Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

[idsnowdog]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

It seems that the Soldano and the Peavey are closer in terms of tone than the Peavey and the Fender. The Soldano seems to have more girth and grit than the Peavey and Fender, while the Peavey has a little less bass clarity than either. The Fender is the brightest of the 3 and doesn't have the same bass content. All three sound fairly close and are all usable.

[idsnowdog]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

I don't see what's so great about it. For one, we don't know what pickups he used or what speaker. A speaker that sounds good with a 5150 isn't going to sound as good with an SLO. In my experience, 5150's, 6505, EVH are more Celestion-friendly than Soldanos are. Soldanos love Eminence speaker and that's because Mike Soldano mostly uses those speakers in his shop. Moreover, they're all dialed in to sound similar. It would be a different story if you set all the EQ's and gain at 12:00

He established that he tried to limit as many external factors as possible to give a fair representation of each amp. Yes each amp could have sounded better with different cabs, speakers, pickups and guitars but that wasn't the purpose. The fact that all 3 can be dialed in to sound similar is a testament to the versatility and applicability of all 3.


I don’t normally post stuff other than my own work, because I try to stay out of “internet gear culture” — but this video demonstrates the RIGHT way to do a comparison. Notice that the same DI’ed guitar track has been reamped through three different amps, using the same cab and mic setup, so that they’re controlling for as many external factors as possible. Switching is instantaneous. You can hide the video window to get a truly blind comparison.

[SirJackdeFuzz]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

I am very curious about the 5150 changes to outright SLO specs though.

I wanna bet (big money) that the 5150 will need minimal (components and value) changes to become a SLO.

[SirJackdeFuzz]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

It seems that the Soldano and the Peavey are closer in terms of tone than the Peavey and the Fender.
The Soldano seems to have more girth and grit than the Peavey and Fender, while the Peavey has a little less bass clarity than either.
The Fender is the brightest of the 3 and doesn't have the same bass content.

All three sound fairly close and are all usable.

My thoughts exactly.

[UberMetalDood]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

He established that he tried to limit as many external factors as possible to give a fair representation of each amp. Yes each amp could have sounded better with different cabs, speakers, pickups and guitars but that wasn't the purpose. The fact that all 3 can be dialed in to sound similar is a testament to the versatility and applicability of all 3.


I don’t normally post stuff other than my own work, because I try to stay out of “internet gear culture” — but this video demonstrates the RIGHT way to do a comparison. Notice that the same DI’ed guitar track has been reamped through three different amps, using the same cab and mic setup, so that they’re controlling for as many external factors as possible. Switching is instantaneous. You can hide the video window to get a truly blind comparison.

I read that but the fact that he said he was demonstrating the "RIGHT WAY" ruined it. That statement makes too many implications and, as I pointed out, was not the "right way." I'm not going to repeat what I already stated, but I'm pretty sure it's at least agreeable for the most part whether you like it or not. Hey, I wanted to like the demo but it didn't bring anything new to the table and I remain unimpressed due to my aforementioned points.

[xxxplorer]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

Meh... It's just an amp

[SirJackdeFuzz]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

I read that but the fact that he said he was demonstrating the "RIGHT WAY" ruined it. That statement makes too many implications and, as I pointed out, was not the "right way." I'm not going to repeat what I already stated, but I'm pretty sure it's at least agreeable for the most part whether you like it or not. Hey, I wanted to like the demo but it didn't bring anything new to the table and I remain unimpressed due to my aforementioned points.

I understand what he means by saying the 'Right Way'. And i agree with him.

Regardless of the guitar and pick ups that was used . . .

. . . the SAME guitar, with the SAME pick ups, with the SAME cab and speakers was used for the demo, to eliminate as many variables as possible.

Makes the playing field (so to speak) as equal as possible.

Lets use sports cars as an example.

It is completely useless to say that X-Porsche is faster around a 3 mile race track than X-Ferrari, if X-Ferrari was driven on a completely different 3 mile race track.
Only when you put both sports cars on the SAME race track, with the same driver, and do individual time trails, then you can start to compare them.

In other words eliminate as many variables as possible.

Simple.

[Toe-Knee]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

Those DIs were done with emgs and most likely it was a krank cab with v30s or a bogner uberkab going by Lasses usual gear. He will have also thrown a tubescreamer in front of every amp.

Just to point out you can reamp those DI's through any amp and they virtually sound the same regardless. I have used them quite extensively when trialling mods.

To me the main difference in these amps is the feel when playing them.

Also the 5150II/III have a considerable amount more gain and compression.

The SLO & 5150III cut a lot better in a live situation too.

[Toe-Knee]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

Also for what its worth that Soldano is a hotrod with SLO style knobs.

[UberMetalDood]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

I understand what he means by saying the 'Right Way'. And i agree with him.

Regardless of the guitar and pick ups that was used . . .

. . . the SAME guitar, with the SAME pick ups, with the SAME cab and speakers was used for the demo, to eliminate as many variables as possible.

Makes the playing field (so to speak) as equal as possible.

Lets use sports cars as an example.

It is completely useless to say that X-Porsche is faster around a 3 mile race track than X-Ferrari, if X-Ferrari was driven on a completely different 3 mile race track.
Only when you put both sports cars on the SAME race track, with the same driver, and do individual time trails, then you can start to compare them.

In other words eliminate as many variables as possible.

Simple.

You're not catching all I'm saying. The settings are not the same on each amp and therefore not the *right way* to do it. Same pickups, agreed. Same cab, agreed. Same speaker, fine. However, there are a few things. Someone said he might have used a tubscreamer. I have many of them and can tell you they do alter the sound and aren't completely transparent. They usually tighten the bass and affect the midrange. Also, the higher a pedals level/vol is set the more it pushes the preamp doesn't it?

Back to EQ though. I have had amps with very active EQ controls, so adjusting one affects another. I have had other amps that seem to only add to each frequency. These amps aren't set to a neutral setting. They are dialed in to sound similar. Moreover, the mids are kind of scooped. Look at how high the presence is set. It's almost all the way up on the Soldano. The bright switch is engaged on the 5150. There's no bright switch to match on the Soldano. It's hard to tell but the bright switch looks off on the 5153.

What's the point of using the same guitar, speaker, etc... if you're going to dial the amps in differently? These things, other than the aforementioned, are where I think the demo went wrong. I see what he was TRYING to do but I don't agree that it was done *right*.

[SirJackdeFuzz]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

You're not catching all I'm saying.
The settings are not the same on each amp and therefore not the *right way* to do it. Same pickups, agreed.
Same cab, agreed. Same speaker, fine. However, there are a few things.

Someone said he might have used a tubscreamer.

I have many of them and can tell you they do alter the sound and aren't completely transparent.
They usually tighten the bass and affect the midrange.
Also, the higher a pedals level/vol is set the more it pushes the preamp doesn't it?

Back to EQ though. I have had amps with very active EQ controls, so adjusting one affects another.
I have had other amps that seem to only add to each frequency. These amps aren't set to a neutral setting.
They are dialed in to sound similar. Moreover, the mids are kind of scooped. Look at how high the presence is set.
It's almost all the way up on the Soldano. The bright switch is engaged on the 5150.
There's no bright switch to match on the Soldano. It's hard to tell but the bright switch looks off on the 5153.

What's the point of using the same guitar, speaker, etc... if you're going to dial the amps in differently?
These things, other than the aforementioned, are where I think the demo went wrong.
I see what he was TRYING to do but I don't agree that it was done *right*.

I totally agree with you on the tubescreamer thing.
Although, i have not read anywhere that the blog posting person did in fact use a pedal of any sort.
Afaik, the pedal thing is just an assumption - not fact.

Getting back to the EQ.
I can not see that it is a problem or even cheating.
I do not care that you have to crank the tone knobs wildly to get one amp to sound similar to another.
What it shows me is, that with enough knob twiddling, you can make amp X, sound like amp A.
And to me, that is all that matters.

If i buy an amp for $800.00, and all it takes is some tone knob adjustment, to make it sound very similar (not a carbon copy, but close) to a $4000.00 Holy Grail amp, then i am very happy.

[UberMetalDood]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

I totally agree with you on the tubescreamer thing.
Although, i have not read anywhere that the blog posting person did in fact use a pedal of any sort.
Afaik, the pedal thing is just an assumption - not fact.

Getting back to the EQ.
I can not see that it is a problem or even cheating.
I do not care that you have to crank the tone knobs wildly to get one amp to sound similar to another.
What it shows me is, that with enough knob twiddling, you can make amp X, sound like amp A.
And to me, that is all that matters.

If i buy an amp for $800.00, and all it takes is some tone knob adjustment, to make it sound very similar (not a carbon copy, but close) to a $4000.00 Holy Grail amp, then i am very happy.

It's funny because the other day I saw something on the news about a golf ball that Rory Mcilroy threw in the crowd after he won the British Open last week. Whoever got it apparently sold it on Ebay for like $11,000 or something. Jeez, that kind of money could buy 3 SLO's. Man I have been fortunate enough to own the cream of the crop amps, and to be quite honest with you, I would be happy with a Blackstar Series One or Mesa Boogie or something if I couldn't afford the stuff I've gotten. That being said though, there really is a difference in any of the high-priced amps if you have enough technique to expose it. Every now and then an amp gets built that just seems to get all the right ingredients like the SLO, Ecstasy, Fender 57 Deluxe, JCM800, etc... Guys like Reinhold Bogner and Mike Soldano are so talented that they can do it in every amp they make. Then again, it doesn't matter when inspiration comes because whatever gear you are using when inspiration hits you, it's going to sound good.

[BloodRose]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

I havent heard the clips and cant wait to check em. Thanks for the link and info. Now, to throw my .02 into the debate. I have NOT played an slo, so I am going ONLY by what I have read in great detail. YES, Im sure there IS some tonal diff tween the SLO and all the others. Even Mike S said that about the JEt city. They are based on the same circuit, so there there will be tonal differences based on materials. The 5150, was designed to be similar, the Jet city, similar and the 5150 III similar, but with some tweaks over the 5150. The Soldano is going to be smoother and most likely, better in some aspects. The main key Im not seeing mentioned in the debates is cost. The other amps are aimed at the SLO, but they are going to differ someone due to construction. Bottom line, if you want the SLO tone, with no compromises, shell out the big bucks and get the real deal. For cost and accessibility, the others offer a similar tone at a much better pricepoint.
They are close, but obviously there may be some differences.

[dystrust]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

Also for what its worth that Soldano is a hotrod with SLO style knobs.

How are you able to tell it's a Hot Rod? I watched the video and didn't see any shots of the entire front panel of the amp. With the amps you're building you probably know them better than I do (I have played both) and I'm kinda curious how you determined which amp this is.

Regarding SLOs, Hot Rods, and lead circuits, they're supposed to be the same circuit but they sound different. I don't know if it's the custom OT or higher quality components, but SLOs have this amazing, cutting midrange that I just haven't heard in any other amp. I really wish I could get along with a Soldano (I've tried), but my personal sound seems to be a Marshall Jubilee.

[Toe-Knee]

Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo

How are you able to tell it's a Hot Rod? I watched the video and didn't see any shots of the entire front panel of the amp. With the amps you're building you probably know them better than I do (I have played both) and I'm kinda curious how you determined which amp this is.

Regarding SLOs, Hot Rods, and lead circuits, they're supposed to be the same circuit but they sound different. I don't know if it's the custom OT or higher quality components, but SLOs have this amazing, cutting midrange that I just haven't heard in any other amp. I really wish I could get along with a Soldano (I've tried), but my personal sound seems to be a Marshall Jubilee.

There are a few reasons how I can tell that it's a Hotrod. Firstly it doesn't have Deyoung transformers which are the only transformers that are ever used in the SLO and secondly I am a big fan of Lasse and I have been following his work for quite some time and he only got a SLO about a year ago which is finished in the traditional boa snakeskin up to that point he had a hotrod that was black which he later recovered in blue snakeskin.

Also regarding the various Soldanos the main differences between them is in the first two gain stages, the power amp filtering and negative feedback and of course the different transformers.

They do all have a family sound but some are distinctly different the Avenger for example can often be more aggressive and raw sounding this is a big part due to it having no effects loop.