Likes Likes:  0
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 26

Thread: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    I have recently installed 2 juggernaut pickups and am wanting to put in a 5way switch with a push pull coil tap. Only problem is I can not find a diagram for it. Does anyone have a diagram or is this even possible to do? Thanks

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  2. #2
    Ultimate Tone Slacker TheViewFromVenus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    North Carolina
    Age
    28
    Posts
    2,100

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    What do want the 5 way switch to do exactly?

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheViewFromVenus View Post
    What do want the 5 way switch to do exactly?
    Would like it to be like the Ibanez RG 5 way setup. I want to have the option of getting series and parallel and just split the bridge pick up

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  4. #4
    Administrator Mincer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Tampa Bay area, Florida, USA
    Posts
    25,899

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Is the push pull splitting or tapping those pickups? I am not familiar with them.
    Dave, Ambassador/Writer/Artist for Seymour Duncan

    My Guitar, Gear, and Music Webpage

    Gear pics and more on my Instagram.

  5. #5
    Ultimate Tone Slacker TheViewFromVenus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    North Carolina
    Age
    28
    Posts
    2,100

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    I think he just wants to split the bridge pickup in addition to the 5 way wiring.

  6. #6
    Administrator Mincer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Tampa Bay area, Florida, USA
    Posts
    25,899

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Oh gotcha, then it isn't 'tapping' at all.
    Dave, Ambassador/Writer/Artist for Seymour Duncan

    My Guitar, Gear, and Music Webpage

    Gear pics and more on my Instagram.

  7. #7
    Super Toneologist Jack_TriPpEr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    The Regal Beagle in Hippie Hell
    Posts
    1,323

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    Would like it to be like the Ibanez RG 5 way setup. I want to have the option of getting series and parallel and just split the bridge pick up

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    BossRoss,

    I would be glad to draw up a diagram for you but I would need more clarification about what you want in each of the 5 positions. Like, when you say getting series and parallel, is that just for the bridge or both pickups?
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    Good diagram Shadowfire90, but it isn't what the OP wants.

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
    BossRoss,

    I would be glad to draw up a diagram for you but I would need more clarification about what you want in each of the 5 positions. Like, when you say getting series and parallel, is that just for the bridge or both pickups?
    I would like to have it like this with coil tapping in the bridge.

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    I would like to have it like this with coil tapping in the bridge.

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    My pickups have 4 wires also I believe this diagram shows 2 for each pickup

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    My pickups have 4 wires also I believe this diagram shows 2 for each pickup

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    Also I have a CTS DPDT push pull pot if that makes any difference

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  11. #11
    Super Toneologist Jack_TriPpEr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    The Regal Beagle in Hippie Hell
    Posts
    1,323

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    I would like to have it like this with coil tapping in the bridge.

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    The pickup selector switch in that diagram is a specialized superswitch, the 3PS1SC5. Read my reply to another recent thread that gives an explanation about that switch, here: https://forum.seymourduncan.com/show...=1#post4397649


    Another clarification question: when you say you want the series and parallel options for the neck, and to add a coilsplit for the bridge, does that mean you are willing to do away with the current Position 2 combination of split coils from both pickups, and make Position 2 be just the coilsplit Bridge pickup? Or no, you want to keep Positon 2 and all the other 4 as-is? The latter means that you would need a push-pull pot to split that bridge humbucker.

    I assume your guitar is an Ibanez? What make and model?
    Last edited by Jack_TriPpEr; 03-24-2020 at 11:34 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    Good diagram Shadowfire90, but it isn't what the OP wants.

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
    The pickup selector switch in that diagram is a specialized superswitch, the 3PS1SC5. Read my reply to another recent thread that gives an explanation about that switch, here: https://forum.seymourduncan.com/show...=1#post4397649


    Another clarification question: when you say you want the series and parallel options for the neck, and to add a coilsplit for the bridge, does that mean you are willing to do away with the current Position 2 combination of split coils from both pickups, and make Position 2 be just the coilsplit Bridge pickup? Or no, you want to keep Positon 2 and all the other 4 as-is? The latter means that you would need a push-pull pot to split that bridge humbucker.

    I assume your guitar is an Ibanez? What make and model?
    I want to keep all positions and just coil split the bridge with the push pull. I have an LTD M-17 with Bareknuckle Juggernauts.

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  13. #13
    Super Toneologist Jack_TriPpEr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    The Regal Beagle in Hippie Hell
    Posts
    1,323

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    I want to keep all positions and just coil split the bridge with the push pull. I have an LTD M-17 with Bareknuckle Juggernauts.

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    Ok, thanks for the clarification. Later today I will study the schematic of the 3PS1SC5 switch to determine if it supports a mod like that. I am pretty sure it does, but I just want to be sure. If it does not, we could use another type of superswitch. Other types of superswitches like the Ibanez VLX91 and the Dimarzio superswitch will definitely support this mod because they are more flexible in how they can be wired compared to the 3PS1SC5. If you read the info in that link in my last reply, it covered this.

    ... OR... we could skip ahead to a plan that uses one of the other superswitches, not the 3PS1SC5. That would be my recommendation actually. Because if in the future you decide you want to change the wiring combinations to something else, the other superswitch types will definitely support that whereas the restrictive design of the 3PS1SC5 may not. The trade off is that the other superswitch types are $10 - $20 higher in cost than the 3PS1SC5.

    The VLX91 has an advantage over the Dimarzio EP1112 in that has a small footprint - this is needed in thin bodied guitars that don't have enough height to physcially fit the tall Dimarzio EP1112 switch. I recommend you measure the height availabilty in your guitar's control cavity b4 considering the Dimarzio EP1112. The height measurement of the Dimarzio EP1112 switch is 31mm.

    Also note that one detraction of the VLX91 is that its lugs are small and tightly bunched - so it can be difficult to solder onto accurately.

    The Parts page at IbanezRules.com indicates that they have the VLX91 and the 3PS1SC5 switches in stock, You can check the prices there. Rich runs that site and he is a good guy to work with. The Dimarzio EP1112 is carried by Guitar Center, etc.

    Link:
    http://www.ibanezrules.com/parts.htm

    Let me know which switch type you want to move forward with. The diagram required will be different depending on which of the 3 switches you choose.

    Name:  images.jpeg
Views: 77
Size:  6.1 KB

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20200325_141009.jpg 
Views:	15 
Size:	43.6 KB 
ID:	103883

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	image_125529.jpg 
Views:	14 
Size:	55.7 KB 
ID:	103884
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    Good diagram Shadowfire90, but it isn't what the OP wants.

  14. #14
    Super Toneologist Jack_TriPpEr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    The Regal Beagle in Hippie Hell
    Posts
    1,323

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    I want to keep all positions and just coil split the bridge with the push pull. I have an LTD M-17 with Bareknuckle Juggernauts.

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    Just bookmarking for myself a link to the specs and description of your guitar:

    https://www.espguitars.com/products/...string-guitars
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    Good diagram Shadowfire90, but it isn't what the OP wants.

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
    Ok, thanks for the clarification. Later today I will study the schematic of the 3PS1SC5 switch to determine if it supports a mod like that. I am pretty sure it does, but I just want to be sure. If it does not, we could use another type of superswitch. Other types of superswitches like the Ibanez VLX91 and the Dimarzio superswitch will definitely support this mod because they are more flexible in how they can be wired compared to the 3PS1SC5. If you read the info in that link in my last reply, it covered this.

    ... OR... we could skip ahead to a plan that uses one of the other superswitches, not the 3PS1SC5. That would be my recommendation actually. Because if in the future you decide you want to change the wiring combinations to something else, the other superswitch types will definitely support that whereas the restrictive design of the 3PS1SC5 may not. The trade off is that the other superswitch types are $10 - $20 higher in cost than the 3PS1SC5.

    The VLX91 has an advantage over the Dimarzio EP1112 in that has a small footprint - this is needed in thin bodied guitars that don't have enough height to physcially fit the tall Dimarzio EP1112 switch. I recommend you measure the height availabilty in your guitar's control cavity b4 considering the Dimarzio EP1112. The height measurement of the Dimarzio EP1112 switch is 31mm.

    Also note that one detraction of the VLX91 is that its lugs are small and tightly bunched - so it can be difficult to solder onto accurately.

    The Parts page at IbanezRules.com indicates that they have the VLX91 and the 3PS1SC5 switches in stock, You can check the prices there. Rich runs that site and he is a good guy to work with. The Dimarzio EP1112 is carried by Guitar Center, etc.

    Link:
    http://www.ibanezrules.com/parts.htm

    Let me know which switch type you want to move forward with. The diagram required will be different depending on which of the 3 switches you choose.

    Name:  images.jpeg
Views: 77
Size:  6.1 KB

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20200325_141009.jpg 
Views:	15 
Size:	43.6 KB 
ID:	103883

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	image_125529.jpg 
Views:	14 
Size:	55.7 KB 
ID:	103884
    Awesome man thanks. Will get the EP1112. I have a deep cavity in the m17. Also I used the Ibanez RG7620 diagram to hook up my switch and tried the bareknuckle 5 way diagram. Also tried an iron gear diagram just to see. But ultimately in every scenario I end up with the 5th position not working? Coil tap works but not in the position I want. So yeah I will get a superswitch

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Also just to clarify the switch is an aftermarket 5 way switch. Not what came in the guitar. Will post a picture later

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  17. #17
    Super Toneologist Jack_TriPpEr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    The Regal Beagle in Hippie Hell
    Posts
    1,323

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    I would like to have it like this with coil tapping in the bridge.

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    Awesome man thanks. Will get the EP1112....
    I've begun working up a diagram for you that uses the EP1112 switch and realized I forgot to ask:

    ... is one of your two Juggernaut humbuckers "Reverse Wound & Reverse Polarity" (RWRP)? If yes, which one?

    This will make a difference in how Position 2 (which is one coil from each pickup connected in parallel) needs to be wired *IF* you want the sound/output in that position to be hum-canceling (and I assume you do). I will spare further details and explanation until I hear back with your answer.

    Thanks
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    Good diagram Shadowfire90, but it isn't what the OP wants.

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    52

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
    I've begun working up a diagram for you that uses the EP1112 switch and realized I forgot to ask:

    ... is one of your two Juggernaut humbuckers "Reverse Wound & Reverse Polarity" (RWRP)? If yes, which one?

    This will make a difference in how Position 2 (which is one coil from each pickup connected in parallel) needs to be wired *IF* you want the sound/output in that position to be hum-canceling (and I assume you do). I will spare further details and explanation until I hear back with your answer.

    Thanks
    I do not believe they are. Does not mention anything in the paper work I have for the .is there a way to test for that?

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk

  19. #19
    Super Toneologist Jack_TriPpEr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    The Regal Beagle in Hippie Hell
    Posts
    1,323

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    I do not believe they are. Does not mention anything in the paper work I have for the .is there a way to test for that?

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    There is a way to test if you have a multi-meter (?).

    Although it's almost always the case that you don't get one out of the pair as RWRP unless you requested it. [Edit] And the paperwork would have mentioned it...
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    Good diagram Shadowfire90, but it isn't what the OP wants.

  20. #20
    Super Toneologist Jack_TriPpEr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    The Regal Beagle in Hippie Hell
    Posts
    1,323

    Default Re: 5 Way switch with Push-pull? 2hum?

    Quote Originally Posted by BossRoss View Post
    I do not believe they are. Does not mention anything in the paper work I have for the .is there a way to test for that?

    Sent from my E6833 using Tapatalk
    Ok, so without either pup being RWRP and assuming you want the Position 2 combination to be hum-canceling, then you have two options with those pups.

    First, before describing the two options, i need to explain the reason for why special action is required here. In order to have hum-canceling when two coils are combined, one of the two must have a different magnetic polarity from the other (North vs South) *and* it also must be wound in the opposite direction from the other. Next look at this pic that shows the magnetic polarity of each of the four coils in two typical humbuckers where neither is RWRP.

    Name:  20200329_145723.jpg
Views: 53
Size:  47.7 KB

    Note that if one wants to have the two inner coils active in Position 2, there will be 60 cycle hum because the two inner coils are the same magnetic polarity (North).

    *If* one of the pickups was RWRP, the inner coil of that pickup would have South magnetic polarity and there would be no issue.

    So, for two pickups where neither is RWRP, there are two options:

    Option 1. This is my recommended option out of the 2, FYI. Wire the coilsplit on the Bridge pickup so that its South coil is active in Position 2, and then also reinstall that pickup in the mounting ring so it is rotated 180 - in order to physically move that South coil to the inner position. I looked at pics of Juggernaut pickups and saw that each coil has screws, vs 1 having slugs and 1 having screws. So visual/aesthestic impact should be neglible. Should also be neglible if you have covers on your pickups. However, if you have the version with Misha Mansoor's custom image printed on the pickup cover, I can understand this rotation business being a concern.

    Option 2. You or a tech you hire could partially disassemble your Bridge pickup to get at the magnets that sit at the bottom and flip them upside down, which changes the polarity of each of the two coils. There is some risk (not large, but some) that you may damage the pickup if you are not careful in doing this. You can watch how-to videos on Youtube about this and determine if you feel comfortable doing it yourself and/or you feel comfortable having a tech do it.

    Option 1 can technically be done on either pickup, but I am recommending the bridge pickup in this case just because of the other pre-existing wiring complexities involved with the Neck pickup due it needing to do parallel-with-itself mode in Position 4.


    Of course, if hum-canceling in Position 2 isn't important to you and/or rhe idea of living with some hum is ok compared to what you deem is too much hassle requirdd in the options above, then we can wire the guitar to split the inner coils as-is for Position 2 and you will just live with the hum that comes with doing that. You are going to have hum anyways when you have your Bridge coilsplit using the push-pull switch... by itself in Position 1 and Position 3 when combined with the full neck humbucker.

    I guess another option could be to acquire one RWRP Juggernaut to replace one of your current two.

    Let me know how you want to proceed.
    Last edited by Jack_TriPpEr; 03-29-2020 at 12:40 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarDoc View Post
    Good diagram Shadowfire90, but it isn't what the OP wants.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •