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Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

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  • #16
    Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

    Originally posted by LostTheTone View Post
    You're right of course, and in truth all I really want is a high output pickup that stays tight in that lower tuning.

    Even worse, just about everything is in the same kind of price range - Just expensive enough that I want to get my money's worth. If there was any pickup for a few bucks less and also pretty good then I'd have a decision.
    You can of course grab a Duncan Distortion or Duncan Custom, they're cheaper and many dudes swear by them. You may like them or not but then you can narrow down your choice better. Also, don't hesitate to look for deals on Reverb or Ebay. I bought my Parallel Axis on ebay and never looked back

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    • #17
      Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

      Have you listened to the Keith Merrow demo of all the Seymour Duncan high output pickups on YouTube? If not, that should be your first step. It's the best pickup comparison out there IMO.

      The differences between some of the pickups you're considering are pretty stark there, notably the Nazgul, which takes the upper-mid/treble sizzle of the Distortion but shifts it down to the mids, then cuts off the rest of the eq response so it sounds really focused. The word chainsaw is used a lot to describe it.

      I have a Distortion in my D standard / Drop C guitar and I have a bit of a love/hate relationship with it. The mids have a nice aggressive barking quality to them that you definitely don't get with EMGs (I tried both the 81 and 57 in this same guitar). It's just compressed enough to help your picking sound consistent on chugging riffs (which was a problem I had with the dimarzio evolution, which highlights every nuance), but not compressed to the point of being boring like the 81. The upper mid sizzle is both a good thing and a bad thing though, since it's tough to dial out and it sacrifices some clarity on faster runs or chords.

      For chugging metal rhythm that's not too technical, a Distortion would be my recommendation. It's great for what it does. It's a classic for a reason.

      Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk

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      • #18
        Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

        Originally posted by bigcupholder View Post
        The differences between some of the pickups you're considering are pretty stark there
        It occurs to me that I am framing the question the wrong way. So, yes all these various things sound different (mostly in ways I can't quite describe, but can hear if I try) but are any of them bad? Is someone with a somewhat uneducated tone palette like myself going to be disappointed with any of these?

        If I'm not going to be disappointed by the cheaper options then I can slim it down to a Distortion, a JB or maybe an EMG-81. Any of those are more plausible choices to put into my underutilized Les Paul if I eventually go to something more overtly metal, so at least I'll always have a use for them.

        If I AM going to be disappointed by more mainstream choices, then that pushes me up to something more expensive, but then I want to be really quite sure that it is what I want.

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        • #19
          Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

          I'm sure you can find something you will like in the "mainstream" choices. Watch the video I posted (and that bigcupholder also pointed out) - it's incredibly useful to get a side-by-side comparison of tone. Even if the pickups won't sound exactly the same in your guitar and through your amp you will get an idea of the characteristics of each of them - which push mids,which push highs, etc.

          Listen to the JB and the Distortion in the video and make your call. Even with a limited tone palette, "tone" is still a very personal thing. So listen between your short list and go with whichever seems to be your personal fave. There's not a wrong choice - but there are certainly choices that will make YOU happier that someone else might not enjoy. I wish you luck!

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          • #20
            Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

            Originally posted by RexRemus View Post
            Listen to the JB and the Distortion in the video and make your call.
            I have done so now and, well, they sound good. They all sound good to me though, which I suppose underlines that I don't really need to overthink this.

            As a final question - No love at all for Invaders or Dimebuckers in this setting? I mean, they sound alright to me on the demo (admittedly not with good headphones) but no-one has mentioned either of them at all.

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            • #21
              Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

              Of the two, I might lean towards Invaders, but again, yeah, just trust YOUR gut, and go

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              • #22
                Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                i've had great results with the Invader in drop C, i'm gonna vote for that or the Distortion. also had great results with EMG 81 in drop C

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                • #23
                  Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                  Originally posted by LostTheTone View Post
                  It occurs to me that I am framing the question the wrong way. So, yes all these various things sound different (mostly in ways I can't quite describe, but can hear if I try) but are any of them bad? Is someone with a somewhat uneducated tone palette like myself going to be disappointed with any of these?

                  If I'm not going to be disappointed by the cheaper options then I can slim it down to a Distortion, a JB or maybe an EMG-81. Any of those are more plausible choices to put into my underutilized Les Paul if I eventually go to something more overtly metal, so at least I'll always have a use for them.

                  If I AM going to be disappointed by more mainstream choices, then that pushes me up to something more expensive, but then I want to be really quite sure that it is what I want.
                  None of the mainstream options are bad, just different. Most of the greatest guitar tones ever recorded were done with Seymour Duncan or Dimarzio pickups, not insanely expensive boutique stuff.

                  I still recommend the Distortion. The bass on the JB might be too loose for drop C and the EMG 81 can be polarizing. Neither would be a disappointment, but I think you'd like the Distortion more. The Distortion could convincingly cover every type of metal. If your goal is metal, without any more specific requirements, the Distortion is the easy answer.

                  The Distortion also kicks ass in a Les Paul btw, should you ever move it there.

                  Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk

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                  • #24
                    Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                    To wrap this thread up - I have bitten the bullet and bought a Distortion.

                    After a long night of trying, I couldn't find anyone who said this was a bad idea just that perhaps others might be slightly more optimal. Good enough for me.

                    Another factor was that, as a mainstream pickup, people actually have Distortions in stock to buy off the shelf. Not the greatest way to make decisions, but I haven't found anyone who has Black Winter of Nazgul TBs on anything other than a "special order only" basis. Ditto for EMG-81s; if I want a black chrome one then I pay more and estimated delivery is 30 days or more. This is my lockdown project, and I want to play it before people start growling at me for working from home.

                    Also the Distortion TB was, frankly, outrageously priced at £69, half of what BKP would charge, and more than a third cheaper than a Black Winter or Nazgul. I can hear the difference between the more expensive ones and the Distortion, but just "different" not necessarily better. The Distortion sounds great and doesn't burn a hole in my pocket, and as mentioned I can get more mile out of it if I ever want to change it out.

                    Sounds pretty good to me.

                    If anyone is interested, my moment of clarity came on browsing a store's webshop, looking to see if they even listed BW Trembuckers. They did, but on the same page they had two pickup EMG sets listed for not that much more than the single BW. I'm not actually in the market for a Het-Set or matched 81/85 set at the moment (I just put an invader in my explorer, as you recall) but it's a bit off putting to see one single pickup in a similar price range, especially when it is "different not better".

                    So, the decision is made, and now I can also bank £30 quid into my audio interface fund. Not a bad day all told.

                    And now I am going to my parent's garage to spray the clearcoat onto my body and complete (ish - I will need black tuners at some point) the fitting and finishing. Should be cured just in time for the Distortion to be delivered.

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                    • #25
                      Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                      Originally posted by LostTheTone View Post
                      To wrap this thread up - I have bitten the bullet and bought a Distortion.

                      I can hear the difference between the more expensive ones and the Distortion, but just "different" not necessarily better. The Distortion sounds great and doesn't burn a hole in my pocket, and as mentioned I can get more mile out of it if I ever want to change it out.

                      Sounds pretty good to me.
                      Keep in mind that pickup comparisons like the one from Keith Merrow only show you the differences within one setup (guitar, amp, eq etc.). If "modern" expensive pickups sound better in them maybe it's because SD wants them to sound better after all.

                      That being said, I think Distortion will work great in your guitar. Congratulations on your purchase.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                        Originally posted by BleedingFingertips View Post
                        Keep in mind that pickup comparisons like the one from Keith Merrow only show you the differences within one setup (guitar, amp, eq etc.). If "modern" expensive pickups sound better in them maybe it's because SD wants them to sound better after all.
                        I think there is definitely a lot of truth to quietly ensuring the newer (to me anyway - I've been out of the loop a long time!) pickups sound great. No-one launches a product and says "Well, the old one is everything you want, but you people have short attention spans so here is a new name!"

                        Of course set up does matter a lot. If you tweak for long enough you can make most anything sound solid, but I asked myself if the Distortion is going to be working with me or against me; could I make a good sound with it or not?

                        Now, I don't know if it my "perfect" pickup, in part because I don't really know what my perfect sound is. But it seems that I can make this one sound good. I definitely don't think I would appreciate the boosted upper mids on the Nazgul - It'd sound "good", but not necessarily more or less perfect for what I want.

                        When I started the woodworking side of this projects (6ish weeks ago - sanding through a finish is hard man) I was convinced that I was going to put an Aftermath into this guitar. I'm sure it would have sounded good too. But as you've seen I have slowly talked myself down to something that "just works".

                        It has been a few weeks since I put an invader in my explorer, replacing the non-f-spaced EMG-HZ (teenage me did not make wise pickup decisions). In that case I dropped the pick up in, said " That sounds great" and didn't even touch the dials. In time I have played around a little. But just having a much more appropriate pickup was enough to sound good. Something else might be better, but it sounded good. It still does. I'm keeping it.

                        I think I'm going to have a similar experience here. Not a lot of tweaking, and sounding good.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                          Good luck with the project, Distortion will absolutely do the job and is a great all-around pick.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                            With all the talk here, I wanna see the before and after spray pics. This sounds like it will be an awesome guitar.
                            Administrator of the SDUGF

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                            • #29
                              Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                              Originally posted by Mincer View Post
                              With all the talk here, I wanna see the before and after spray pics. This sounds like it will be an awesome guitar.
                              Your wish is my command - The body is still hanging up to dry at my parents, so after will have to wait a little, but I have found a good before shot for what I was working with.

                              This guitar is a Sunn Mustang, which I obtained third hand in about 2009 due to some circumstances involving a friend of mine's house mate skipping out on the rent.

                              Someone (not me!) made the "very punk" alterations, and I kept it as a "one day I'll do it" project.

                              Here is what it looked like before I started work:



                              As you can imagine the refinishing is almost as important as the new electronics.

                              The new finish is "stealth bomber black" with satin top coat, which matches the Matt black new pickguard. I will have to figure out how to tone down the glossy finish on the black bridge and jackplate because it doesn't quite fit ATM.

                              "After" pictures to follow!

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                              • #30
                                Re: Narrowing Down Pickups - Drop C Project Guitar

                                Wow, that is one great before pic. I wanna see what you do to it!
                                Administrator of the SDUGF

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