50s Wiring is Scooped?

[Tumblinman]

Hi

I know there have been many thread regarding whether 50s Wiring or Moderns Wiring is the way to go in a Les Paul-type configuration (that is 2 humbuckers, 2 Volume, 2 Tone). There have also been many threads regarding Duncan 59s and their tendency to sound a little scooped.

However, I want to combine those two topics. :nervous:

For some time now, I have been on the 50s wiring bandwagon - and have been enjoying the increase in overall clarity and it's ability to maintain presence when the volume is lowered. This has worked really well with pickups such as Seth Lovers, Gibson 57s and Sheptone Tributes. But with the Duncan 59s I believe Modern wiring is better solution - at least if your guitar isn't really warm and bassy in itself.
I believe Modern wiring fills out the low midrange a little and really suits the sound character of the 59 humbucker. Also, I prefer the way the knobs work with the modern wiring - it's less fiddly, somehow.

50s Wiring is great sometimes, but I do feel it removes some midrange from your sound. That can be useful with certain pickups and guitars but, for me, not with Duncan 59s (and I'll throw in the Custom 5, also).

Anyone who feels the same? Or feel different? Let's discuss!

 

[Mincer]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

Well, I will agree the 59 and Custom 5 are scooped. I haven't directly compared them in the same guitar with 50s and then modern wiring, though. Acutally, I haven't really compared the tonal difference between the 2 wirings, as I was more concerned with how the knobs interact to remember if the tone changed.

 

[Tumblinman]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

Yeah, another downside of the 50s style wiring is that, sometimes, it renders the tone control useless for taming treble. Instead you get 2 volume controls for the same pickup....kinda.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

I have two guitars with humbuckers and they both have the same alnico 2, paf style Tom Holmes humbuckers.

I love Seymour's humbuckers, but my ES-335 came to me with Tom's humbuckers already installed and I had another identical Tom Holmes set on hand when I got my PRS Custom 22....so I put 'em in that guitar too.

Jol Danzig rewired my ES-335 and did it 50's style with the tone control connected to the middle terminal of each volume pot.

That guitar sounds perfect. It's clear but not to bright. Still nice and woody with 50's tone control wiring. 500K pots.

My PRS Custom 22 has the same pickups and 500K pots. But to me it sounded to bright and a little sharp with 50's wiring.

When I rewired it with modern wiring I liked the tone much better. Just more comfortable.

So I think it depends on the guitar.

Perhaps in a solid body 50's wiring might make the overall tone feel to sharp and bright.

But in my semi-hollowbody ES-335 50's wiring sounds "right".

BTW, here's a photo of a 50's Les Paul with factory stock 50's wiring:

 

[GuitarDoc]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

I've never noticed a tone difference between the two wirings...only when/as the vol is rolled off.

 

[Shooter.556]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

50s wiring is most noticeable and most effective when using low output PAFs. You get more sounds out of your wiring and pickups that way..
I run 50s wiring and I notice zero midrange drops and I have ran everything from PAFs to hot humbuckers with that wiring without issue..
Maybe the pickups you are running are already scooped and that's why you are noticing it?
That being said though, I use a 59 in the neck a lot.. I have gotten into changing the 59N to an Alnico 4.
Weird? I have never heard this about 50s wiring before..

 

[dystrust]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

50s wiring is most noticeable and most effective when using low output PAFs. You get more sounds out of your wiring and pickups that way..
I run 50s wiring and I notice zero midrange drops and I have ran everything from PAFs to hot humbuckers with that wiring without issue..
Maybe the pickups you are running are already scooped and that's why you are noticing it?
That being said though, I use a 59 in the neck a lot.. I have gotten into changing the 59N to an Alnico 4.
Weird? I have never heard this about 50s wiring before..

I'm in pretty much the same boat. I've done 50s wiring with dual 59s, and I've also done it with a JB/Jazz setup, and in my Strat & Tele. I don't find it scooped, but it may be slightly brighter than modern wiring, which in turn may lead to less perceived midrange. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

It's the same same when everything is on 10.
The only diff is that 50s wiring keeps your treble as you roll back the volume but drops volume when you roll back the treble.
Modern wiring drops some treble when you roll back the volume, but keeps your volume when you roll back the treble.

 

[Tumblinman]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

It's the same same when everything is on 10.
The only diff is that 50s wiring keeps your treble as you roll back the volume but drops volume when you roll back the treble.
Modern wiring drops some treble when you roll back the volume, but keeps your volume when you roll back the treble.

I've never noticed a tone difference between the two wirings...only when/as the vol is rolled off.

I know that it perhaps shouldn't make a difference in sound with everything on 10, but I really hear it. Mostly it's in the attack of the note but, also, I perceive it as an overall loss in warmth and increased clarity with a little more treble spark on top. Though, I would agree that the effect is more pronounced when the volume is turned down some.

 

[Mincer]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

Whew! It isn't just me. By the time I get everything switched over, I almost don't remember how the other wiring sounded.

 

[Tumblinman]

Re: 50s Wiring is Scooped?

Here is a video showcasing the difference between 50s and Modern. I don't know if he fiddled with the knobs or if it's full volym and tone, but I can hear a definite difference in sound.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsAfUHReWe4