after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

[esandes]

...the vintage 30 marshall 4x12. i heard so much about the g12-65's in the jcm 800 marshall cabs but after listening to the sound clips on the celestion website i think the vintage 30 has the upper hand in clarity and focus.

the v30 magnet is almost 1.5 times most other celestion speakers. i'm thinking that extra induction helps to clean things up. celestion claim this magnet is the closest to alnico.

i can be talked out of spending more money. i'd appreciate it if you tried. the only cab i currently have is a 4x12 marshall with english greenbacks.

 

[jeremy]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

there are other celestions that use the 50oz magnet like the g12h

the v30 is a loud speaker with strong upper mids that cuts thru well. the g12-65 is a more balanced speaker that isnt as efficient. both are great speakers depending on what you are looking for. the g12-65s will sound more like the greenbacks you have. not the same by any stretch but closer than the v30

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

...i can be talked out of spending more money. i'd appreciate it if you tried. the only cab i currently have is a 4x12 marshall with english greenbacks.

Also consider the G12H30 before making a final decision. It sits in between the V30 and the G12M Green Back in terms of focus and clarity. It doesn't have the upper mids of the V30, but its not empty in the mids like the G12-75s.

Mixing the G12H30 and V30 is very common. Mixing the G12H30 with the G12M25 GBs is also done but it is louder than a GB.

 

[dominus]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

You did this wrong. You're supposed to consider two different things, ask for opinions, then get something completely different.

 

[Jolly_Rancher]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

I'd keep the OG Greenbacks.. They are great rock speakers, and they have nice depth to their sound.

If you're really unhappy with your sound, try replacing just 2 of them with V30s in an X pattern with your Greenbacks. Doing that should open up the top end more than enough. The V30s are very efficient.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

What is it about your current sound that you don't like?
Whats in your quad currently? is it greenbacks?
What amp are you using and how fresh/well biased are the tubes?
What style of music/kinds of sounds are you mostly going for?

I've seen some good advice already in this thread, but id like to know more about your tonal aims.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

One thing I found interesting about talking to some speaker gurus at the LA Amp Shows was that two of the guys I hold in high regard both prefer one type of speaker in a cab.....your favorite one.

While everyone was talking about mixes and miking a preferred speaker, I heard a lot of talk about just picking your favorite and loading the whole cabinet with it.

Myself......I've found that when mixing speakers in a 412, I like two of the same on top and two of the same on the bottom. This is better to me than the criss cross method. When you move from one side of the cab to the other, the sound is the same. It makes sense, doesn't it?

 

[Jolly_Rancher]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

One thing I found interesting about talking to some speaker gurus at the LA Amp Shows was that two of the guys I hold in high regard both prefer one type of speaker in a cab.....your favorite one.

While everyone was talking about mixes and miking a preferred speaker, I heard a lot of talk about just picking your favorite and loading the whole cabinet with it.

Myself......I've found that when mixing speakers in a 412, I like two of the same on top and two of the same on the bottom. This is better to me than the criss cross method. When you move from one side of the cab to the other, the sound is the same. It makes sense, doesn't it?

What's his favorite speaker???

I'm not sure what you're trying to say, but do you agree that tone has a lot to do with the type of speaker being mic'd?

And, I think it depends if the 4x12 is slanted or straight. Also, the X pattern method is probably not supposed take into account you moving from side to side, but rather getting the same mix of frequencies to the audience member that is anywhere in the room, since you have the same spread on the bottom and top, and up and down.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

Based on his choice between the 65 and the V30 and the fact that he already has a GB loaded cab, I think he wants a large magnet speaker. (V30, G12H, G12-80) I'm not sure if he wants to add another cab to his gear, trade it in, or change the speakers in his current cab?

 

[esandes]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

I'd keep the OG Greenbacks.. They are great rock speakers, and they have nice depth to their sound.

If you're really unhappy with your sound, try replacing just 2 of them with V30s in an X pattern with your Greenbacks. Doing that should open up the top end more than enough. The V30s are very efficient.

i will keep the cab i have. i just want an extra cab to handle the heavier stuff i play. i think the v30 is better suited for heavier music, compared to the greenbacks. under high SPL, the GB seems to lag a bit. the v30 should be more composed.

What is it about your current sound that you don't like?
Whats in your quad currently? is it greenbacks?
What amp are you using and how fresh/well biased are the tubes?
What style of music/kinds of sounds are you mostly going for?

I've seen some good advice already in this thread, but id like to know more about your tonal aims.

i love the GB cab i just want something else that can handle more wattage and is more snappy with heavy gain. i have a jcm 800, 1987 and 1959RR. they all have fresh tubes except for the 1959RR. it could use a new set of EL34s.

Based on his choice between the 65 and the V30 and the fact that he already has a GB loaded cab, I think he wants a large magnet speaker. (V30, G12H, G12-80) I'm not sure if he wants to add another cab to his gear, trade it in, or change the speakers in his current cab?

yeah new cab. from the celestion sound clips it seems the v30 can eat high gain riffs for breakfast, where the GBs struggle a bit.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

yep v30s

 

[Jolly_Rancher]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

Well you shoulda said so in the beginning! That's a horse of a different color!

And, Nuno Bettencourt doesn't seem to have a problem with Greenbacks... But to each their own! The V30 are great, and completely different that the G12-65, I have a cab with a V30 and a Greenback, and a cab with G12-65. For clarity in modern heavy metal style riffage I think you're better off with the V30. The G12-65 has alot less highs and balls, but much more complex midrange, with less up top and down low.

 

[JeffB]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

I will be the dissenting voice here. I cannot stand V30s with 800s. I like them with old NMV amps, i.e. early plexi type amps I think they sound good with newer Marshalls that were designed around them to one extent or the other...900, Jubilee, DSL, JVM. But they are super grating with an 800.

This is where I would reccommend Classic Lead 80s or 75s for tight metal.

 

[esandes]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

I will be the dissenting voice here. I cannot stand V30s with 800s. I like them with old NMV amps, i.e. early plexi type amps I think they sound good with newer Marshalls that were designed around them to one extent or the other...900, Jubilee, DSL, JVM. But they are super grating with an 800.

This is where I would reccommend Classic Lead 80s or 75s for tight metal.

i think i've been talked out of the cab then. i find the 800 sounds rough through t75s. i put up wanted posters for the missing mids.

 

[esandes]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

a buddy is recommending the mesa recto 2x12. i like the idea for the portability but the mesa v30s are darker sounding, no?

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

Marshalls and Vintage 30's go together perfectly, especially midgain to highgain. If you're a dedicated Marshall owner, which you are, you would be set with one Greenback cab and one V30 cab.

Cabs are a big part of the Marshall sound, and those are the two most popular speakers.

 

[Grindspine]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

...the vintage 30 marshall 4x12. i heard so much about the g12-65's in the jcm 800 marshall cabs but after listening to the sound clips on the celestion website i think the vintage 30 has the upper hand in clarity and focus.

the v30 magnet is almost 1.5 times most other celestion speakers. i'm thinking that extra induction helps to clean things up. celestion claim this magnet is the closest to alnico.

i can be talked out of spending more money. i'd appreciate it if you tried. the only cab i currently have is a 4x12 marshall with english greenbacks.

Vintage 30s do have that upper clarity, but they also can be nasal at times.

My preferred setup is to use Vintage 30s in conjunction with some modern voiced Celestions (G12H-80, Classic Lead 80, Mesa/Celestion Black Shadow 90). I have heard many recommend the G12T-75/Vintage 30 combo and the G12H-30/Vintage 30 combo. I would imagine that the G12-65/Vintage 30 combo to be nothing short of spectacular.

The X pattern is great for most 4x12 setups, I use a stereo side-by-side setup since I can dial separate volume and presence for each speaker type with my Mesa 2:Ninety.

 

[esandes]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

Marshalls and Vintage 30's go together perfectly, especially midgain to highgain. If you're a dedicated Marshall owner, which you are, you would be set with one Greenback cab and one V30 cab.

Cabs are a big part of the Marshall sound, and those are the two most popular speakers.

lol. now i'm interested again. so much fence sitting and fence jumping going on.

 

[Grindspine]

Re: after a lot of fence sitting between the vintage 30 and g12-65, i'll go with...

I'd keep the OG Greenbacks.. They are great rock speakers, and they have nice depth to their sound.

If you're really unhappy with your sound, try replacing just 2 of them with V30s in an X pattern with your Greenbacks. Doing that should open up the top end more than enough. The V30s are very efficient.

I posted before reading all of the replies, but ^ what this guy said....!