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The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

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  • #61
    Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

    Originally posted by Hot _Grits View Post
    Well, as you asked...

    When I asked for 'controversial', I was think less 'vibrator in vocal booth' (great story, though), and more 'dirty tricks/personnel replacement used to make a record sound good'

    For example, i know of a successful local band that have a rep for being kickass live, but when they hit the studio, they literally record the guitars one chord at a time...
    I'm not so much into the "hired gun" thing if it can be avoided... though, about two years ago I ended up learning and replacing 70% of the guitar on a record for various reasons. It ended up being shelved by the label for other, but somewhat related reasons like the drummer had quit and they weren't the same band they were when signed... Anyway, due to non-disclosures, that's not the kind of thing that anyone can talk about, not even behind closed doors... But you might be surprised at how many of your favorite musicians didn't/haven't ever played on their hit records...

    I'm not into the "one chord at a time" method either and don't make those kinds of records. Don't know how to really... I had a friend who worked with Dream Theater... the stories he had from that... oh man!

    Always in the back of my mind is the artists definition point... does what we're getting sound like the artist is it pulling them in a different direction? If there's no keyboard player in the band I'm not about to suggest that we add 'em to every song! Of course, maybe the artist wants to explore new directions but it's not something I automatically push...

    I prefer to get everyone tracking at the same time, as live as possible... maybe to a click, maybe not. Really capture the energy and nuances that come with that feel before overdubbing and building the rest of it. Sometimes we get on the bonus plan and someone puts down a great solo or parts that don't need to be redone...

    Of course, modern rock & recording techniques dictate that you need to record one band member at a time, always on a grid, and make sure it's sterile and "perfect" before moving onto the next part...



    Could you imagine if all those Zep records were cut on a grid? How about AC/DC? Sad thing is, a band that sounds like that today would get shooed away from major labels & rock radio.

    Shoot from the hip... go with the gut. Try not to get too cerebral because that's NOT what music/art is about.

    I dunno if that answered your question or not...

    Gotta get back to this mix...
    J. 'Moose' Kahrs
    mixer|producer|recordist
    mooseaudio.bandcamp.com

    Originally posted by the guy who invented fire
    All you need to make a record is a mic, some tape and maybe some bad reverb...

    Comment


    • #62
      Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

      Originally posted by J Moose View Post
      I'm not so much into the "hired gun" thing if it can be avoided... though, about two years ago I ended up learning and replacing 70% of the guitar on a record for various reasons. It ended up being shelved by the label for other, but somewhat related reasons like the drummer had quit and they weren't the same band they were when signed... Anyway, due to non-disclosures, that's not the kind of thing that anyone can talk about, not even behind closed doors... But you might be surprised at how many of your favorite musicians didn't/haven't ever played on their hit records...

      I'm not into the "one chord at a time" method either and don't make those kinds of records. Don't know how to really... I had a friend who worked with Dream Theater... the stories he had from that... oh man!

      Always in the back of my mind is the artists definition point... does what we're getting sound like the artist is it pulling them in a different direction? If there's no keyboard player in the band I'm not about to suggest that we add 'em to every song! Of course, maybe the artist wants to explore new directions but it's not something I automatically push...

      I prefer to get everyone tracking at the same time, as live as possible... maybe to a click, maybe not. Really capture the energy and nuances that come with that feel before overdubbing and building the rest of it. Sometimes we get on the bonus plan and someone puts down a great solo or parts that don't need to be redone...

      Of course, modern rock & recording techniques dictate that you need to record one band member at a time, always on a grid, and make sure it's sterile and "perfect" before moving onto the next part...



      Could you imagine if all those Zep records were cut on a grid? How about AC/DC? Sad thing is, a band that sounds like that today would get shooed away from major labels & rock radio.

      Shoot from the hip... go with the gut. Try not to get too cerebral because that's NOT what music/art is about.

      I dunno if that answered your question or not...

      Gotta get back to this mix...
      Sure it did.

      I'm about to do some live tracking with my rock band, and I tell them similar things: don't be surprised if radio programmers and labels don't think it sounds right. But in the end, we sound like we sound, and live is best for getting the feel.

      Modern rock production generally makes my toes crawl. Most of the stuff I hear on radio sounds like it has been tweezed within an inch of it's life. And it really shows when you see those bands live.

      You mentioned horns: what's your mic/room setup and positioning for recording horns as a section?
      Originally posted by Jolly
      ...but then again, I'm so deaf I can't even hear myself fart.

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

        Originally posted by J Moose View Post
        Trey Anastasio and/or Phish would be rad too. I have been to The Barn.
        What's it like there?
        Originally posted by ImmortalSix
        I am just jug the merlot

        Comment


        • #64
          Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

          I must admit that I haven't been following The Well, but this J Moose edition was too good to miss. Very informative and entertaining, Mr Moose.

          So, my question.

          Bass....The Final Frontier. Do you have any tricks that you regularly turn to during tracking or mixing to tame the low frequency beast?




          Cheers..............................wahwah
          Highway Star
          Goodbye Pork Pie Hat
          Mistreated
          Cause We Ended As Lovers
          Go ahead...check out my solo album @ http://geoffwells.bandcamp.com/


          Originally posted by JOLLY
          Strats are better than Les Pauls.

          Comment


          • #65
            Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

            Originally posted by daemon barbeque View Post
            Hey Moose great Well bro!

            What is the biggest "artist behaviour" that turns you nutts and brings you to beat the crap out of him/her ,quit the session ,kick him/her out of the studio ,the combination of the three or some more brutal/horror movie based actions?
            A true story with some extra hot "spice" on it could make me really happy heheh
            I'm not really a violent person... not my style.

            One big thing that drives me nuts is people crunching food wrappers in the room, usually while standing right behind me! I don't care if you eat, just toss the **** thing away and don't play with it... It always sounds like digital krunchies...

            I try to maintain a strict "no-cell-phone" policy as well... nothing more then a distraction and the digital hash gets into everything when they search for the mothership connection...

            But no. Never tossed anyone out for anything of the sort. Do I look like Phil Ramone or something?! HAHA
            J. 'Moose' Kahrs
            mixer|producer|recordist
            mooseaudio.bandcamp.com

            Originally posted by the guy who invented fire
            All you need to make a record is a mic, some tape and maybe some bad reverb...

            Comment


            • #66
              Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

              Originally posted by wahwah View Post
              I must admit that I haven't been following The Well, but this J Moose edition was too good to miss. Very informative and entertaining, Mr Moose.
              Thank you sir! I try...

              Bass....The Final Frontier. Do you have any tricks that you regularly turn to during tracking or mixing to tame the low frequency beast?

              Cheers..............................wahwah
              After getting the drums somewhat together, and the bass somewhat together... meaning everythings patched & confirmed as working, maybe sort out some phase stuff... I have the drummer and bassist play together, as a unit before diving into EQ's or anything of the sort. Otherwise I think it's too easy to make "big drums" or go down a road where individual tones don't really relate to each other.

              I always take a DI right off the bass and mic the amp... sometimes using the tried & true 421 or RE20, sometimes a 414 or 47Fet (M147 as well); but also small diaphragm condensers like an AKG460 or Earthworks omni... If the player has a pedal board I might drop a second DI on the output of that, especially if there's envelope filters and stuff. Sometimes split it to a guitar amp for punk/metal stuff.

              Being a rock guy I like a fair bit of compression on bass... 1176 is great. The old UK made Joe Meek is "a sound"... Distressors... the Atomic SqueezeBox is gnarly but expensive! I'd love to have one...

              Pultec EQ's & other inductor based designs like the Dakings are amazingly good. Maybe add a little 50-60Hz, more often then not I'll shape the low-mids around 120-300Hz to play better with the kick and maybe add snap in the upper mids... anywhere from 700-2kHz... depending on any number of factors... the bass, the player, how it's siting against the guitars...

              Lots of listening!
              J. 'Moose' Kahrs
              mixer|producer|recordist
              mooseaudio.bandcamp.com

              Originally posted by the guy who invented fire
              All you need to make a record is a mic, some tape and maybe some bad reverb...

              Comment


              • #67
                Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                Who are your favorite comedians and favorite comedy movies?

                What toys from your childhood would you like to have kept or re-buy just for fun?
                Originally posted by Boogie Bill
                I've got 60 guitars...but 49 trumpets is just...INSANITY! WTF!

                Comment


                • #68
                  Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                  Since your first answer to my question about the Bandmaster wasn't answered correctly I'll ask again.

                  When are you going to sell me your Bandmaster head?


                  I get weak in the knees at the sight of a vintage Fender amp!

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                    I don't really have any questions, but thanks for those great answers in respect to recording! They have been most useful!
                    "I believe the truth is not told between 9 and 5." - Hunter S. Thompson

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                      Yup, thanks for that J Moose. Great anecdotes!
                      Originally posted by Kanye West
                      Welcome to the real world. Everybody wanna booooo me but I'm a fan of real pop culture!!! No disrespect but we watchin' the show at the crib right now cause...well you know...I'm not crazy y'all, I'm just real.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                        Very informative! Great well!
                        "......whip-crack went his whippy tail, and the beast was done."

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                          Sorry for falling off the planet here... Wednesday was pretty haggard... I got in way past my bedtime and ended up sleeping until 3pm Thursday afternoon, still a little krispy...

                          Don't get into music or any of the other "arts" unless you value not having a life and "normal" hours!

                          Originally posted by VIBROLUX View Post
                          Since your first answer to my question about the Bandmaster wasn't answered correctly I'll ask again.

                          When are you going to sell me your Bandmaster head?

                          Ehhhhhhh..?


                          How about, NEVER?!?

                          J. 'Moose' Kahrs
                          mixer|producer|recordist
                          mooseaudio.bandcamp.com

                          Originally posted by the guy who invented fire
                          All you need to make a record is a mic, some tape and maybe some bad reverb...

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                            Originally posted by KGMESSIER View Post
                            What's it like there?
                            Not sure I can answer this one simply...

                            Quiet. Peaceful. Spiritually "alive"... Creative...

                            As the story goes... Trey owned the property and loved creating at that spot which is a mountaintop roughly an hour & change from downtown Burlington... He bought the structure from another guy in VT who was going to burn it down and had it disassembled and moved piece by piece to the hilltop where it sits now. They put in the driveway, ran power... the whole works. Took three years or so to complete before they moved any gear in?! Standing on the deck there's nothing but trees and mountains for miles around...

                            The studio itself is an open space, no walls or anything like a "traditional" studio. There's a couple of odd spaces to isolate amps & lots of gobos... Nice gear; big newer API desk; 2" tape and protools, modest collection of outboard gear. No reason that a record couldn't be made there! Heating and cooling must be a small sum since the building isn't insulated.

                            I'll root around for pictures... pretty sure I know which drive they're on...
                            J. 'Moose' Kahrs
                            mixer|producer|recordist
                            mooseaudio.bandcamp.com

                            Originally posted by the guy who invented fire
                            All you need to make a record is a mic, some tape and maybe some bad reverb...

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                              Originally posted by Rainmaker View Post
                              Yup, thanks for that J Moose. Great anecdotes!
                              Thanks to you guys for asking me stuff...

                              But,HAHA

                              I mean, I was expecting at LEAST one "what's the most expensive "____" that you've ever seen destroyed" or some other stuff... maybe even some guitar questions or even about Scabble or movies, whatever ...

                              I'm trying to find someone else to take over and do round #14... in the meantime, ask away!
                              J. 'Moose' Kahrs
                              mixer|producer|recordist
                              mooseaudio.bandcamp.com

                              Originally posted by the guy who invented fire
                              All you need to make a record is a mic, some tape and maybe some bad reverb...

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: The Well ~ Lucky #13. Cavefish spills all

                                Originally posted by Gearjoneser View Post
                                Who are your favorite comedians and favorite comedy movies?
                                Oh man. Sam Kinison is/was one of the greatest. I love Howard Stern as well, he's even better since he went to Sirius, and I was subscriber long before he came aboard! George Carlin, Robin Williams is a madman... George Pryor may he RIP...

                                I caught some of 'the Money Pit' pretty recently, always loved that one. 48 hours; the Ali G movie; Blues Brothers; the Friday films; Clerks. Lebowski. I've seen a bunch that aren't popping to mind... anything but "dumb" stuff... Can't stand Adam Sandler anymore and never liked Jim Carey much outside of the Fire Marshall Bill skits.

                                Some of Spinal Tap hits a little close to home these days... but it's still great! Especially the DVD with all the outtakes & commentary! It's two whole other movies!

                                What toys from your childhood would you like to have kept or re-buy just for fun?
                                Legos. I love Legos. Dunno if those count though... I've been digging through boxes at my parents recently and found a lot of my old toys, most of 'em in pretty haggard shape...

                                I also found a BUNCH of comic books from the early 80s when I was a wee lad...

                                X-Men, GI Joes; Alf, Fantastic Four, Transformers #1-20; most in poor shape, some in decent to great shape, but a whole slew of 'em have this spot about two inches long where mom put my name on 'em in Sharpie!

                                Thanks mom! At least nobody stole 'em during recess...

                                Last edited by J Moose; 01-27-2008, 11:05 PM.
                                J. 'Moose' Kahrs
                                mixer|producer|recordist
                                mooseaudio.bandcamp.com

                                Originally posted by the guy who invented fire
                                All you need to make a record is a mic, some tape and maybe some bad reverb...

                                Comment

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