Alpha and Omega :: Mag and/or Screw Swap?

[Frogman]

Recently got a Mark Holcomb PRS SE (24 fret, 25.5”, mahogany/maple/ebony). I don’t play his style of music, but I do play mostly heavy stuff, from hair metal to grunge to thrash to stoner/doom/sludge. But not really any djent.

I generally like the pickups but I think I can make them better, for me.

The articulation and clarity is nice, but along with that comes some sterile character.

I’m going to throw an A8 in the bridge.
Tame the highs and add mids, but keep output relatively the same. IME, I love what A8’s bring to the table.

The neck I’m not so sure about. It’s kind of anemic and, if I’m being honest, relatively “lifeless”.

And despite being ~8k, I have this neck pickup raised higher than any neck pickup I’ve ever had to match the bridge, which is only like 12k IIRC.

I want to make it juicier and more “syrupy”, but I’m afraid going from ceramic to whichever alnico flavor is going to lower the output too much.

My gut tells me an A5 would be a good first try, but the other part of me thinks fuller mids would be better for the tone I’m looking for. (I’m a mids-on-10 kinda guy)

Anyone have any experience with an A8 in a bright, lower output neck pickup?

How much lower in output would you say an A4 drops from a ceramic?

Lastly, another idea I had is to swap one or both rows of the hex screws for fillisters, but I’m wary of how much difference (in the direction I want) that will make.

Aesthetically, 4 rows of hex heads look the best. Though a small part of my wants/likes, it’s still worth considering/mentioning.

If anyone has any experience whatsoever modding this custom shop set, I’d love to hear your input.

 

[skelt101]

I don't have any experience modding this particular set. (Sorry...) However, forum member LtKojak was fond of recommending an A4 in the neck position to match an A8 in the bridge. I don't know if he's still active here...

 

[alex1fly]

Can you try pedals? Other amps or speakers? Settings you're not used to? Different strings? Seems a little early to me to mod pickups on a newish guitar without trying these things. Definitely get the sterile vibe though - maybe try lowering the pickups significantly (like even with the rings). Also note that mids can be added a variety of ways, so I'd definitely feel comfortable swapping to an A5 and still having ways to get loads of mids.

The hex polepieces should scoop the mids a teeny bit and add a tighter feeling attack so presumably regular screws would do the opposite.

Also, I'd definitely experiment with turning the guitar volume down and the amp volume up. Humbuckers on 10 feel sterile to me in general, whereas a lower guitar volume knob setting gives the bounce that I like. Heck sometimes I run the guitar volume as low as 2/3. May as well experiment.

Or wire 'em up with a partial split or a series/parallel switch.

 

[Frogman]

Can you try pedals? Other amps or speakers? Settings you're not used to? Different strings? Seems a little early to me to mod pickups on a newish guitar without trying these things. Definitely get the sterile vibe though - maybe try lowering the pickups significantly (like even with the rings). Also note that mids can be added a variety of ways, so I'd definitely feel comfortable swapping to an A5 and still having ways to get loads of mids.

The hex polepieces should scoop the mids a teeny bit and add a tighter feeling attack so presumably regular screws would do the opposite.

Also, I'd definitely experiment with turning the guitar volume down and the amp volume up. Humbuckers on 10 feel sterile to me in general, whereas a lower guitar volume knob setting gives the bounce that I like. Heck sometimes I run the guitar volume as low as 2/3. May as well experiment.

Or wire 'em up with a partial split or a series/parallel switch.

-They are already series/split. The split neck is brighter than a strat middle pup. Yuck.

-Lower the pickups will make them even brighter and more articulate…

-My personal wet/dry/wet rig is very versatile and ridiculously awesome. Works perfect with my other 5 guitars, all with different pickups. I certainly could make it work, but I’m not going to totally change everything I’ve worked 12 years to obtain, solely to fit these pickups.

At church however, I have to play through a Helix straight to mixer. It has been very difficult getting rid of (as much as even possible) the nasty “modeling highs” (tubes don’t have this problem), and these pickups make it noticeably worse. I have tried 6 different sets now, and even with all the adjustments I’ve already made, I have to run my tone @ ~4/10. As before, I’m not going to change everything I’ve worked for that, with just very slight adjustments, already works fine for 5 other guitars with different pickups.


Appreciate your thoughts.

 

[alex1fly]

-They are already series/split. The split neck is brighter than a strat middle pup. Yuck.

-Lower the pickups will make them even brighter and more articulate…

-My personal wet/dry/wet rig is very versatile and ridiculously awesome. Works perfect with my other 5 guitars, all with different pickups. I certainly could make it work, but I’m not going to totally change everything I’ve worked 12 years to obtain, solely to fit these pickups.

At church however, I have to play through a Helix straight to mixer. It has been very difficult getting rid of (as much as even possible) the nasty “modeling highs” (tubes don’t have this problem), and these pickups make it noticeably worse. I have tried 6 different sets now, and even with all the adjustments I’ve already made, I have to run my tone @ ~4/10. As before, I’m not going to change everything I’ve worked for that, with just very slight adjustments, already works fine for 5 other guitars with different pickups.


Appreciate your thoughts.

6 sets of pickups in one guitar tells me there's more going on. Maybe the guitar isn't going to sound and act like your other guitars do through the same settings. Luckily you have some inexpensive options to try - polepieces, mags, strings, picks, settings, expectations. Now if only I could take my own advice consistently...

 

[Frogman]

6 sets of pickups in one guitar tells me there's more going on. Maybe the guitar isn't going to sound and act like your other guitars do through the same settings. Luckily you have some inexpensive options to try - polepieces, mags, strings, picks, settings, expectations. Now if only I could take my own advice consistently...

I don’t think you understood me correctly (probably my fault).

Jazzmaster EMG 57 / 66

Jazzmaster BKP Pig 90’s

Telecaster Norton/5-2/SSL6

Strat JB2/Jazz

LPC Custom8 / PAF 36th

I can dial in pleasing tones with all of these^ with nothing more than some subtle EQ changes, tone pot, OD settings, etc.

In order to get pleasing tones from the Alpha and Omega however, I have to DRASTICALLY change multiple facets of my rig(s).

Already messed with pickup height, pole piece height, tone, etc. It’s the perfect candidate for a mag swap.

I already have an A4, so I might as well try that out.
I also have a bunch of fillister screws to try thereafter, should it still require some tweaking. But I’m fairly confident just a mag swap will be what the doc ordered.

I play live every single week, and need my rig(s) from alpha to omega to be able to accommodate whatever the gig requires. (see what I did there haha)


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[Masta' C]

I did this little trick to my A/O set and now my latest "blackened" BW set:

For your situation, I might consider fillisters across the board, but my mod above will help.

If that doesn't make enough of a difference, you should seriously consider swapping to 250K pots if that's not what is in the guitar already...tame that resonant peak that's emphasizing the "modeler highs" you mentioned

 

[Frogman]

I did this little trick to my A/O set and now my latest "blackened" BW set:

For your situation, I might consider fillisters across the board, but my mod above will help.

If that doesn't make enough of a difference, you should seriously consider swapping to 250K pots if that's not what is in the guitar already...tame that resonant peak that's emphasizing the "modeler highs" you mentioned

How much of a difference did the screws make?

Out of curiosity, why did you put fillisters on the bottom strings (bridge) instead of fillisters under GBE and hex under EAD?

 

[Masta' C]

The difference is subtle, but it does take some edge off. With each string having one fillister and one hex pole, you sort of get the best of both worlds, really. Going with all fillister would make the biggest change by far, but I haven't needed to tame the treble beast as much as it sounds like you might and I like the "wide range" inspired aesthetic, so that's a thing.

On the BW set above, the EAD strings have hexes on the bobbin that sees the most energy from the string vibration and the warmer fillisters further away to help keep them from getting boomy. On the thinner strings, the warmer sounding poles are on the higher-energy side of the pickup to help make that part of the signal a bit more pronounced.

I actually did my A/O set exactly the opposite and the results were still nice. Like I said, the difference isn't huge with just a partial pole piece swap, but I liked it well enough on the A/O set I had that I decided to go this route again with the BW. I also wanted each bobbin to "see" each string a bit differently.

It's certainly easy to try and totally reversible, but don't rule out a 250K pot if you need to tame the actual peak/voicing of the pickup

 

[Clint 55]

If losing the aggression of ceramic is a worry for you, I would recommend A9 for the neck. It is the most aggressive alnico and gives the neck some edge while being 'not ceramic.' I've tried every combo of poles and my favorite is double filister for the bridge and 1 row of hex and 1 row of filister for the neck. It gives the neck some click and cut and rounds out the bridge. You may be looking for something different so I would say experiment with that. It's pretty intuitive to figure out and results in notice-able changes in tone. I tried the set up in the picture and didn't like it.

 

[Frogman]

We’ll see what this does.

I might try a 300k or 250k push/pull tone if the screws are not enough.

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[jeremy]

try and a8 in the neck if you have one handy, cant hurt and might give you a little texture and muscle

 

[Bogner]

Sounds like a lot of work if you aren't happy with the pickups. I have put a few sets in my various PRS guitars and really like them. Of course each guitar is unique as is our likes, wants, needs, etc. and I also don't play Djent.

 

[Masta' C]

If losing the aggression of ceramic is a worry for you, I would recommend A9 for the neck.

A9 is bright and sterile. Chances are, it would keep all of the things he already doesn't like about the Ceramic and just make it sound less full as opposed to the "syrupy" and "juicy" character he's after. If he wants more body in the neck with the power of a Ceramic, an A8 would probably be a better choice.

Interested to see how the OP fares with the pole piece swap. Should be a tweak in the right direction for sure...

 

[Clint 55]

A9 is bright, but less sterile than A8. The op said he likes ceramic but also wants syrupy so I don't know what to make of that.

 

[Masta' C]

He was worried that moving away from Ceramic would yield a loss in power and cause the neck to feel weak compared to the bridge.

As we know, there's a lot more wiggle room with magnets in neck pickups. Since there's so much more string energy there, you can get away with a much weaker magnet and compensate (to an extent) with additional pickup height.

"Syrupy" means a thicker midrange and warmer/rounded highs in my book. More of a "singing" quality than a "stinging" quality, if that makes sense.

The fillisters should help quite a bit, but it may be the resonant peak of the Alpha that the OP doesn't like

 

[Frogman]

He was worried that moving away from Ceramic would yield a loss in power and cause the neck to feel weak compared to the bridge.

As we know, there's a lot more wiggle room with magnets in neck pickups. Since there's so much more string energy there, you can get away with a much weaker magnet and compensate (to an extent) with additional pickup height.

"Syrupy" means a thicker midrange and warmer/rounded highs in my book. More of a "singing" quality than a "stinging" quality, if that makes sense.

The fillisters should help quite a bit, but it may be the resonant peak of the Alpha that the OP doesn't like

You and I have the same understanding of those words!
Yesss, male singing quality.

I’m a goosed mids-are-where-the-angry-live kinda guy

Fillister screws indeed have helped!
I’m going to continue to play as it is now for a bit.
Plus, I just got a Mesa 50:50 stereo poweramp, and wanna really play through that with my multiple preamps before making any more changes.

That’s what I love about screw and magnet mods. Especially for a signature guitar like this. Can keep the original pickups for resale value (most people probably buy this guitar because they’re djent fans) but make them work better for me in the meantime.


***edit: I bought an A6 in my last mag batch.
Y’all ever use that in a neck pickup?

 

[Clint 55]

A6 is good in a neck pickup. It's very similar to A5 because it has a round bass and a glossy, bouncy top. Although it's not quite as bright and has a bit of soft dark low mids and different character which can be a nice change from A5.