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Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

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  • #31
    Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

    Originally posted by Multi Angle Vise View Post

    I prefer to have the bridge pickup reverse angled (I am a lefty) so the treble side is further away from the bridge, I think this makes the treble strings a bit more meaty, and the bass strings a bit more defined.

    .
    YEAH!!!!
    Finally somebody else says it!

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    • #32
      Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

      Originally posted by Multi Angle Vise
      Sort of a meta comment on the thread, I was a bit surprised the way this turned out. I didn't expect the 22 fret vs 24 fret to be the main topic (and I thought people going for the harmonic arguments would be in favour of the the 24 fret placement as the 22 fret pickup lies on quite few harmonic nulls).

      Amazed no-one seemed to care about bridge pickup location, which for me is a much more important aspect of the guitar's construction than the the neck pickup location.
      Right,I expect more focus on bridge pickup too,22 fret vs 24 fret already been beaten to hell. Let's see where this thread heading.

      Originally posted by Multi Angle Vise
      Just for fun, here's Ed Roman's take on it:
      http://www.edroman.com/techarticles/scalelength.htm
      http://www.edroman.com/techarticles/22vs24.htm

      (I don't agree with him at all, as per earlier post, once you fret, everything changes. Location is just personal taste.)
      First I eat what he wrote blatantly as a whole,then I come to a conclusion that he's just a guitar clown,entertaining but not educating.
      Originally posted by GuitarDoc
      Don't take yourselves, or anything for that matter, too seriously. We're born, we live, then we die. All of us. Just the same.

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      • #33
        Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

        Originally posted by WGTP View Post
        It doesn't go out the window, it just moves up and down the neck.
        Well yes but your pickup doesn't move as you move your hand, no?

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        • #34
          Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

          Got nuffing to add, except a pic.




          No one told this design team about neck pick up sweet spots !
          Tele, SG, LP Jr, '76 Ibanez Artist & Tokai LS92 + FUZZ boxes into a '66 AB165 Bassman & 2X12 (55Hz Greenbacks) / '73 Orange OR120 & 2X12 (V30 & SwampThang) / Orange Thunderverb 50 & PPC212 / Marshall Vintage Modern 50 & 2X12 Genz Benz g-Flex / Laney Klipp / Laney AOR Pro Tube 100


          "...it's a tree with a microphone" - Leslie West

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          • #35
            Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

            THere have got to be at least a dozen posts from Eltham and myself with 10k words + /each in as many threads in teh Guitar Shop + Pickup Lounge going into this in a depth that only concerted study of material resonance, string vibration physics and magnetic flux fields can offer. I don`t think it´s time for a new one, yet

            But the general lowdown: That applet and many similar "imperic experiments" do not factor in flaws that by design are necessary to arrive at their conclusion. In this case the body resonance massively skews the response curce he arrived at, to the point where he actually measures "string resonance" outside of the string´s speaking length at the bridge, but at the nut there is none as is proper.

            That he admits to knowing about the design flaw but proceeding anyway makes the experiment all but void.

            He is however still on the right track..... But without properly isolating the string, he´s SOL

            His experiment would however be more valid if one knew the exact detaily of the guitar, pickups and strings used as well as exactly where it was plucked, and THEN the pickup were moved. The response curve would turn out similar.

            BTW at Germany´s main (or rather only) luthierie school at Mittenwald, a place with hundreds of years of experience in the current generation alone, there exists an instrument with a single pickup that slides on rails, has one string, and a fretless 11/12 fretboard (end´s just before the first octave)... take a wild guess what it´s designed to test and prove, and how I know about it´s existence
            Last edited by Zerberus; 09-13-2011, 11:14 AM.
            Zerberus Industries: Where perfection just isn't good enough.

            Listen to my music at http://www.soundclick.com/infiniteending and www.subache.com

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            • #36
              Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

              Originally posted by Multi Angle Vise View Post
              I think some of the ideas people have about this are a bit specious.

              If you say point X is the magical point for picking up the best harmonics, that only applies to an open string. As soon as you start fretting, you've changed the string length, and the pickup is no longer in the magic position. (I don't play much on open strings so I'd need some kind of tracking device and a powered servo bed to move the pickup back and forth to keep me in the magic harmonic zone.)

              Also (particularly with humbuckers) the pickup does not sense one narrow point on the string, it has a wider window than that, so it can't be that critical.

              For these reasons, I don't agree with the idea that there's a mathematically based "best position". I think it's taste.

              Having said that, if the bridge pickup is too close to the bridge, that can give a really tinny sound. I think there needs to be a bit of space between the bridge and the pickup, but that's based on a sample of one guitar where the pickup is hard up against the bridge. Also on a strat I prefer to have the bridge pickup reverse angled (I am a lefty) so the treble side is further away from the bridge, I think this makes the treble strings a bit more meaty, and the bass strings a bit more defined.

              For the other positions I'm not too fussed. I'm sure there's a difference in sound between the neck pickup on a said to hell with it and took my old o2 fret and on a 24 fret neck, but I haven't got a preference, and I don't think you can say one is better than the other (even if Ed Roman does).
              Dude you just made a lightbulb go off in my head in regards to the Bridge pickup. I had a strat im in the middle of building but waiting on the fretboard. I had some really nice 78 strat pickups that ive had worked on and ive been itching to hear them. So i said to hell with it and took my old ibanez and cut it out a bit to fit 3 single coils. Unfortunately i had about 1/2 to 3/4 inch smaller distance to place the pickups due to the 24 frets. Neck and middle are fine. Bridge sounded like i had the wrong value pot on it. After reading this I slid it further away from the bridge and swapped the direction of the angle and OMG I dare say its comparable to a strat with just a tad bit of a hollow body sound that only a guitarist would spot. But im satsfied. Im definately going to look into th bride placement on all my guitars. Ive always followed the rule of getting it as close as possible to the bridge, but no more

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              • #37
                Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

                Originally posted by Chickenwings View Post
                go to 9:55 for joe's thoughts on neck pickup placement.

                ......i kinda dig the interviewer too...
                I think Satriani sounded the best on his first album :o

                (on some Ibanez guitar, and Marshall amps) :/

                and then progressively sounded worse, and worse, as the years went by. (to my ears!)

                If somethings important- send a PM. I might be offline for long periods. Rock on!!!

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                • #38
                  Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

                  (and that Ed Roman's ramblings... lol!! what a meathead!! xD )
                  If somethings important- send a PM. I might be offline for long periods. Rock on!!!

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                  • #39
                    Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

                    To me, it is just the distance from the bridge. Find a guitar that sounds sweet to you, and measure the distance of the pickups from the bridge. That is the 'right' place.
                    Administrator of the SDUGF

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                    • #40
                      Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

                      Originally posted by Mincer View Post
                      To me, it is just the distance from the bridge. Find a guitar that sounds sweet to you, and measure the distance of the pickups from the bridge. That is the 'right' place.
                      yes, but if the guitars have different scale length itÂ’s not that easy.
                      then your better of with same distance from the bridge percental to the scale length.
                      but they will never sound the same of course

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                      • #41
                        Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

                        Great players like Carlos Santana like 24 frets and don't mind the neck pickup NOT being where it is on a typical Les Paul or vintage Strat.

                        Players like Joe Satriani and EVH seem to like the sound of the neck pickup being where it is on a vintage Strat or Les Paul.

                        It's all just personal preference and often we prefer what we're used to.

                        What I'm used to is the slightly fuller and deeper sound I get from the neck pickup when the polepieces of the neck pickup are under where the second octave of an open string is.

                        That's right where they put that 24th fret on 24 fret guitars, so most of my guitars have 21 or 22 frets.

                        I get a fuller, deeper sound when my neck pickup is in that position regardless of whether I'm playing open strings, or I'm capoed up or I'm fretting notes higher up the neck.

                        It's about the fuller, deeper sound. I prefer that.

                        The Eddie Van Halen Wolfgang also has 22 frets and I'll bet the screw polepieces of that neck pickup are right under where a 24th fret would be, as they are in a typical Les Paul or Strat.
                        Last edited by Lewguitar; 07-03-2020, 12:42 PM.
                        “Practice cures most tone issues” - John Suhr

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                        • #42
                          Re: Pickup placement,so what's the deal?

                          Here is a useful applet illustrating what pickups do "hear" according to their placement and size, among various parameters...



                          FWIW. :-)
                          Duncan user since the 80's...

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