haven't tried them yet, the V1/V2 pickups are great, as are the first-gen Quantum pickups (QM1/QM2). The DiMarzio/IBZ set is great and you can often grab a set for half the price of similar DiMarzio-branded pickups (though there are a bunch of fake DiMarzio/IBZ pickups on the market now that look like the real thing, so be careful...thanks China!).

    Jackson pickups from the '80s and '90s are generally pretty good, as are the newer-gen Quantum pickups from Ibanez if you're truly on a budget and want a more modern sound. One of the best Van Halen covers I've ever come across was done with stock V7/V8 pickups, so clearly they don't completely "suck", LOL! The newer pickups in Chapman guitars are made by the same company as Ibanez and are pretty good for stockers. The "Rockfield" branded pickups now found in some B.C. Rich guitars are solid, as well.

    And let's not dismiss Fender pickups. Their "stock" models tend to be pretty dang good from the get-go.

    Lots of options.
    Last edited by Masta' C; 08-04-2020, 08:51 AM.

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  • ArtieToo
    replied
    Originally posted by Top-L View Post
    I'm curious if anyone else uses stock pickups as part of their "tone arsenal" or if the majority of people believe that there will always be a "better" aftermarket pickup? Also, if you are a fan of any particular stock pickup, let me know which models so I can get some from ebay to test out!
    I'm not sure how well this fits the spirit of your question, but I have several guitars that have remained stock, but . . . that's because they came from the factory with "aftermarket" pups, so to speak. My Strat with Duncan Designed Lipstick Tubes. Squier Jaguar with DD zebra JB/Jazz set. Daisy Rock with DD 59's. And a Johnson Strat with EMG Designed singles, that sound killer. Import BC Rich Warlock with EMG's.

    The one exception is my Gretsch Electromatic with Filtron clones. I bought Duncan Psyclones for it a few months ago and haven't installed them yet because the Gretsch's sound outstanding.
    Last edited by ArtieToo; 08-04-2020, 08:24 AM.

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  • beaubrummels
    replied
    Gibson 500T / 496R
    Fender TexMex Telecaster set
    Fender Custom Jazz Bass pickups (the active ones in the Custom Jazz)

    Leave a comment:


  • Top-L
    started a topic Lets talk about "stock" pickups

    Lets talk about "stock" pickups

    I know this is an aftermarket pickup forum, but one thing I like about this place is that its brand agnostic and open to ideas.

    I have been swapping pickups since the beginning and only over the past five years have I gone back to stock pickups in some guitars, listened objectively, and realized they have just as much to offer as "upgrade" pickups. I view pickups as an EQ curve, the goal is to match the pickup to your playing, your guitar, and your amps.

    Most of my experience is with Ibanez guitars, and as such I have experience with Ibanez stock pickups. I still have guitars with Quantum and Infinity pickups installed. After trying nearly the whole Dimarzio catalog, I realized that the Quantum and Infinity pickups are very similar to my favorite Dimarzio models.

    My impression is that often with aftermarket pickups (at least Dimarzio), they are "trying to make a point", by giving the pickup some exaggerated characteristic that you wouldn't find in a middle of the road pickup. Good examples of this are the Evolution and the Tone Zone. You can't install either of those pickups in your guitar without hearing a noticeable change in attack or thickness (respectively.) These outliers have a quality that your ear can instantly pick out, but does that make them "better"?

    Regarding construction, there is nothing magic going on, the best pickups do not incorporate more expensive materials that make them "better". They are all made the same way. I used to think that a guitar company like Ibanez would "cripple" their low and mid price guitars with inferior pickups, but now I don't believe that. They put "name brand" pickups in their high end guitars, but its mostly a marketing move. High end guitars sound better because the guitar itself sounds better. I think that even with low price guitars, the company wants the player to have a good experience so they make the sale. That means the pickups are potted so they don't squeal, and they are designed to appeal to the target audience. (In the case of Ibanez pickups, they generally will work for hard rock, metal, and lead guitar.)

    And its not rocket science. While it may not be legal, its not difficult to disassemble a pickup to see exactly how it was made, and to copy that design. Its my belief that all of the cheap chinese pickups are just copies of well established models. Likewise the stock brand pickups are similar if not outright copies of name brand models.

    Its my belief that the value of aftermarket pickups is that you know exactly what they are. There is a chinese pickup out there that sounds exactly like a JB or a Super Distortion, but I don't know which model it is or how to get it, or even if it will be in production a year from now. ( A chinese pickup is like a packet of unknown seeds, you don't know what they are until you have planted them and grown them.)

    In the case of stock pickups, you also know exactly what they are. So IMO, they have as much value as aftermarket pickups. The Ibanez stock pickups are ubiquitous; at any given time there are 10+ used sets on ebay being sold dirt cheap. And I already know what they sound like.

    I'm curious if anyone else uses stock pickups as part of their "tone arsenal" or if the majority of people believe that there will always be a "better" aftermarket pickup? Also, if you are a fan of any particular stock pickup, let me know which models so I can get some from ebay to test out!




    Last edited by Top-L; 08-04-2020, 07:51 AM.
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