Invaders vs Distortion vs Black Winter for rhythm

[Grifter]

So I am in the process of building a new guitar and wanted to try something different. I typically toss in a set of EMG 81/85's...the original "Het Set" before Papa Het had a signature set, but this go around I don't want to mess with active pickups.

I remember when the invaders first released and I loved the look of them, but never heard them IN a guitar. And I will freely admit right now that after playing guitar for over 33 years now that I honestly couldn't tell you what pickup I had my switch set on when I am playing. I just kept the switch on whichever position had the best sounding crunch and left it there. lol

Trying to educate myself more now and become more of a learned builder and player to hopefully one day build for others as well. But from a player standpoint here is my inquiry: For someone who plays mainly metal & symphonic metal (Nightwish, Epica, Within Temptation, etc) and focuses mainly on only doing rhythm and an occasional lead, what would be a better setup of pickups? From what I see and hear on the pickup sound pages, the Invader, Distortion, and Black Winter all sound pretty similar.

For what I do, should I just get a set of any of them, or mix them up like an Invader at the bridge and Distortion at the neck, or some variation of these? I look forward to hearing some great advice.

[weepingminotaur]

Black Winters all the way. They are modern, high output, defined, with plenty of mids. They will cut through the mix and give your metal rhythm some serious bite.

[nexion218]

Black Winters all the way. They are modern, high output, defined, with plenty of mids. They will cut through the mix and give your metal rhythm some serious bite.

Not only that, but that set is extremely versatile, I especially love the BW neck. The Distortion is full on 80s metal for my. I don't think Metallica ever used those, but the closest I ever heard my rig sound to Ride the Lightning was with a set of DD. I've no experiwnce with the Invaders but Hetfield supposedly had it in his white Jackson King V he used during the Master of Puppets recording and tour

[UnderTheFlame83]

Both the Black Winter and Distortion sets are amazing pickups. Black Winter can do any type of metal and the cleans/split are very good. And Randy Rhodes used the Distortion and countless others. Either one of those would be a good choice no matter which you choose. Flip a coin.

Get the Invaders if you like more low chunk, though. These don't get mentioned much, for some reason, but they kick ass and been around a long time. Stay away from the cheap Invader clones. Nothing is like the real thing. Good luck on your tone quest.

[UnderTheFlame83]

Also since you usually use the EMG 81/85, try the DiMarzio D Activator set. I was a long time 81/85 user for nearly 20 years, until I put a set of D Activators in an RG. I never switched back to EMGs after that.

[Aceman]

Can't speak to the Black Winter from personal experience, but familiar with what you want to do and the other two.

Invader - REALLY liked in a Strat 25 1/2 scale. Might not like as much, or might be way more chunky in a 24 3/4 scale mahogany guitar.

Distortion - Super tight and crunchy in anything. Might not be the right sound.

Based on what I have read hear about the Black Winter, might be the ideal choice. More flexible than the Distortion, not as "much" as the Invader.

[Mincer]

Another vote for Black Winter. They can do more than just metal, too...and sound great clean, too. The EQ makes for super tight low end, yet it isn't so powerful that everything is compressed to hell.

[Rex_Rocker]

It's been ages since I've had an Invader, but out of the Distortion and the Black Winter, I prefer the later. I dig them both, the Black Winter seems a little more balanced while still being super aggresive. It's also tighter and very hard-hitting.

[bigcupholder]

The EMG 81 is extremely compressed and has almost no bass, which is why it's an easy pickup to mix. The Distortion has a similar aggressive upper mid spike that you're used to from the 81 but will sound a lot thicker on the low end. It's not quite as compressed and sounds more "natural" due to the extended response, but it's still a very aggressive pickup. Output level is similar.

It's a good passive to try if you don't want to stray too far from the 81. Having said that, no passive pickup will sound or feel like an EMG, so you're in for a noticeable change.

Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk

[PS412]

I have the invaders and the black winters, I suck at describing sound.
The invaders are more low end torque, the winters wind up on the mid upper part of the curve.
I prefer the invaders myself. Both sets are in mahogany guitars.

[TNTales]

I love my Black Winters. I'm not a fan of Actives and the BW is nice tight and hot. Also cleans up nicely. I keep it in a guitar tuned to Eb and play stuff like Alice In Chains with it.

[beaubrummels]

People keep referring to Black Winters as a type of Distortion. IME that isn't exactly right. Distortion is tight and bright in my Strat types, and has a bit of a thick/flabby low end in my Les Paul/SG mahogany types. In my Strat types, IME the Black Winter sounds like a Custom as a base with some Distiortion brightness and a little bit of color in the mids added in, while in a Les Paul/SG mahogany type sounds very flat and even, like an active, but it's still passive. The Black Winter is more complex than the Distortion. They almost behave the opposite IME: BW tight/bright in LP, DD thick/chunky but bright in LP; BW warm/thick-but-bright in Strat, DD tight/bright in Strat. Don't know how it's possible or why that would be, but that is my experience. For the OP I would recommend the Black Winter. It's more versatile and pleasing than it's name implies. Also split it does better Strat tones than the DD.

[Masta' C]

Can't speak to the Black Winter from personal experience...

How is this possible? As a Distortion fan, you owe it to yourself to give it a try!

[Masta' C]

People keep referring to Black Winters as a type of Distortion. IME that isn't exactly right...the Black Winter sounds like a Custom as a base.

The BW and Distortion are very similar in many ways. The BW really covers the same ground as the Distortion, but is a bit tighter overall and, like you said, the mids are a bit different. That said, anyone who likes the Distortion will probably appreciate the BW, as well, and it has great split tones as you mentioned.

Here's one of the original videos on the BW by Ola...there are a few passages with the Distortion followed by the BW.

[Aceman]

How is this possible? As a Distortion fan, you owe it to yourself to give it a try!

You know, I think about them a lot.

Part of me says "I love Distortions. No need for a Distortion variation..."

But the more "proggy/modern" description of them makes me think again...