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Anti-Scales

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  • #16
    Re: Anti-Scales

    Mincer's tonal pallet is just fine.
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    • #17
      Re: Anti-Scales

      Originally posted by Obsessive Compulsive View Post
      You got problem sounding outside? Maybe you should do Bon Jovi covers. I would take advantage of that D# as a passing note along with D.

      It's a matter of arrangement and what your brain is comfortable with.

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      There is a difference between sounding outside, and sounding like you don't know what you are doing. Passing tones are not part of the scale. If you just use them as passing tones, you aren't using the scale properly. I want to hear how you are using this.
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      • #18
        Re: Anti-Scales

        Originally posted by Jacew View Post
        Anti
        Hey, you said it. This is actually an ostinato and chromatics.

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        • #19
          Re: Anti-Scales

          Originally posted by Mincer View Post
          There is a difference between sounding outside, and sounding like you don't know what you are doing. Passing tones are not part of the scale. If you just use them as passing tones, you aren't using the scale properly. I want to hear how you are using this.
          Do I sound like I don't know what I am doing? That obvious? Lol...

          Playing certain modes over a natural major/ minor already makes you sound 'outside'; you are just so accustomed to certain notes they sound 'natural'.

          There are 12 notes in a scale, it's a shame to stick to standard notes and risk sounding like everybody else. You want to know how I use it? I use the flatted ninth to create tension as resolving to tonic in V7-I progression (altered dominant scale).

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          • #20
            Re: Anti-Scales

            Originally posted by Mincer View Post
            If you are doing I IV V in A, and you play in A lydian...if you get to the D chord, you'd have to avoid the D# or bend it. That isn't playing in A lydian anymore.
            Sorry, I should've been more specific: it was a I-V-IV progression in the key of E. So I was playing E Lydian over E - B - A.

            And I guess I misremembered (it was 25 years ago) - over an A chord, the D# is a sharp 4th, so bending up a half step did resolve the dissonance but it was resolving to the 5th, not 9th. Of course over the B chord E Lydian behaves like a regular major scale.

            I stayed in mode, but it was not without moments of dissonance - that was the intent.

            EDIT: And the A# bent up to B was like the add9 for the A chord (I knew I remembered an add9 option in there somewhere).
            Last edited by eclecticsynergy; 02-25-2020, 02:49 PM.
            .
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            .

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            • #21
              Re: Anti-Scales

              Originally posted by Obsessive Compulsive View Post
              Do I sound like I don't know what I am doing? That obvious? Lol...

              Playing certain modes over a natural major/ minor already makes you sound 'outside'; you are just so accustomed to certain notes they sound 'natural'.

              There are 12 notes in a scale, it's a shame to stick to standard notes and risk sounding like everybody else. You want to know how I use it? I use the flatted ninth to create tension as resolving to tonic in V7-I progression (altered dominant scale).
              Yeah but not all music takes well to chromaticism. You have to be smart about how you use it. Jazz is obvious. Metal actually isn't that chromatic and is pretty structured around pentatonic and minor lol!
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              • #22
                Re: Anti-Scales

                Originally posted by Clint 55 View Post
                Yeah but not all music takes well to chromaticism. You have to be smart about how you use it. Jazz is obvious. Metal actually isn't that chromatic and is pretty structured around pentatonic and minor lol!
                You the authority on metal? Lol..

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                • #23
                  Re: Anti-Scales

                  Modes sound the way they do because of the chords in back of them, and the relationship between the notes and chords. To hear how the lydian mode sounds (and it shouldn't sound dissonant at all), try it over E/B and F#/B chords.
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                  • #24
                    Re: Anti-Scales

                    Originally posted by Obsessive Compulsive View Post
                    You the authority on metal? Lol..
                    It's just an opinion of mine that metal isn't that chromatic. With jazz, you can start with 12 tones to your hearts content as long as you relate it melodically and harmonically.
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                    • #25
                      Re: Anti-Scales

                      Living Colour always did some chromatic lead stuff . . . although maybe it was more hard rock than metal.
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                      • #26
                        Re: Anti-Scales

                        Originally posted by Mincer View Post
                        Modes sound the way they do because of the chords in back of them, and the relationship between the notes and chords. To hear how the lydian mode sounds (and it shouldn't sound dissonant at all), try it over E/B and F#/B chords.
                        Exactly...the player needs to play the scale(s) that the chord progression dictates...not the other way around. It’s like trying to stuff a square peg into a round home when you do that.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Anti-Scales

                          Originally posted by Clint 55 View Post
                          It's just an opinion of mine that metal isn't that chromatic. With jazz, you can start with 12 tones to your hearts content as long as you relate it melodically and harmonically.
                          Actually I didn't mean to chromaticize everything or use all 12 notes, but to NOT stick to the standard form.

                          There are a lot of metal with chromatics, mainly the progressive ones. Tony Macalpine and Derek Sherenian are good example...and those other Dream Theater derivatives/ associates.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Anti-Scales

                            BTW, there are a ton of mode based blogs here on the SD site for anyone wanting to learn more about them. I wrote them, and tried to explain everything in a very clear way.
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                            • #29
                              Re: Anti-Scales

                              The whole half dimished scale is pretty anti. What the eff chord fits into that? Besides diminished. 1,2,b3,4,b5,#5,6,7.
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                              • #30
                                Re: Anti-Scales

                                Originally posted by Clint 55 View Post
                                The whole half dimished scale is pretty anti. What the eff chord fits into that? Besides diminished. 1,2,b3,4,b5,#5,6,7.
                                Study the turnaround in the Miles Davis tune 'All Blues'.
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