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Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

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  • #61
    Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

    Most of us visit these forums because we are geaheads &/or tinkerers- just as much as we are musicians. The original post provides an excellent jumping-off point for us to share our opinions on what drives us to keep switching pickups, tubes, bridges, magnets, nuts, speakers, capacitors, & stuff. I'm far from an expert on any topic compared to most people who post here, but in real life, I don't know any guitarist who knows as much about gear as I do. This forum is like a support group for gearheads to sit & have conversations which would bore the hell out of our girlfriends.
    Turn me on, Dead Man.

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    • #62
      Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

      Originally posted by baritone View Post
      Most of us visit these forums because we are geaheads &/or tinkerers- just as much as we are musicians. The original post provides an excellent jumping-off point for us to share our opinions on what drives us to keep switching pickups, tubes, bridges, magnets, nuts, speakers, capacitors, & stuff. I'm far from an expert on any topic compared to most people who post here, but in real life, I don't know any guitarist who knows as much about gear as I do. This forum is like a support group for gearheads to sit & have conversations which would bore the hell out of our girlfriends.
      Fair enough but I still don't think people need their panties wadded up over it. I've already said something to this effect about three times already but here goes one more. The majority of the audience doesn't give a sh!t what gear you use. You don't need the best or even the most ideal gear to be a great band or to be a great musician. Yes, I'm a vague hypocrite because I run some nice gear but I get the point and don't claim that my gear somehow matters. I've used all kinds of different gear on stage from solid state halfstacks, high wattage all tube beasts, rack setups, modelling to a power amp and cabinet, modelling direct to PA and sometimes both and the people who have commented on liking my tone haven't done so because they saw a badge they recognize (sometimes what I was using wasn't even visible). It all comes down to me. If you can afford it and you know what you want, there's nothing wrong with having nice gear at all so long as you don't expect it to do something it can't and don't lose sight of what's important.

      Almost every player who complains about how bad the Dual Rectifier is for metal just don't appear to be very good rhythm players who need a lot of compression and something to suck all the low end out to compensate whereas someone with a pick hand like Hetfield has absolutely no problem getting that tight sound out of one stock so the amp becomes less of a factor overall. This whole thing doesn't even apply to you bedroom hobbyists who do it exclusively for the tone, it applies to musicians and more specifically, songwriters. It's the same backwards thinking that make amateur, bedroom studio sound engineers think they would make astonishingly great mixes if only they had a Neve console worth as much as a house and the truth is if they can't get remotely great mixes already with what they have, no amount of analogue console colouring is going to improve anything.

      /thread. Go home.
      Last edited by El Dunco; 09-15-2016, 09:05 PM.
      The opinions expressed above do not necessarily represent those of the poster and are to be considered suspect at best.

      Lead guitarist and vocalist of...



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      • #63
        Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

        Originally posted by gibson175 View Post
        When you play better you enjoy the sound coming out of the amp.
        - Tom

        Originally posted by Frankly
        Some people make the wine. Some people drink the wine. And some people sniff the cork and wonder what might have been.
        The Eagle never lost so much time as when he submitted to learn of the Crow.

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        • #64
          Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

          Mantis,
          People talking to each other in a mainly civil tone is never stupid. Beer$ is a little negative on the idea of gear, but still, he he has been there and I like to hear his view.
          Talking gear is fun for me. I think football is stupid, but not for football fans, and I would never call them stupid. I just keep it to myself.
          So should you.
          There are almost 5 pages that prove my point. I really enjoy different perspectives on all things gear.
          I am ready for any nasty comment one might make, - expecting one from you, But I don't mean this as a name calling post, I am just saying, this thread is not stupid
          for many people, even some of your friends, I bet.
          Steve B.

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          • #65
            Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

            guitfiddle-
            Great image for your "point". By the way, my dad never said guitar, it was always a guitfiddle.

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            • #66
              Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

              I have a compatriot who's philosophy has always been "Make crap sound good".
              I agree. Then, get stuff that's not crap, and sound even better.
              Only you, and your ears, can be the final judge.

              Sent from my MotoE2(4G-LTE) using Tapatalk

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              • #67
                Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                It all seems to boil down to this...make the guitar sing, and the amp has no choice but to sing. You just might like one voice better than another. The audience couldn't care less.
                - Tom

                Originally posted by Frankly
                Some people make the wine. Some people drink the wine. And some people sniff the cork and wonder what might have been.
                The Eagle never lost so much time as when he submitted to learn of the Crow.

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                • #68
                  Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                  Originally posted by SJ318 View Post
                  Mantis,
                  People talking to each other in a mainly civil tone is never stupid. Beer$ is a little negative on the idea of gear, but still, he he has been there and I like to hear his view.
                  Talking gear is fun for me. I think football is stupid, but not for football fans, and I would never call them stupid. I just keep it to myself.
                  So should you.
                  There are almost 5 pages that prove my point. I really enjoy different perspectives on all things gear.
                  I am ready for any nasty comment one might make, - expecting one from you, But I don't mean this as a name calling post, I am just saying, this thread is not stupid
                  for many people, even some of your friends, I bet.
                  Steve B.
                  It's all good, the @sshole with a good point is a role I'm always happy to fill. I've abandoned diplomacy, choosing my words carefully and trying to avoid offending sensitive people but it's relieving to see some people understand.

                  I love all my gear from my little, low wattage tube combos to my flagship amps, rack units and even my modelling units but I always work better when I just get the sound to function for its purpose and then forget about it. Both my sound taken in individually and the band as a whole just sounds better when I'm not obsessing over gear and tone. Things like good songs, purpose and space in the band, stage presence, good turnouts and giving it my all are more important to me. When you're a working musician playing outside your home town, it's costly to move every big expensive piece of gear you have to make your magical tone so it's beneficial for me to be able to have a more compact rig that I can still get useable sounds out of, borrow other people's gear in each town and be able to get a useable sound out of them. Freighting elusive magical tone gear becomes less of a priority.

                  If I understand Tom Morello's perspective correctly which I think I do because I've read countless interviews of him rephrasing this same philosophy, when he gave up on seeking the 'perfect' tone which was unattainable to him with the gear he had, he just got it to work and never looked back and now that sound is one he can call his own. It's that simple. Some people are taking it way to literally like he needs to throw away his pedalboard if he believes what he says. They can call me stupid all they like but it doesn't change anything.

                  While recording for my side project, I've done things like slaving a Mesa pre straight into the board, EQing and processing it and ending up with a sound with a scrotum the size of Jupiter. On another occasion I ran a companion fuzz... right into the board and it was perfect for the song. I just wouldn't have even thought of that without my reckless abandon.
                  Last edited by El Dunco; 09-16-2016, 12:04 AM.
                  The opinions expressed above do not necessarily represent those of the poster and are to be considered suspect at best.

                  Lead guitarist and vocalist of...



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                  • #69
                    Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                    Originally posted by Beer$ View Post

                    If I understand Tom Morello's perspective correctly which I think I do because I've read countless interviews of him rephrasing this same philosophy, when he gave up on seeking the 'perfect' tone which was unattainable to him with the gear he had, he just got it to work and never looked back and now that sound is one he can call his own. It's that simple. Some people are taking it way to literally like he needs to throw away his pedalboard if he believes what he says. They can call me stupid all they like but it doesn't change anything.
                    I totally understand his point (and yours), and I've thought about this: the reason I like the guitar players I do, is because of phrasing, note choices, touch and so on. Rarely do I like someone because they have "good tone". Good tone is so highly subjective anyway, it's rediculous. And it only works in context!

                    So gear doesn't matter, or impact the music you create as a musician. You play with your touch, sense of melody, energy, note choices and vibrato even if it's a Fender or a Chinese amp at the other end of your guitar cable. That's the "great" thing about music. There is no music with gear only.

                    One here mentioned a mechanic and tools. A mechanic knows how to fix a car with a cheap wrench too. That's what I pay him for. To fix my car. Not his drama queen tendencies that he "can't work without his 2k titanium wrench". Have you ever heard a
                    mechanic use the words "the tools man... the tools doesn't work for me. I can't FEEL it...!" If your dependant on your gear to feel something and play along to/create/play music, your doing it wrong IMO. Are the the gear a tool for you to expression yourself, or are you the tool? (Lol)

                    The only debate were I think gear can matter, or make a difference, are in discussions about functionality or reliability. Then the points are valid.




                    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                    • #70
                      Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                      Originally posted by Dahla View Post
                      I totally understand his point (and yours), and I've thought about this: the reason I like the guitar players I do, is because of phrasing, note choices, touch and so on. Rarely do I like someone because they have "good tone". Good tone is so highly subjective anyway, it's rediculous. And it only works in context!

                      So gear doesn't matter, or impact the music you create as a musician. You play with your touch, sense of melody, energy, note choices and vibrato even if it's a Fender or a Chinese amp at the other end of your guitar cable. That's the "great" thing about music. There is no music with gear only.

                      One here mentioned a mechanic and tools. A mechanic knows how to fix a car with a cheap wrench too. That's what I pay him for. To fix my car. Not his drama queen tendencies that he "can't work without his 2k titanium wrench". Have you ever heard a
                      mechanic use the words "the tools man... the tools doesn't work for me. I can't FEEL it...!" If your dependant on your gear to feel something and play along to/create/play music, your doing it wrong IMO. Are the the gear a tool for you to expression yourself, or are you the tool? (Lol)

                      The only debate were I think gear can matter, or make a difference, are in discussions about functionality or reliability. Then the points are valid.




                      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                      Precisely. The only guitar sounds I don't like are really obviously grating and functionally bad tones or those that are wildly inappropriate for the style (which is a wide margin as it is as there are no rules to how things should sound but things like so little mids I can't hear the actual notes, trying to play too fast with no definition, standing waves that icepick my eardrums). Bands like Nile, Pantera and The Stooge's Raw Power have tones that convey the energy of the music perfectly no matter how bad the boutique fanatic crowd crows on about how sh!tty they sound.
                      The opinions expressed above do not necessarily represent those of the poster and are to be considered suspect at best.

                      Lead guitarist and vocalist of...



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                      • #71
                        Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                        I think gear only matters if you don't have experience or know how to use it. That's not a critique of anyone, just a situation I've observed.

                        To clarify, at one point years back I managed to have the fortunate opportunity to stand in front of a 1968 Marshall 100-watt plexi running full-on into it's matching 4x12 cab in a studio. And having had that experience and memorized that sound, I can now coax nearly that sound out of a whole host of other gear, as near as that gear can get to it. As soon as I hear any rig, I know exactly what knobs need to be turned and where (whether on the guitar or on the amp.) This is directly related to that thread that asked if you can get SRV tones out of a Les Paul. If you have experience making a particular sound, and have that sound in your head, you know how to get it out of other gear as needed.

                        If I didn't have that experience, the only way I would ever get a Marshall Plexi sound would be to buy one. Then the gear would matter.

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                        • #72
                          Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                          Not sure if this is germane,
                          But on the topic of gear doesn't matter, I had a kind of "good gear" sound ****ty once. I was lucky (or not) to have played a few months with Eric Burden of the Animals, right after he left (got fired) War.
                          He had Hendrix's Marshall Stack ( head goosed to 200 watts) and Eric made me play it as it was set up, he claimed he checked all the knobs before he got it after Jimi died.
                          It was dimed on all knobs, at first I thought, wow, with my 68 LP Custom, I'll kill (this was in the 70's). But this amp that Hendrix had coaxed so many beautiful and angry sounds out of I could not make a single note that sounded good to me.
                          I tried changing it when Eric was gone, but I could not do it. The tone to my ears was ****.
                          My Blackface Bassman sounded like Clapton/Mayall and Jimi's Marshall sounded like a 200 watt solid state Acoustic brand.
                          So yeah, in this case, gear mattered, and I was thrilled to go back to my Fender after that band broke up.
                          Stayed with my Bassmen for 20 years and still have it. Now I use a Hot Rod Deluxe, or a Blues Jr., or any tube amp around or between those specs, and I am happy, and don't need any fancy amp or cab to get what sound I hear. I got a small pedal board that I can coax a good sound out of anything now. My gear is set so it no longer matters.
                          So there's half empty, half full for you.
                          Steve B.
                          Last edited by SJ318; 09-16-2016, 02:47 AM.

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                          • #73
                            Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                            I suck the same on whatever I play.. I do agree that gear should be secondary to the player. I do feel more natural and flow better on certain guitars. Most really good players can sound good or get their sound on most anything, but different gear can invoke different moods or feelings and inspire you to play something different.
                            Last edited by BloodRose; 09-16-2016, 02:49 AM.
                            Believe me when I say that some of the most amazing music in history was made on equipment that's not as good as what you own right now.

                            Jol Dantzig

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                            • #74
                              Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                              Originally posted by SJ318 View Post
                              Not sure if this is germane,
                              But on the topic of gear doesn't matter, I had a kind of "good gear" sound ****ty once. I was lucky (or not) to have played a few months with Eric Burden of the Animals, right after he left (got fired) War.
                              He had Hendrix's Marshall Stack ( head goosed to 200 watts) and Eric made me play it as it was set up, he claimed he checked all the knobs before he got it after Jimi died.
                              It was dimed on all knobs, at first I thought, wow, with my 68 LP Custom, I'll kill (this was in the 70's). But this amp that Hendrix had coaxed so many beautiful and angry sounds out of I could not make a single note that sounded good to me.
                              I tried changing it when Eric was gone, but I could not do it. The tone to my ears was ****.
                              My Blackface Bassman sounded like Clapton/Mayall and Jimi's Marshall sounded like a 200 watt solid state Acoustic brand.
                              So yeah, in this case, gear mattered, and I was thrilled to go back to my Fender after that band broke up.
                              Stayed with my Bassmen for 20 years and still have it. Now I use a Hot Rod Deluxe, or a Blues Jr., or any tube amp around or between those specs, and I am happy, and don't need any fancy amp or cab to get what sound I hear. I got a small pedal board that I can coax a good sound out of anything now. My gear is set so it no longer matters.
                              So there's half empty, half full for you.
                              Steve B.
                              That plays into Morello's narrative exactly. It's almost identical to his anecdote.

                              The whole thing can be summed up as "It comes down to you, gear is peripheral". 8 words.
                              Last edited by El Dunco; 09-16-2016, 03:39 AM.
                              The opinions expressed above do not necessarily represent those of the poster and are to be considered suspect at best.

                              Lead guitarist and vocalist of...



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                              • #75
                                Re: Your gear (all of it) does NOT matter !

                                Originally posted by Mr Wolf View Post
                                I don't care if I need them or not. New toys are fun

                                Hell Yes !!!
                                Tele, SG, LP Jr, '76 Ibanez Artist & Tokai LS92 + FUZZ boxes into a '66 AB165 Bassman & 2X12 (55Hz Greenbacks) / '73 Orange OR120 & 2X12 (V30 & SwampThang) / Orange Thunderverb 50 & PPC212 / Marshall Vintage Modern 50 & 2X12 Genz Benz g-Flex / Laney Klipp / Laney AOR Pro Tube 100


                                "...it's a tree with a microphone" - Leslie West

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