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Thread: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

  1. #101
    Mojo's Minions beaubrummels's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Clint 55 View Post
    Yeah sure, guy. When I examined the A5 from my Ant, it was smooth. Post a video of you unwrapping the factory tape to reveal an A5 with bumps then make arrogant comments. Fwiw, other pups which Duncan or other people claim have rough mags but that I got smooth mags in are the Whole Lotta and Antiquity Humbucker.
    Did you buy them used?

    Also note, Iíve bought/seen roughcast mags that were not entirely rough.

    I confirmed the information I posted with certain folks in the company who put these models together.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demanic
    Incompetence is widespread in a world that rewards mediocrity while punishing excellence.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarFanatic
    I am currently using Skullcandy headphones I found in the garbage.
    I did find the DS-1 in the garbage.
    I once found a guitar amp in the garbage, a Peavey Studio 110. It caught fire at the first gig I played it at.. But it was at the end of it, thank god.

  2. #102
    OH THE DOUBLE THICK GLAZE! Clint 55's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    No, they were all new. I also inspected the mags pretty thoroughly to see if I could call them rough but they were absolutely smooth. My Ant JB and WLH had smooth mags. While my Ant Humbucker's mag was smooth but beat up with a few chips and rounded edges. I thought that was cool and could possibly affect the sound in addition to the degaussing.
    Last edited by Clint 55; 06-03-2020 at 01:20 AM.
    Turning around to the
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  3. #103
    Mojo's Minions beaubrummels's Avatar
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    Default The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Does everyone remember what Coca-Cola tastes like? Thereís only one, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Demanic
    Incompetence is widespread in a world that rewards mediocrity while punishing excellence.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarFanatic
    I am currently using Skullcandy headphones I found in the garbage.
    I did find the DS-1 in the garbage.
    I once found a guitar amp in the garbage, a Peavey Studio 110. It caught fire at the first gig I played it at.. But it was at the end of it, thank god.

  4. #104
    mild old man perv Aceman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Masta' C View Post
    Here are my thoughts:

    • The JB "formula" probably hasn't changed since it became a formal production model, which is what I believe Evan is alluding to, but we know that the individual components used in the JB recipe have certainly changed over time, sort of like swapping the brand of chocolate chips in your favorite cookie recipe. You're still using chocolate chips, and putting in the same amount as you did before, so it's still very much "your cookie recipe", but the taste can change slightly, especially as more components are swapped out over time (flour, sugar, brand of butter, etc)
    • ** Looks to me most of the changes were the bag, not the chocolate...

    • There is far more variation in the very early pickups made in the '70s than we see beginning in the '80s. You simply don't see the degree of mis-matched coils and lower DCR readings in JB's once you hit the '80s
    And we will check that...

  5. In my opinion, the "JBJ is best" argument doesn't speak so much to the winder as it does to the particular generation of pickups in which the "JBJ" was common. A "JB-M", "JBL", "JBP", etc all use the same parts and were wound on the same machines. HOWEVER, you can find "JBJ" pickups produced from the early '80s through the early '90s, so that's quite a range.
And they were all wound on the same machines to the same specs.

  • Roughcast mags were only found in the earliest JB's. Once the '80s got rolling, roughcast went out the window. 99% of all pickups we know as "JBJ" models have polished mags, not roughcast. I have verified this to as early as 1981/82 in some cases. By 1983, with the introduction of the large logo baseplate, roughcast was a true rarity.


  • Not enough of a magnet guru to speak to rough vs smooth overall differences in a pup that hot. We will see...
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  • #105
    Mojo's Minions beaubrummels's Avatar
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    Default The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Youíre forgetting wire batches and min/nom/max. Thatís in the recipe, not the bag. Of course, this experiment wonít get at those details because it canít.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demanic
    Incompetence is widespread in a world that rewards mediocrity while punishing excellence.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarFanatic
    I am currently using Skullcandy headphones I found in the garbage.
    I did find the DS-1 in the garbage.
    I once found a guitar amp in the garbage, a Peavey Studio 110. It caught fire at the first gig I played it at.. But it was at the end of it, thank god.

  • #106
    mild old man perv Aceman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Hey - if you want to give the resources, the measurement tools, and let me build a real design with fancy maths and all....That's like one of the things I actually know how to do.

  • #107
    Mojo's Minions beaubrummels's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Maybe we just need 1 modern production JB and swap the mag, if the hypothesis is that is the only factor that could make a difference.

    If the recipe is wound to a count, but the DCR are different, that would indicate the wire thickness is different. So the test pickups from different eras would need to have the same DCR, no?
    Quote Originally Posted by Demanic
    Incompetence is widespread in a world that rewards mediocrity while punishing excellence.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarFanatic
    I am currently using Skullcandy headphones I found in the garbage.
    I did find the DS-1 in the garbage.
    I once found a guitar amp in the garbage, a Peavey Studio 110. It caught fire at the first gig I played it at.. But it was at the end of it, thank god.

  • #108
    Mojo's Minions Masta' C's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Mag swapping a newer pickup doesn't definitively prove whether or not a newer pickup sounds different than a "JBJ" or a '70s "The JB Model", etc. Or am I missing the point of the proposed analysis?

    I feel like people are making this more difficult than it needs to be. One guitar using the same adjustments (pickup height, knobs, etc), one amp using the same settings and mic placement (very important), same progressions and riffs played driven and clean, high quality recording provided for comparison. If the different JB versions are effectively different, you'll be able to tell. If not, they'll sound largely identical. If you need more than that to feel satisfied, then you're out of luck

  • #109
    OH THE DOUBLE THICK GLAZE! Clint 55's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    They sound different even only comparing dirty. The differences are the same which I notice in mine. The 35th sounds more open and old school PAFy, the production one sounds clogged up and compressed, and the Ant also sounds somewhat more open but duller. Demo begins at 1:14.

    Turning around to the
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  • #110
    Mojo's Minions beaubrummels's Avatar
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    Default The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Masta' C View Post
    Mag swapping a newer pickup doesn't definitively prove whether or not a newer pickup sounds different than a "JBJ" or a '70s "The JB Model", etc. Or am I missing the point of the proposed analysis?
    Aceís hypothesis is thereís no difference between old and new, and only mags might make a difference. If thatís true, putting a rough A5 in a new JB should make it sound like an old one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demanic
    Incompetence is widespread in a world that rewards mediocrity while punishing excellence.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarFanatic
    I am currently using Skullcandy headphones I found in the garbage.
    I did find the DS-1 in the garbage.
    I once found a guitar amp in the garbage, a Peavey Studio 110. It caught fire at the first gig I played it at.. But it was at the end of it, thank god.

  • #111
    Mojo's Minions Masta' C's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Well, I also have a roughcast A5 that Ace can use to modify his own, newer production JB with. Then, he'll have the "real deal" to directly compare his simple mag-swapped JB with

    Naturally, I would ask that the vintage pickups be left alone and not modified in any way

  • #112
    Mojo's Minions Sirion's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Clint 55 View Post
    They sound different even only comparing dirty. The differences are the same which I notice in mine. The 35th sounds more open and old school PAFy, the production one sounds clogged up and compressed, and the Ant also sounds somewhat more open but duller. Demo begins at 1:14.

    I love that they used the Give it All riff in this. I agree with your assesment, and of these I liked the 35th best. Of course, that is the only one not readily available...

  • #113
    Ultimate Tone Member JB6464's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Clint 55 View Post
    No. The winds are different. My JB/Seth is hotter than my JBJ. Also the Ant doesn't have a roughcast A5 it has a smooth A5.
    My Ant JB has a roughcast A5 .

  • #114
    mild old man perv Aceman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Clint 55 View Post
    They sound different even only comparing dirty. The differences are the same which I notice in mine. The 35th sounds more open and old school PAFy, the production one sounds clogged up and compressed, and the Ant also sounds somewhat more open but duller. Demo begins at 1:14.
    The problem with that is that you know which is which. Just knowing makes it much easier to tell. And, you may be biased to choose one or the other based on what you have heard about them.

    Without knowing that you might as easily go "That one sounded brittle and harsh, the other was smooth and fat"

  • #115
    mild old man perv Aceman's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by beaubrummels View Post
    Aceís hypothesis is thereís no difference between old and new, and only mags might make a difference. If thatís true, putting a rough A5 in a new JB should make it sound like an old one.
    That's not exactly my hypothesis. But...yeah. In which case, I still win: Old JB, or JBJ, or whatever is just a mag swap away.

    Not a damn thing magical about teh winder, or teh vintagez.

  • #116
    Mojo's Minions beaubrummels's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    I was going for a Ďtestable hypothesis.Ē But if the hypothesis is Ďpeople conclude something is better and hear characteristics that arenít really there based on their bias of knowing what the product isĒ, I think that would require an in person test. The guys that concluded they prefer the older production were not passively listening to a sample to reach that conclusion. They installed them into a guitar they were familiar with and could observe the relative subtle deltas through their interactive playing of it. And some of those deltas were practical ones (not just purely psychoacoustic), like: I can physically get pinch harmonics out of this one but Iím not able to get pinch harmonics out of that one, and when volume is on 6, this one is clean while that one is still gritty. But I think this is an interesting exercise either way.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demanic
    Incompetence is widespread in a world that rewards mediocrity while punishing excellence.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarFanatic
    I am currently using Skullcandy headphones I found in the garbage.
    I did find the DS-1 in the garbage.
    I once found a guitar amp in the garbage, a Peavey Studio 110. It caught fire at the first gig I played it at.. But it was at the end of it, thank god.

  • #117
    Mojo's Minions Masta' C's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Better brush up on your RATT riffs, Aceman...we need you to channel your inner DeMartini, ha ha!

    I would like to mention that, in addition to clean samples, I really appreciate comparisons that include both a mildly overdriven tone and a fully distorted sample, rather than one or the other. Just my 2 cents.

  • #118
    Toneologist
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Anyone whoís tried them knows, the absolute best JB is the fishman fluence classic voice 2. The paf voice 1 is just a bonus. If anyone knows tone itís Frank.

  • #119
    Mojo's Minions Masta' C's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by allstarrme View Post
    Anyone whoís tried them knows, the absolute best JB is the fishman fluence classic voice 2.
    Shhh...quiet down you!

    Seriously, though, the JB setting on the "Classic" is ridiculously good and has converted a lot of players. The voicing was modeled after Frank's own "The JB Model"!

  • #120
    Mojo's Minions beaubrummels's Avatar
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    Default Re: The JB "I call BS on everyone" thread

    So it isnít just magnets that make the difference. Wonder what that little switch actually does?
    Quote Originally Posted by Demanic
    Incompetence is widespread in a world that rewards mediocrity while punishing excellence.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarFanatic
    I am currently using Skullcandy headphones I found in the garbage.
    I did find the DS-1 in the garbage.
    I once found a guitar amp in the garbage, a Peavey Studio 110. It caught fire at the first gig I played it at.. But it was at the end of it, thank god.

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