Add inductance mod?

[Blobby]

1st off, I imagine I have a lot to learn about pickups, so keep that in mind.

One thing I was curious about was Dimarzio's virtual vintage stuff. My understand is it is to add some inductance? Which in turns darkens the tone a bit (maybe a bit vague there).

Masta' C mentioned in a thread something about a diy virtual vintage mod. Has anyone tried this? How exactly was it done?

So I guess another question would be could another method be used to alter inductance, like swapping pole pieces?

Thanks!

[Clint 55]

Double thick mags increase the output.

[beaubrummels]

Clint - not sure that answered the question, but ok.

The DiMarzio patent says they insert at least one magnet (on other forums I've read they use 3) in between the other magnets that sense the strings and that increases the inductance and adds some humcancelling affect without compromising the resistance and other factors that would be affected by say using more turns of wire to increase the inductance (which would alter the resistance and other factors, changing the sound.)

[DavidRavenMoon]

What DiMarzio does is add iron slugs between the magnets. They do the same thing on some humbucker bobbins.

When I worked there that was one of the things I did, along with pressing in pole pieces/magnets.

On the stacked virtual vintage pickup, the added inductance on the bottom hum canceling coil increase its sensitivity to hum. That way it can be wound with fewer turns of wire. This reduces its effect on the top coil.

The top coil has a steel U shaped shield around it. This helps prevent hum from getting into the coil, and passes it to the bottom coil.

This idea is based on the Kinman pickups. Duncan has a similar stacked pickup using the same idea.

On DiMarzio humbuckers, the iron slugs are used to increase the inductance to warm up the tone.


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[freefrog]

1st off, I imagine I have a lot to learn about pickups, so keep that in mind.

One thing I was curious about was Dimarzio's virtual vintage stuff. My understand is it is to add some inductance? Which in turns darkens the tone a bit (maybe a bit vague there).

Masta' C mentioned in a thread something about a diy virtual vintage mod. Has anyone tried this? How exactly was it done?

So I guess another question would be could another method be used to alter inductance, like swapping pole pieces?

Thanks!

What other members said + these humble footnotes:

-more inductance "darkens the tone" somehow because it makes the resonant peak lower pitched;

-altering inductance is relatively easy: more iron in the magnetic circuit = more inductance, to word it in a simplistic way.

It can be achieved with added slugs but also with slugs, screws and keeper bars of a bigger size/mass.

A double thick AlNiCo mag will also increase the inductance because of its ferrous content. And the more iron AlNi(Co) contains, the more inductance it will give, schematically (60% of iron in A3, 55% in A2, 50% or less in A5 = A3 more inductive than A2, itself more inductive than A5... while ceramic would lower the inductance compared to AlNiCo).

Even some chrome covers rise the inductance because of their composition.

A possible downside is increased Foucault currents, flattening a bit the resonant peaks and dulling a tad the tone.

FWIW. :-)

[DavidRavenMoon]

And the more iron AlNi(Co) contains, the more inductance it will give, schematically (60% of iron in A3, 55% in A2, 50% or less in A5 = A3 more inductive than A2, itself more inductive than A5... while ceramic would lower the inductance compared to AlNiCo).

By the way, the “Co” in Alnico is for cobalt (aluminum/nickel/cobalt). Iron is “Fe” and not in the acronym.

Another reason to increase inductance is if you’re using a ceramic magnet, as they have the inductance of air. Or nothing at all. Steel pole pieces also increase inductance. That’s why the Fender Strat pickups with the steel poles and ceramic magnets have a beefy tone.


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[freefrog]

By the way, the “Co” in Alnico is for cobalt (aluminum/nickel/cobalt). Iron is “Fe” and not in the acronym.

Another reason to increase inductance is if you’re using a ceramic magnet, as they have the inductance of air. Or nothing at all. Steel pole pieces also increase inductance. That’s why the Fender Strat pickups with the steel poles and ceramic magnets have a beefy tone.


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Yep, I remember the surprise felt here decades ago with MIM Strat PU's: they had the DCR of regular SC's but twice their inductance... No wonder if people were finding them dark sounding! :-))

EDIT - BTW, I had put "Co" between brackets because of AlNi3 (without Cobalt). :-)

[Blobby]

Thanks for the info guys. As for the practical application, has anyone tried a diy mod for this? I'm curious as to how exactly that'd be done on an existing humbucker pickup. Maybe drill the underside (carefully) of the bobbin and press in a rod of some sort, or screw in a screw?

[DavidRavenMoon]

Thanks for the info guys. As for the practical application, has anyone tried a diy mod for this? I'm curious as to how exactly that'd be done on an existing humbucker pickup. Maybe drill the underside (carefully) of the bobbin and press in a rod of some sort, or screw in a screw?

Yes


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[Ace Flibble]

You can get the same effect in humbuckers, without having to drill any new holes, by swapping the standard nickel baseplate for a brass one. The peak lowers ever-so-slightly and the absolute lowest bass gets a small boost. Axesrus started advocating the idea (opposing the notion that brass bases are only for cheap pickups), which you can read and see their test results of HERE (click the 'nickel vs brass' tab), and having now tried it myself with a couple of winds I find their results to be accurate. I've tried darkening pickups in a few different ways, including going for slightly oversized A3s and placing small iron nuts and chopped-up bolts around the poles and magnets of humbuckers (not quite as refined as DiMarzio do it, but the same principle), and swapping to a brass baseplate works just as well. There may be a nitpicking technical difference, but in terms of the end result you hear coming out of an amp, it sounds the same.

I've tried Axesrus' other combinations and found those also work out how they say, with a nickel base and a brass cover being even darker and smoother than an uncovered brass base. Brass base with a brass cover is plain muffled.

For Strat single coils, a while back I found some copper & steel baseplates that could be attached on, mimicking the base of a Telecaster bridge pickup. Those both darkened and fattened the tone – I don't know if it was the inductance specifically that they affected, but the end result in any case was a little less treble and a bit more lower-mids.

[Clint 55]

Thanks for the info guys. As for the practical application, has anyone tried a diy mod for this? I'm curious as to how exactly that'd be done on an existing humbucker pickup. Maybe drill the underside (carefully) of the bobbin and press in a rod of some sort, or screw in a screw?

Swap the regular thickness magnet for a double thickness one and add an additional spacer on either side.

[Blobby]

For adding in screws or slugs, I'm sure the material composition matters, but is the main thing to not go with stainless steel?


Looking for brass baseplates and double thick magnets...looks like slim pickins. MojoTone, Addiction FX, Amazon (Chinese stuff that may take forever to get here?) Am I missing any commonly used sellers? Looking for humbucker stuff btw.