AxLabs switches anyone? 5 way 6 pole?!

[switchman]

Hey all. Anyone have experience with AxLabs branded electronics and hardware?

I knew they were a distributor for Floyd Rose. Their in house parts looks like knockoffs or near knockoffs of bigger names mass produced offshore from the prices. Then I saw this Spinal Tap-ish 6 pole 5 way super switch.

I've had a few pie-in-the-sky-3 pickup wiring schemes I could never make happen on the 4 pole switches so this got my interest. But the wafer material looks like super cheapo stuff..

https://axlabshardware.com/products/axlabs-5-way-blade-2-pole-switch-copy

 

[Artie]

Funny you should mention AxLabs. I had never heard of them before, until I searched for a 250k linear pot. My pot just arrived yesterday. They're the only place I could find a 250k linear. Looks just like a CTS, but is branded AxLabs on the cover.

That switch looks wild. I don't recall ever needing more than four quadrants on a Superswitch. Still, it's nice to know one is available should the need ever arise.

P.S. I love how the "Add to Cart" button keeps shaking, like . . . pick me, pick me.

P.S.S They make some cool stuff. They have an LP-style on-on-on switch, which can be useful for some unusual wiring schemes. Although, they have it mislabeled. It's not a 6-pole switch. It's a DPDT on-on-on switch

https://axlabshardware.com/products/axlabs-3-way-6-pole-toggle-switch

They also make a 3-pos Superswitch that looks better quality than the one me and Mincer bought.

https://axlabshardware.com/products/axlabs-3-way-blade-2-pole-switch

 

[switchman]

Interesting. Their toggles look just like Switchcraft too. Hopefully they're all as durable. The ideas behind wanting the 2 extra poles were to have selective tone controls or resistor values on some positions of 4 pole schemes. I really like a Half Out of Phase sound but the cap creates a mini-wah effect squashing the highs and making the mids peak. Two coils from different pickups in series also can sound dark depending on the pickups. I got around it a little by using a push-pull to switch tone controls out globally. I always wanted to try a 1Meg master volume and tone with resistors in parallel to tailor each position. The 6 pole must take up a ton of space though.

 

[Mincer]

Wow, a 6 pole switch! I think that would test my patience (and my eyesight).

 

[Artie]

I always wanted to try a 1Meg master volume and tone with resistors in parallel to tailor each position.

Where did you see the 1 meg pot? Or did you mean, just in general?

 

[switchman]

Wow, a 6 pole switch! I think that would test my patience (and my eyesight).

hahaha that was my first thought...I better be VERY confident in my circuit before wiring that up and something needs to be troubleshot. I started wearing the Dan Erlewine style headband magnifying visor for soldering. Makes it a lot easier once you get used to it.

 

[switchman]

Where did you see the 1 meg pot? Or did you mean, just in general?

Yeah just in general. I didn't see it from AxLabs. I've never tried the 1Meg idea because of limited options and the big tolerance. There's a handful of CTS Fender style and Alpha replacements almost all +/- 20%. I think its uncommon because only some Jazzmasters and Wide Range HB Teles had them but current versions don't. The best I've seen Lollar has some custom made to only +/-10%.

 

[Artie]

I've never tried the 1Meg idea because of limited options and the big tolerance. There's a handful of CTS Fender style and Alpha replacements almost all +/- 20%.

I've got a wiring scheme that uses an Alpha dual-ganged 1Meg pot that you might find interesting. But it veers pretty far off of your topic.

 

[Mincer]

hahaha that was my first thought...I better be VERY confident in my circuit before wiring that up and something needs to be troubleshot. I started wearing the Dan Erlewine style headband magnifying visor for soldering. Makes it a lot easier once you get used to it.

I have to look into that thing. The last guitar I wired drove me crazy.

 

[switchman]

I've got a wiring scheme that uses an Alpha dual-ganged 1Meg pot that you might find interesting. But it veers pretty far off of your topic.

Sounds Interesting I'd like to see it.

 

[Artie]

This will take a couple of posts 'cause I'm still wrestling with how the forum deals with text and pics.

One of the "problems" with dual humbucker guitars, when you have both pups on, is that both volume's and tone's affect both pickups. Turn one down, and you turn both down. One popular solution is the so-called "independent" wiring. The problem with that is, turning down a pup increases the load, (decreases the resistance), thus loading down the pup and stifling its treble and character. I realize that guitarists everywhere are not losing any sleep over this, so this wiring was just experimental, and somewhat for the fun of it. But it works.

This wiring uses a dual-gang 1 meg pot. (One shaft.) With the pot on "10", it's electrically and sonically identical to a 500k pot on "10." As you turn the pot down, you simultaneously isolate the pickup, tone and vol from the circuit, while decreasing the load on the pup. It slowly rises to 1 meg, 'til you hit ground.

Here's the basic schematic:

 

[Artie]

Here's how you'd wire the pot. The cool thing is, you prep the pot outside the guitar. One end has both lugs soldered together and get connected to ground. The wipers get soldered together and connect to nothing else. The two left over are input / output. It doesn't matter which you use for input and which you use for output. The pot is symmetrical. CCW is always vol down, and CW is always vol up. So when you mount these deep in a control cavity. one side is clearly ground. (The two lugs soldered together.) The other two, connect however is convenient.

I'll post one pic of a cheap SG where I first tried this. The pups aren't installed for clarity. The red arrows show where the pup hot wires connect.

 

[Artie]

The "fly-in-the-ointment", so to speak, is finding a dual-gang 1 meg pot. The only one I've found is this Alpha pot, and it has a short bushing. That makes it difficult to install into most LP's, where it would be the most useful. Bourns has a part number for one, but it's application is so rare, no one stocks it. I'd have to order 1000 to get one.

In the SG wiring, I hadn't added the treble bleed caps yet.

It might be easier to visualize, minus the caps, and with Vol up and Vol down:

 

[Artie]

With vol up, the pup "see's" two 1 megs in parallel, thus, 500k.

 

[switchman]

Wow this is pretty involved and I could see some applications I'd want to try it in.. But my brain struggles to envision all the interactions with capacitance and variable resistance in a circuit like this without taking some measurements when the dials turn. Lets say for example in your circuit, you set the selector to middle both pickups on, and you turn the neck pickup volume down to 5 while leaving the other 3 knobs set to 10. What's the load and effect on each pickup?

I gave up on a couple of Gibson style guitars because the interactive controls didn't work how I wanted in the middle position. I specifically wired one up to switch the pickups out of phase hoping to "dial down" one pickup or the other for Peter Green effects. But it never responded how I expected.

About the only thing I've ever done with Dual Ganged pots is remove the custom ones in TBX tone controls from 90's Fenders. Not the ripping on them, people just didn't understand how to use them.

I was going to suggest maybe you could disassemble one of those and make it a Dual 1Meg. Then I found this shop on Reverb that offers them custom. Probably not worth $40 + shipping but it's possible. Dual Ganged custom 1M CTS

 

[Artie]

Wow this is pretty involved and I could see some applications I'd want to try it in.. But my brain struggles to envision all the interactions with capacitance and variable resistance in a circuit like this without taking some measurements when the dials turn. Lets say for example in your circuit, you set the selector to middle both pickups on, and you turn the neck pickup volume down to 5 while leaving the other 3 knobs set to 10. What's the load and effect on each pickup?

That's a bit difficult to answer. The DC resistance that I could measure with a meter, would be different than the AC impedance that the pickup would "see." And, I'm retired from the calibration lab where I'd have access to all the equipment I'd need to measure that. I can only go by what I hear, and I even did that over a decade ago. I need to reinstall this into something, (this time, with the caps), and listen again. The first test was positive, but it's been awhile.

Note that the pot you linked to is dual concentric. That's two individual pots on a common axis. This idea calls for a dual-ganged, or one shaft. My photo had a knob on it so you couldn't tell better. Here's a pic of the pot I used without a knob.

 

[switchman]

aww darn those are concentric in the link. I thought it was a modified TBX because it mentions Fender and 250K/1Meg in the text.