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  • Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, etc)

    Ok, so recently I had the wiring in this thread realized, which I love (thanks, @Jack_TriPpEr !):



    To recap, this is the wiring I currently have:

    5-way super switch-

    Position 1: Bridge
    Position 2: Bridge + Middle (Parallel)
    Position 3: Bridge + Neck (Parallel) (no middle)
    Position 4: Middle + Neck (Parallel)
    Position 5: Neck

    Coil Split Switch 1 splits both humbuckers
    Coil Split Switch 2 selects whether the inner coils or the outer coils of the humbuckers are activated
    Switch 3 puts the middle pickup out-of-phase with the humbuckers


    QUESTION:

    1. Is it possible to substitute a 3-way on-on-on switch for "Coil Split Switch 1," where the third position puts both humbuckers in parallel with themselves?

    2. Is it possible to use "Switch 3" - only active in "Super switch Position 3" - to toggle between: 1. Bridge + Neck (Parallel); and 2. Middle Pickup alone?

  • #2
    Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

    1. Not with a DPDT switch.

    2. Are you saying you want to replace the out of phase option with a blower for the middle pickup? You can do that, but you lose the out of phase option.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

      Originally posted by beaubrummels View Post
      1. Not with a DPDT switch.

      2. Are you saying you want to replace the out of phase option with a blower for the middle pickup? You can do that, but you lose the out of phase option.
      1. Would another switch accomplish that?

      2. Correct. I don't really use the phase switch.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

        Originally posted by ericcomposer72 View Post
        Ok, so recently I had the wiring in this thread realized, which I love (thanks, @Jack_TriPpEr !):



        To recap, this is the wiring I currently have:

        5-way super switch-

        Position 1: Bridge
        Position 2: Bridge + Middle (Parallel)
        Position 3: Bridge + Neck (Parallel) (no middle)
        Position 4: Middle + Neck (Parallel)
        Position 5: Neck

        Coil Split Switch 1 splits both humbuckers
        Coil Split Switch 2 selects whether the inner coils or the outer coils of the humbuckers are activated
        Switch 3 puts the middle pickup out-of-phase with the humbuckers


        QUESTION:

        1. Is it possible to substitute a 3-way on-on-on switch for "Coil Split Switch 1," where the third position puts both humbuckers in parallel with themselves?

        2. Is it possible to use "Switch 3" - only active in "Super switch Position 3" - to toggle between: 1. Bridge + Neck (Parallel); and 2. Middle Pickup alone?
        Firstly, kuddos and respect to Jack_TriPpEr for his outstanding help.

        Now and to share what came to my mind:

        An ON-OFF-ON switch could be used to split the humbuckers as following: center position (OFF) = humbucker mode for both pickups, 1st position ON = one of the two coils in both humbuckers, 2d position ON = the other coil of both humbuckers.

        It would "free" the second switch, which could be used for something else (as an on/off control allowing a parallel operation for both humbuckers, for example).

        not enough time to keep thinking about it right now. More later maybe.
        Duncan user since the 80's...

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

          Originally posted by freefrog View Post
          Firstly, kuddos and respect to Jack_TriPpEr for his outstanding help.

          Now and to share what came to my mind:

          An ON-OFF-ON switch could be used to split the humbuckers as following: center position (OFF) = humbucker mode for both pickups, 1st position ON = one of the two coils in both humbuckers, 2d position ON = the other coil of both humbuckers.

          It would "free" the second switch, which could be used for something else (as an on/off control allowing a parallel operation for both humbuckers, for example).

          not enough time to keep thinking about it right now. More later maybe.
          FreeFrog - thanks for the kind words.

          I like your idea about replacing both of the 2DPT switches with an on-off-on switch to do the same work currently being done by 2 on-off switches regarding the coil-splitting.

          The remaining switch could be replaced by a 4PDT switch which is capable of switching both himbucker pickups at once from either In Series mode or In Parallel mode. Eric: switching btw Parallel mode and In Series mode on a *single* humbucker uses up all the lugs on a 2 way switch... so to do 2 humbuckers at once you need a 4PDT switch. If you needed/wanted a pot also in that footprint to control volume or tone or something else, Fender makes an "S1" switch which is a 4PDT push-push switch plus a pot.

          Eric: Switch 3 was not a out-of-phase switch for the middle pickup when i designed that diagram for you. Instead, Switch 3 enabled the Middle Pickup to switch btw In Parallel mode and In Series mode. Did you make further changes to that switch since I provided it to you? I'm just curious, that's all.

          Finally, yes - seconding BeauBrummels assessment, that a 2 way switch could be set-up in combination with the superswitch to provide middle-pickup only or middle pickup with bridge and neck pups in positions 2 and 4 and bridge+neck pups in position 3.
          Last edited by Jack_TriPpEr; 07-05-2020, 08:54 PM.
          Sanford: "The hardest part about tone chasing is losing the expectations associated with the hardware."

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

            Originally posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
            Eric: Switch 3 was not a out-of-phase switch for the middle pickup when i designed that diagram for you. Instead, Switch 3 enabled the Middle Pickup to switch btw In Parallel mode and In Series mode. Did you make further changes to that switch since I provided it to you? I'm just curious, that's all.
            What happened was: the pickup I intended to go in the middle (SD Vintage rails) would not fit the Carvin rout- even without the flange (the exit cable is rigid and comes out at a 90 degree angle from the middle of the pickup; no clearance in the rout). Carvin seems hell-bent on making it difficult to install different pickups! I'm going to see if a Zexcoil will fit; they have been really helpful and seem like they'll assist me in figuring out a way to make it work.

            So, I left the stock Carvin (noisy) single coil in (which sounds quite good, actually). The stock wiring for that third switch was a phase switch, so I just left it.

            The rest of the configuration is per your diagram. So far, I've been like a kid in a candy store, with all of these different sounds. I've never been so inspired to write so much music!
            Last edited by ericcomposer72; 07-06-2020, 12:17 AM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

              Ah, ok, thanks for the update. Sorry to hear that the Carvin guitar had that limitation in its design. Those kinds of things can be really frustrating. But sounds like it hasn't hindered you since you have so many other new functionalities to play around with.

              So are you interested in making the following changes:
              1. Switch 1 gets replaced with a 3 way on-off-on to handle all the coil-splitting
              2. Switch 2 gets replaced with a 4PDT switch to change the two humbuckers from In Series to In Parallel, both at the same time?
              3. Switch 3 gets rewired to function so that UP you get the middle coil by itself (overriding the 5 way superswitch), and DOWN the switch is inactive - which lets you have bridge + neck in superswitch position 3.

              ?

              Please note that when Switch 2 has each humbucker in Parallel mode, Switch 1 will have no effect. This is a common limitation when having both coil-splitting and Parallel/Series options available in the same circuit, so nothing unusual.

              EDIT: there is technically a way to wire things so that Switch 3 only impacts superswitch Position 3 - but that would require extensive changes to how the superswitch is already wired. That is why i proposed the "override" method above.
              Last edited by Jack_TriPpEr; 07-06-2020, 06:28 AM.
              Sanford: "The hardest part about tone chasing is losing the expectations associated with the hardware."

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

                Originally posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
                Ah, ok, thanks for the update. Sorry to hear that the Carvin guitar had that limitation in its design. Those kinds of things can be really frustrating. But sounds like it hasn't hindered you since you have so many other new functionalities to play around with.

                So are you interested in making the following changes:
                1. Switch 1 gets replaced with a 3 way on-off-on to handle all the coil-splitting
                2. Switch 2 gets replaced with a 4PDT switch to change the two humbuckers from In Series to In Parallel, both at the same time?
                3. Switch 3 gets rewired to function so that UP you get the middle coil by itself (overriding the 5 way superswitch), and DOWN the switch is inactive - which lets you have bridge + neck in superswitch position 3.

                ?

                Please note that when Switch 2 has each humbucker in Parallel mode, Switch 1 will have no effect. This is a common limitation when having both coil-splitting and Parallel/Series options available in the same circuit, so nothing unusual.

                EDIT: there is technically a way to wire things so that Switch 3 only impacts superswitch Position 3 - but that would require extensive changes to how the superswitch is already wired. That is why i proposed the "override" method above.
                That all sounds great- just a couple of questions/comments...

                To the red bolded- that sounds fine. I knew that one switch would have to override/nullify the other, and that configuration would work just fine for me.

                To 3. - I guess this would be the best option if I want to have mercy on the fellow who does the wiring for me (I don't have a bench/soldering setup in my current apartment, so I farm this work out...). However...

                a) My guitar guy who does my wiring did not flip the neck humbucker, per your original instructions, so my middle position split sounds are not noiseless. Unless he did this because of a routing issue (like the other pickup), I would want him to flip that pickup.

                b) I'm also contemplating rewiring the neck pickup so that it is not connected to the tone pot. I want to have more brightness in my neck PU, and this was the recommendation from another thread.

                Given these items that need to be addressed, would extensive rewiring already be necessary? In which case, rewiring the superswitch might not be a bad idea.

                Once again, thanks for all of this insight/guidance!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

                  Originally posted by ericcomposer72 View Post
                  That all sounds great- just a couple of questions/comments...

                  To the red bolded- that sounds fine. I knew that one switch would have to override/nullify the other, and that configuration would work just fine for me.

                  To 3. - I guess this would be the best option if I want to have mercy on the fellow who does the wiring for me (I don't have a bench/soldering setup in my current apartment, so I farm this work out...). However...

                  a) My guitar guy who does my wiring did not flip the neck humbucker, per your original instructions, so my middle position split sounds are not noiseless. Unless he did this because of a routing issue (like the other pickup), I would want him to flip that pickup.

                  b) I'm also contemplating rewiring the neck pickup so that it is not connected to the tone pot. I want to have more brightness in my neck PU, and this was the recommendation from another thread.

                  Given these items that need to be addressed, would extensive rewiring already be necessary? In which case, rewiring the superswitch might not be a bad idea.

                  Once again, thanks for all of this insight/guidance!
                  No, the "flip the pickup" aspect you asked about has zero wiring impacts. And i believe you actually mean "rotate" the pickup 180 degrees physically, in contrast to "flipping" the magnet in the neck pickup. My prior advice and diagram assumed a "rotate the pickup 180 degrees", so there is zero wiring impact.

                  And for the 2nd thing you asked about (dropping the neck pickup from the tone control), no, the amount of wiring changes to do that is still significantly less than rewiring the superswitch with regards to Option B for Switch 3.
                  Sanford: "The hardest part about tone chasing is losing the expectations associated with the hardware."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

                    Eric, if the reason that you did not rotate the neck pickup is due to the same physical restriction of the guitar design dictating where the pickup wire exit point situates like you described for the middle pickup, then we could consider flipping the neck humbucker's magnet instead of rotating the neck pickup, as an alternative. Let me know.
                    Sanford: "The hardest part about tone chasing is losing the expectations associated with the hardware."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

                      Originally posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
                      Eric, if the reason that you did not rotate the neck pickup is due to the same physical restriction of the guitar design dictating where the pickup wire exit point situates like you described for the middle pickup, then we could consider flipping the neck humbucker's magnet instead of rotating the neck pickup, as an alternative. Let me know.
                      Aha. I have to ask my guy. Honestly, I'm thinking he just forgot. It's good to know that there is a solution in case of a routing issue.

                      I'm pondering whether it might be worth actually rewiring the superswitch, so that the toggle between middle pickup/humbuckers together only functions in superswitch position "3." The middle pickup in question has not yet been delivered to me, so I suppose I have some time to think.

                      I intend this wiring we are speaking of to be the final configuration for this guitar (I swear!)- so I'm thinking I should make sure it's exactly what I want.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

                        Originally posted by ericcomposer72 View Post
                        Aha. I have to ask my guy. Honestly, I'm thinking he just forgot. It's good to know that there is a solution in case of a routing issue.

                        I'm pondering whether it might be worth actually rewiring the superswitch, so that the toggle between middle pickup/humbuckers together only functions in superswitch position "3." The middle pickup in question has not yet been delivered to me, so I suppose I have some time to think.

                        I intend this wiring we are speaking of to be the final configuration for this guitar (I swear!)- so I'm thinking I should make sure it's exactly what I want.
                        Ok, i can help with either wiring scheme.

                        Something to consider: with the "override" method for Switch 3, you only need 1 physical action to switch from Middle Pickup only to [something else]... whereas with the Option B method you have to perform 2 physical actions, i.e. #1 -move the superswitch to Position 3, and # 2 - operate Switch 3.

                        What make-model of middle pickup do you have on order?
                        Sanford: "The hardest part about tone chasing is losing the expectations associated with the hardware."

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

                          Originally posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
                          Ok, i can help with either wiring scheme.

                          Something to consider: with the "override" method for Switch 3, you only need 1 physical action to switch from Middle Pickup only to [something else]... whereas with the Option B method you have to perform 2 physical actions, i.e. #1 -move the superswitch to Position 3, and # 2 - operate Switch 3.

                          What make-model of middle pickup do you have on order?
                          Yeah, I will have to mull it over. Honestly (though this could change!), I anticipate that the middle-pickup-only sound would be used less frequently than other sounds, so that will play into the decision...

                          I have on order a Zexcoil "ZMD5" Z-Core 5 Modern

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

                            Originally posted by Jack_TriPpEr View Post
                            Ok, i can help with either wiring scheme.

                            Something to consider: with the "override" method for Switch 3, you only need 1 physical action to switch from Middle Pickup only to [something else]... whereas with the Option B method you have to perform 2 physical actions, i.e. #1 -move the superswitch to Position 3, and # 2 - operate Switch 3.

                            What make-model of middle pickup do you have on order?
                            I received the pickup and it will fit my Carvin rout!

                            I've considered the "override" method for Switch 3, and I think I like your idea best. It seems to be the easiest way to do what I want, and it's as practical a solution as there is.

                            So basically, what I'm looking to do is modify this configuration:

                            (n.b. - my current Switch 3 actually changes the phase of the middle pickup, instead of series/parallel per this diagram. Also, the new middle pickup - Zexcoil ZMD-5, "noiseless" single coil - has just two wires)



                            ...so that:

                            1. One switch is swapped to an "on-off-on" toggle, which: 1. splits both humbuckers to outer-coils only; 2. "default" (humbuckers full); 3. splits both humbuckers to inner-coils only

                            2. The other switch is swapped to a 4PDT "on-on" toggle, which: 1. Does nothing (Switch "1." active); 2. Puts each humbucker in parallel (with itself), overriding switch "1."

                            3. "Switch 3" will override all other switches & superswitch, and activate the middle pickup, by itself


                            One more change- I would like to remove the "tone" control from the circuit of the neck pickup.


                            As always, utmost gratitude. I am working on some new music now, utilizing these configurations, and will post some clips as soon as they're ready! I feel like I've found my ultimate configuration.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Wiring inquiry regarding my recent project (H-S-H guitar splitting inner coils, e

                              Originally posted by ericcomposer72 View Post
                              I received the pickup and it will fit my Carvin rout!

                              I've considered the "override" method for Switch 3, and I think I like your idea best. It seems to be the easiest way to do what I want, and it's as practical a solution as there is.

                              So basically, what I'm looking to do is modify this configuration:

                              (n.b. - my current Switch 3 actually changes the phase of the middle pickup, instead of series/parallel per this diagram. Also, the new middle pickup - Zexcoil ZMD-5, "noiseless" single coil - has just two wires)



                              ...so that:

                              1. One switch is swapped to an "on-off-on" toggle, which: 1. splits both humbuckers to outer-coils only; 2. "default" (humbuckers full); 3. splits both humbuckers to inner-coils only

                              2. The other switch is swapped to a 4PDT "on-on" toggle, which: 1. Does nothing (Switch "1." active); 2. Puts each humbucker in parallel (with itself), overriding switch "1."

                              3. "Switch 3" will override all other switches & superswitch, and activate the middle pickup, by itself


                              One more change- I would like to remove the "tone" control from the circuit of the neck pickup.


                              As always, utmost gratitude. I am working on some new music now, utilizing these configurations, and will post some clips as soon as they're ready! I feel like I've found my ultimate configuration.
                              That's all possible, except the bit about the neck pickup and tone pot will have to be set up a little different than what you requested. To do exactly what you want, we would need an unused pole on the the 5 way superswitch, but all 4 poles are already being used for other things. I also reviewed the diagram that member Mike S came up with for member BeKindRewind that is the alternate to the "override" method for switch 3, but even in that diagram, all 4 poles are being used and so it also could not support exactly what you requested. However, what we CAN do is replace either your volume pot or your tone pot with a push-pull pot and use that to take the tone pot functionality in or out of circuit. So for example, in Neck Pickup only position, you could take the tone pot out of the circuit.... and any other positions of the 5 way switch that you choose, including the Middle Pup Only override setting.

                              Let me know.
                              Sanford: "The hardest part about tone chasing is losing the expectations associated with the hardware."

                              Comment

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