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Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

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  • Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

    So im having some issues with my 2 late 80s Charvel Model 3DR. Both are Basswood and have tried many different pickups in them. Both have 500k pots (no tone), one with a Duncan AH1 Holdsworth from the 80s and the other has a Parallel axis distortion. the one with the Holdsworth sounds decent-has some nice mid chunk and solid fairly tight low end but the treble is just blah. Same mostly with the patb distortion-huge low end but the highs are just seem to be muddled compared to a comparable alder body guitar (EX Charvel MIM Pro Mod which sound AMAZING). Is there anything i could do to make these guitar sound less muddy? pots? caps?
    Charvel, Kramer, Gibson, Fender, MIJ/US Epiphone, BC Rich
    Full Shred, Distortion, JB, Custom (Custom), Screamin' Demon, Cool Rails, Alternative 8, Mini Humbucker, Lil 59, 59, APH-1, Black Winter, Silverbird, SP90, PATB1,2,3, YJM, 59/custom hybrid, SSL-1 AH1BJ, Jazz, Antiquity JB/Jazz, Alpha/Omega

  • #2
    Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

    Sure, try 1 meg pots. They usually let a little more highs through compared to 500k.
    Last edited by Clint 55; 01-06-2020, 09:29 PM.
    The things that you wanted
    I bought them for you

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    • #3
      Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

      I have a basswood guitar (Ibanez RG) that i gave up on a couple years back after several pickup changes could not resolve the same "muted highs/treble" issue that i had with the guitar. I even tried 1 Meg pots. The 1 meg pots certainly added more treble, but it didn't add the key frequencies that my ears felt were missing. I wish you better luck than i had.
      This seems to be an inherent aspect of basswood's tonal
      character vs just that particular guitar, because descriptions of basswood on websites that describe basswood's tonal properties frequently describe the highs as muted or softened.
      Last edited by Jack_TriPpEr; 01-06-2020, 10:18 PM.
      Sanford: "The hardest part about tone chasing is losing the expectations associated with the hardware."

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      • #4
        Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

        Before swapping the pot, wire the pickup straight to the jack and see what the sound does. It'll be almost the same as having a 1Meg pot.

        However, there are other factors to consider. Do the basswood Charvels have steel OFRs, the Jackson made-by-Schaller trems, Kahlers, JT-6s, or what? What about the trem posts? Original or better?

        Also, if your rig's EQ is set for the poplar/alder tone, the basswood is going to sound different for a reason.

        Basswood guitars can sound great, but will sound different from other woods of a different density. Basswood is soft, whereas poplar/alder are harder, and thus have a similar tone, which is why they can be interchanged with minimal tonal difference.

        I've had quite a few basswood guitars over the years, as well as alder, poplar, mahogany, maple, ash, and aluminum. Everything sounds different, and you can't use the same EQ settings on everything.

        Bridges of "lesser" materials like a Lo-TRS import trem or a Jackson JT-580/580LP will give basswood guitars a sort of "Surfing with the Alien tone" (less bass, less ultra-highs, focused on the low-mids to upper mids vocal quality), whereas a genuine Schaller-made OFR with a solid baseplate will be somewhat high-endy. The Schaller-made Jackson JT-590 bridge with the inserts in the pivots will make them sound darker as well, with more bass than the Lo-TRS, and with a bit more high-end rolloff.

        As well, I don't recall the Holdsworth being a bright pickup, and the PATB3 has a ceramic magnet. The tones you're used to out of your MIM Charvels (assuming stock pickups) is Alnico based.

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        • #5
          Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

          Originally posted by Newcenstein View Post
          Before swapping the pot, wire the pickup straight to the jack and see what the sound does. It'll be almost the same as having a 1Meg pot.

          However, there are other factors to consider. Do the basswood Charvels have steel OFRs, the Jackson made-by-Schaller trems, Kahlers, JT-6s, or what? What about the trem posts? Original or better?

          Also, if your rig's EQ is set for the poplar/alder tone, the basswood is going to sound different for a reason.

          Basswood guitars can sound great, but will sound different from other woods of a different density. Basswood is soft, whereas poplar/alder are harder, and thus have a similar tone, which is why they can be interchanged with minimal tonal difference.

          I've had quite a few basswood guitars over the years, as well as alder, poplar, mahogany, maple, ash, and aluminum. Everything sounds different, and you can't use the same EQ settings on everything.

          Bridges of "lesser" materials like a Lo-TRS import trem or a Jackson JT-580/580LP will give basswood guitars a sort of "Surfing with the Alien tone" (less bass, less ultra-highs, focused on the low-mids to upper mids vocal quality), whereas a genuine Schaller-made OFR with a solid baseplate will be somewhat high-endy. The Schaller-made Jackson JT-590 bridge with the inserts in the pivots will make them sound darker as well, with more bass than the Lo-TRS, and with a bit more high-end rolloff.

          As well, I don't recall the Holdsworth being a bright pickup, and the PATB3 has a ceramic magnet. The tones you're used to out of your MIM Charvels (assuming stock pickups) is Alnico based.

          The 3DR with the Holdsworth has a JT-6 with big brass block. the other has been retrofitted with a Floyd 1000 with Floyd studs with big brass block. My MIM Charvels, 4 have A5 (Custom 5, JB(2) PATB1) and the other has a PATB Distortion. I really like how these Basswood guitars look and play (one is an orange crackle model) so getting a good tone would be very beneficial.
          Charvel, Kramer, Gibson, Fender, MIJ/US Epiphone, BC Rich
          Full Shred, Distortion, JB, Custom (Custom), Screamin' Demon, Cool Rails, Alternative 8, Mini Humbucker, Lil 59, 59, APH-1, Black Winter, Silverbird, SP90, PATB1,2,3, YJM, 59/custom hybrid, SSL-1 AH1BJ, Jazz, Antiquity JB/Jazz, Alpha/Omega

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          • #6
            Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

            I have an '87. Duncan Custom.

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            • #7
              Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

              You didn't specify what pickups you've had in them.

              Maybe try a lower output / more trebley humbuckers?
              "So understand/Don't waste your time always searching for those wasted years/Face up, make your stand/And realize you're living in the golden years"
              Iron Maiden - Wasted Years

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              • #8
                Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone





                87' Basswood here. Outstanding guitar. Had a 3DR back in 87' as well.

                Try an EMG-81 or TB-5 Duncan Custom.

                No worse feeling than buying/swappin pups only to find they sound like crap.

                FWIW Ibanez JEM's are Basswood, there's a reason Vai chose Basswood.
                Last edited by JMP/HBE; 01-07-2020, 05:47 AM.

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                • #9
                  Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

                  I had quite a journey trying to get some old Basswood Charvels and Ibanez Iceman to sound good. The pickups I found that respond very well in Basswood: SD Screaming Demon, DMZ Liquifire and Bill Lawrence L500s.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

                    I had a basswood RG that loved the DD. It did round out the highs just a lil bit but think that helped out a little bit to make it not as fizzy or ice pickish.
                    1994 Ibanez IC500 Iceman reissue
                    Jackson Soloist 7 string
                    ESP LTD M-400
                    Original Marshall Silver Jubilee 2553

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                    • #11
                      Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

                      Basswood as a tone wood developed during the 80's first from a Charvel guitar Alan Holdsworth had built for him, and secondly it was observed that basswood counteracted the thinner, brighter, tone caused by locking tremolo systems.

                      However, there's a couple things not generally known about Holdsworth's basswood Charvels. One is that Holdsworth's vintage style tremolos had aluminum blocks. A big brass block Floyd in basswood is double attenuating the highs. It's fine in alder or maple, though. The other is that Holdsworth used vintage output, PAF type, humbuckers in his own Charvels. The AH Sig pickup is like 17K in keeping with the popular high output trend back in the day for the greater market. A 59 with an A5 is probably better a pickup match for basswood here.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

                        When it comes to a good basswood guitar, I've always found DiMarzios to work better in them. Had a killer Fender Contemporary Tele from the 80's and every Duncan I tried was just off. Then I tossed in Super Distortions and that fixed it right up. The neck was wired in parallel.

                        Vai's #1 Jem is actually alder (The $3k model). The lower priced models are basswood.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

                          Originally posted by Lake Placid Blues View Post
                          Basswood as a tone wood developed during the 80's first from a Charvel guitar Alan Holdsworth had built for him, and secondly it was observed that basswood counteracted the thinner, brighter, tone caused by locking tremolo systems.

                          However, there's a couple things not generally known about Holdsworth's basswood Charvels. One is that Holdsworth's vintage style tremolos had aluminum blocks. A big brass block Floyd in basswood is double attenuating the highs. It's fine in alder or maple, though. The other is that Holdsworth used vintage output, PAF type, humbuckers in his own Charvels. The AH Sig pickup is like 17K in keeping with the popular high output trend back in the day for the greater market. A 59 with an A5 is probably better a pickup match for basswood here.




                          I have no issues with a BBB in my Charvel using a 20 yr old EMG-81, but ive not tried this with passives. I bought an EMG Zakk set for my Les Paul Custom and didn't like it at all, very cold/sterile sounding but this 20 yr old 81 screams in this Model 2. I did have to modify the trem cavity to accommodate the Brass Block removing about an 1/8 inch of Basswood so it would fit flush. Only tool i had was a jigsaw which i wasn't crazy about. I had one chance to get it right and i did but i don't recommend taking power tools to your 32 yr old Charvels unless you can hack it. You can see the huge difference in size and thats an early 80's Original Floyd. And thats not the biggest sized Brass Block available either.
                          Last edited by JMP/HBE; 01-07-2020, 12:08 PM.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

                            I doubt switching pots will make much of a difference, but try wiring the pickup straight to the output jack to see. Otherwise you're likely better off changing pickups.

                            If you want high output pickups, I'd recommend trying a dimarzio evolution. Lots of harmonics. Definitely not a dull sounding pickup.

                            If the compression is part of the problem, try something lower output like a Fred.

                            It seems like a lot of the older dimarzios often work better in basswood.

                            Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk

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                            • #15
                              Re: Basswood Charvels-cant get a decent tone

                              "Vai's #1 Jem is actually alder (The $3k model)."

                              Depends on the year of JEM. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibanez_JEM the current made JEM's are alder made in Indonesia cuz i almost bought one but couldn't justify the cost because there is no resale value in a $2.2K Indonesian guitar.



                              I worked with that JEM seller for 2 weeks. Turns out he had a drug problem & wasn't making good choices. I had the chance to buy his $2.2K JEM for $800 but could not justify taking advantage of his situation. I take no comfort screwing people.

                              Ive wanted a JEM since they came out. Maybe some other time.
                              Last edited by JMP/HBE; 01-07-2020, 01:15 PM.

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