What's the deal with Blackmachines?

[Big Flannel]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

They won't make me play better. They won't make me sound better. I'm sure they're probably high quality instruments and if it works for you, that's great.

The descriptions on the website are off-putting in my opinion. Anyone who claims that the testament to their quality is being rejected by the mainstream is a bit too pontifical for my tastes.

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

They aren't "handmade". The pickups are bare knuckle, duncan and emg, the frets are dunlop nickel silver, the hardware is gotoh the woods are typical like ash and maple and they are cut in cliche and standard manner. Just by knowing this, I frankly don't care if it sustains for 30 years, weighs nothing and I can control it like it's an appendage of my body. It's mostly just assembled. He's not winding the pickups or casting the hardware or inventing new electronics or using super exotic woods or making an innovative nut or bridge in a minimalist fashion. Yeah I'll order everything from warmoth and give it to an amazing luthier I know and he will put the parts together REALLY well and there is my blackmachine, and I can make another too with the money I save. Hell even if he does put it together PERFECTLY, the neck joints aren't even that good, and the frets and bridge and neck are still typical metal and wood that will wear and warp, then that feeling when playing that is part of the extreme price is gone in probably a year of regular use and it's gonna be set up by another luthier again IF it survives the overseas shipping.

[Warheart]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

They aren't "handmade". The pickups are bare knuckle, duncan and emg, the frets are dunlop nickel silver, the hardware is gotoh the woods are typical like ash and maple and they are cut in cliche and standard manner. Just by knowing this, I frankly don't care if it sustains for 30 years, weighs nothing and I can control it like it's an appendage of my body. It's mostly just assembled. He's not winding the pickups or casting the hardware or inventing new electronics or using super exotic woods or making an innovative nut or bridge in a minimalist fashion...

By that account, nothing is handmade. Any guitar maker that uses brand name pickups isn't making hand made guitars. Gibson custom shop guitars aren't handmade because they are using the same old production pickups. Jackson custom shop aren't because they use EMG and Duncan's, with bridges made by Floyd Rose.

If you want to get respect because you're playing a handmade guitar, make it all yourself, since that seems to be the only way you're going to care about it.

[Big Flannel]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

Would the phrase "assembled by hand" suffice? I believe he was pointing out the unnecessary mark-up in price for 3rd party hardware.

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

Exactly. The point is they aren't making their own anything except the neck and body, and I haven't felt the neck but the body is nothing inspiring even if it is chambered which it supposedly is. Parts are bought elsewhere and they are just put together. The parts were not specifically made like Alembic or Teuffel does. So I'm not factoring in "handmade" because by that extent nothing is ENTIRELY. Everything is SEMI hand made and blackmachine has less of that quality that others have for less cost.

[VHTJay]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

The Blackmachines are to the modern metal guys what a PRS private stock with a Brazilian rosewood neck is to the more vintage oriented high end buyer. Both are insanely expensive and in both cases, you have guys lining up to throw wads of cash when one becomes available. A good friend of mine, who owns a TON of high end gear bought a Blackmachine 7 string with fan frets a couple of years ago. I think he paid a little over 5G for it at the time and I don't know what he ended up selling it for, but think it was an exorbitant amount. he wouldn't say. As for my opinion, I didn't think it played or sounded any better than other high end shred sticks of similar ilk.

[Rockstar216]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

I find it amazing that BM can fetch the same amount of money as gear from the 50's and 60's. Honestly I would never buy one because for 10k I want it built to my specs not what I can get off the wall or from another company. Like previously stated this is a HH minimalist super strat WITHOUT A FLOYD. Also I've yet to see a clean demo of one. I'm sure their great guitars but not 10k great at least not to me.

[Rockstar216]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

Oh and is Blackmachine the Dumble of the guitar world? it seems like it?

[CTN]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

the reason is: Djent d-bags with too much money to spend.

it's a bubble that will inevitably burst.

[vinta9e]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

Exactly. The point is they aren't making their own anything except the neck and body

So what? The neck and the body are the core of the guitar. So what if they don't roll their own fretwire or wind their own pickups? So what if they don't grow their own tonewood? The arguments and criteria you've just presented are ridiculous because they have absolutely nothing to do with an instrument's quality.

[LonePhantom]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

Forget Blackmachine, check out Ormsby Guitars Hypemachines!

http://ormsbyguitars.weebly.com/index.html

I'm sure you'll notice the influence

[CTN]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

So what? The neck and the body are the core of the guitar. So what if they don't roll their own fretwire or wind their own pickups? So what if they don't grow their own tonewood? The arguments and criteria you've just presented are ridiculous because they have absolutely nothing to do with an instrument's quality.

ok, so hardware and whatnot is not gonna cost more than 500-600 bucks.
all the exotic woods, maybe another 500-1000. at the very very most.

You're telling me that just labour by a relatively new builder and prestige are adding some $12,000 to the value of an otherwise fairly standard instrument? That's just ridiculous. There's nothing innovative about them at all, and there are builders all over the world who can pull off the same quality builds for far less than that.

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

So what? The neck and the body are the core of the guitar. So what if they don't roll their own fretwire or wind their own pickups? So what if they don't grow their own tonewood? The arguments and criteria you've just presented are ridiculous because they have absolutely nothing to do with an instrument's quality.

You strongly are misunderstanding me. The criteria seems rediculous because the COST OF THE BLACKMACHINE IS REDICULOUS. They don't have to roll their own fretwire or anything to have an amazing instrument. I'm not talking about the quality of the instrument, I am talking about THE VALUE of it. The thing is, the sum of a traditional Blackmachine's parts are around $1,300, so just putting it all together and setting it up is twice the cost of the materials in addition to them? Yes I expect them to manufature their own pickups and hardware and make more expensive choices WITH THAT LEVEL OF COST. But no, it's gotoh, bkp, ash and maple with one volume, one tone, one selector, hard tailed bridge, 2 humbuckers, bolt on neck. AFFORDABLE AND MINIMAL DESIGN. It does not call for that price,no matter how well it's put together.

[ratherdashing]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

Welcome to the Internet: where everyone's an expert, and anything that doesn't conform to your assumptions is stupid.

Does anyone actually know what these guitars sound like? Has anyone played one? Or are we just pointlessly arguing about how much it costs to build a hypothetical guitar?

[Mincer]

Re: What's the deal with Blackmachines?

"Internet Sensation Marketing" doesn't work for long. My guess is that there are only a handful of guys actually spending that amount on one, or at least saying that they are. Perhaps they are shills for BM, who knows, but it has happened for boutique pedal makers before, so it isn't out of the question. Other than a few internet forums where people are talking about them, they aren't unique enough for most to consider, much less last like PRS did. Add to the fact that any clip I have heard is someone chugging 1 finger chords with so much gain, it might as well be a Squire.