A '59 with a Alnico II magnet

[Napthol]

I tried a '59 many years ago that I put in a Les Paul, and sure enough what the forum members were telling me was true. That the '59 can be bright. I didn't like it so I removed it. But what about taking a '59 and putting an Alnico II magnet in it?

I would imagine that could smoothen and soften it up.

 

[beaubrummels]

There are threads on here that talk about the changes with various mags in a 59 and others. A member named LtKojak had a lot of posts about the various alnico mags and their affects. I seem to recall an A2 bridge, A3 neck 59 set was one of his favorites for hollow body 335 type jazz boxes.

Here's one thread:
https://forum.seymourduncan.com/for...73642-sh-1-59-magnet-swap-options#post4532296

Another:
https://forum.seymourduncan.com/for...bridge-59-in-a-mag-swap?p=4389523#post4389523

Or search on Google using the query:
site:forum.seymourduncan.com 59 A2 mag LtKojak

 

[freefrog]

Sorry if I beat a dead horse but yes, typically, and all other things being equal, an A2 should make a Gibson style HB smoother and softer sounding.

Below is the frequency response of a vintage SH1, neck position in a LP, played in chords direct to the board through a 1M input. Blue = A2. Red = A5. Responses have been aligned to make obvious the frequential changes but there was also a difference in output level between samples.



Now, this frequency analysis would or might differ with...
-the same pickup with different height settings, strings, pick,
-the same pickup in another guitar,
-the same pickup paired with different pot resistances and/or cable capacitance,
-the same pickup + a different input impedance,
-other mags of the "same" alloys,
-SH1/59's from different eras: the one used in this case is an example from the late 70's / early 80's, with unpotted coils, butyrate bobbins, threaded baseplate, among other differences with a contemporary SH1.

IOW, the EQing illustrated by this pic is not necessarily transposable as a whole to other situations, supposedly similar.

FWIW (= 2 cents at best, obviously).

 

[eclecticsynergy]

I assume we're talking about the 59B, yes? It can vary a lot from one guitar to another.
It can be quite bright in a trebly or mid-scooped guitar.
But it also can be fat and creamy in a richer sounding one.

Both the 59s take various different magnets very well. Around here they're famous for it.

 

[hamerfan]

Don't forget the unoriented A5, a metal mix like an A5 but also like the A2 less magnetic strength.

 

[freefrog]

...Not to mention that A2 from different foundries and under different shapes might give variable tonal results...

A short A2, for instance would shape the magnetic field under E strings in a different way and would add a bit less inductance than a long one, with a potentially unexpected effect on tone, depending on the other parts involved (coils, screws and slugs, keeper bar). My P.A.F. clones with short A2 bars don't sound like those with long A2 mags since they are less smooth or soft than defiantly transparent.

Other examples of what I mean, FWIW: https://www.throbak.com/alnico-magnets.html

 

[Clint 55]

Double thick magnets are excellent for smoothing out clanky vintage output bridge humbuckers.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

Don't forget the unoriented A5, a metal mix like an A5 but also like the A2 less magnetic strength.

UA5 is my favorite swap for the 59B. Mellows the highs and fills in some mids.
Also alters the overall feel quite a bit: noticeably looser, especially in the lows, and a more vintagey pick attack.
A bit like A2, but with power that's more like A5.
Many describe it as sort of a cross between the two, and my own experiences bear that out.

Some have said they feel A4 is also a mix of the two; myself I disagree strongly with that.
The A4 seems to be very much its own thing. Not a bad thing at all, just quite different from either A5 or A2.
It may fall between them in terms of field strength, but to me it's not at all like either one in tone or feel.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

As freefrog pointed out, mags from one foundry can differ from another.
Some have said UA5 produces significantly lowered output compared to regular A5.
Yet my UA5s (sourced from AddictionFX) haven't seemed to reduce the power by much at all.
The humbuckers may be set a millimeter higher now, not sure - I set pickup height by tone, not by measurement.

 

[Napthol]

What about the '59 neck? I've read some people think it's too boomy and woofy sounding. Would an A2 or A3 be a good choice for a magnet swap?

 

[Ascension]

There are threads on here that talk about the changes with various mags in a 59 and others. A member named LtKojak had a lot of posts about the various alnico mags and their affects. I seem to recall an A2 bridge, A3 neck 59 set was one of his favorites for hollow body 335 type jazz boxes.

Here's one thread:
https://forum.seymourduncan.com/foru...ns#post4532296

Another:
https://forum.seymourduncan.com/foru...23#post4389523

Or search on Google using the query:
site:forum.seymourduncan.com 59 A2 mag LtKojak

Have a 95 Washbur USA MG 102 with a factory JB and 59 neck that I have a A 3 in. That 59 A3 in that particular guitar is one of my all time favorite neck pickups. Warmed the 59 up some and slightly lowered the output softened the attack plus made it a little lass bright. and balanced..Really works well in that particular Swamp Ash Super Strat with the JB in the bridge.It's one of the best sounding Super Strats I have ever picked up and plays as good as it sounds. Shes really a special guitar and have owned here for over 20 years now.
Recorded all the electric guitar tracks here in the studio with that guitar. https://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=7804039

 

[Demanic]

What about the '59 neck? I've read some people think it's too boomy and woofy sounding. Would an A2 or A3 be a good choice for a magnet swap?

A4

Sent from my SM-A115A using Tapatalk

 

[eclecticsynergy]

What about the '59 neck? I've read some people think it's too boomy and woofy sounding. Would an A2 or A3 be a good choice for a magnet swap?

59Ns can be woofy in an especially boomy guitar. But not in most, even among Les Pauls.
I've only ever had that issue in one particular LP.

Some do say it can get mushy with extremely high gain, but I think that'd be just as true for any vintagey hum with big lows.
High gain players normally would choose a tighter neck pickup like the Jazz or Full Shred anyway.
Maybe even something stronger like the Distortion neck, or the Demon.

My advice would be to try it stock first. If it turns out your guitar is one of the boomy ones, then do a mag swap.
As Demanic suggested, A4 is probably the ticket. Tighter in the lows (though not thin), with some nice sparkle & air up top.

I like A4; it's got a refined vintagey feel and a less-scooped EQ than A5 - yet still dryer in the mids than A2 or A3, not as chewy.
It also takes on a different, more aggressive character when you turn up and give it some gain & volume.
IMO that Jeckyll & Hyde split personality makes A4 an especially great mag for those who like to work the volume knob.

 

[GuitarDoc]

If you're asking about the neck position, the A2 can make it a bit mushy. An A4 would be a better choice.
If you're asking about a 59 in the bridge position, the A2 makes it softer, mushier, and weaker. A better choice IMO is the A8...it keeps the tight strong bass, softens the highs, adds some mids, and gives it more power.

 

[Hsb]

I put an A2 in a 59N and I really dig it, lil better than the A5 that comes in it. As GuitarDoc said, its a little mushy, but for me, not so mushy that I want to switch it back. Its paired w a JB which in that pairing it may be a lil underpowered, but Im only playing at home, so it really doesnt matter to me all that much.

 

[GuitarDoc]

I agree. A2 is not necessarily a "bad" magnet choice, I really like the sound of A2 and have them in many of my guitars. I also like clarity and brightness, so many of my guitars have A5 magnet pups. That's not to say that you can't have clarity with A2..I like the Pearly Gates in the neck too.

 

[PS412]

What about the '59 neck? I've read some people think it's too boomy and woofy sounding. Would an A2 or A3 be a good choice for a magnet swap?

Oh my, why would anyone want to alter a 59N?

 

[Mincer]

Oh my, why would anyone want to alter a 59N?

Some people don't like the amount of bass and the lack of mids.

 

[PS412]

Some people don't like the amount of bass and the lack of mids.

Not possible

 

[misterwhizzy]

I liked the feel of my A2 59N, but it definitely wasn't perfect. It killed just too much of the high end to remove the brightness that makes it sound good. Overall much sweeter sounding with the A2, though. The best match I found was a roughcast A3, and I kept it in my LP for several years before deciding a WLH set was better than the 59 set in every way.