Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

[dave4378]

Hi All,
I'm relatively new to the whole guitar tech spec game.
I have a George Lynch model LTD GL200MT with a basswood body.
I know i could have got a better guitar for the price tag, but admittedly i've always wanted that paint job & bought it because of the affordable price tag.
Now my questoin is what would be the best bridge pickup for the Ratt rythm tone (think Wanted Man & Lay It Down main riffs) & Dokken rhythm tone (Back For The Attack album). I'm probably leaning a little more towards the Ratt tone. Now keep in mind i also like to play some thrash stuff like early Megadeth so i like to use quite a bit of palm muting at times.
I know most people might say the more obvious choice would be to go for a Screaming Demon since that's what Lynch uses, but i don't know how that'd go in a basswood body though. Also i know Warren Demartini used Seymour Duncan JBs back in the day & they did sound pretty awesome in an alder body Jackson i tried out a couple of weeks ago, but again a JB may sound different in a basswood body. I've been told JB is probably the safest. Your help & thoughts would be greatly apreciated.
Dave

 

[DonP]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

Lynch didn't start using a Screamin Demon til way after that album. He used a Duncan Distortion in his earlier stuff.

I can tell you I can easily nail both of those (and Megadeth) tones with a JB, but it's in my SL2H. I doubt it would sound the same in basswood.

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

I think either a JB or Distortion would make you pretty happy.

 

[Binnerscot]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

Yup, JB or Distortion. I would try the JB first.

 

[nemesis92]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

well they have a warren demartini sig model in the sd custom shop... i would suggest that

 

[sinrman68]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

I have the Screamin Demon...try the JB or a Distortion. The bass response in the S/D isn't what your looking for. Is that guitar the road-worn fender strat looking clone? I'm prepping a Distortion to go into an Ibanez S-470 with a mahogany body at next string change...used a JB years ago in my Kramer Beretta! George invented the S/D once he was able to afford those multi-thousand dollar amps that are the cat's meow...when he was using Randalls, Laneys, and Marshalls...he used the Distortion. Read the posts about hybrid pickups-that's the direction I'm heading. The S/D has this sweet, full bottom end-but it will literally fart-out when I chug. It has no low end crispness or attack. Oh, it's "sultry" sounding, alright, but I wouldn't dig it on Whiplash!!! IMHO!!!

 

[dave4378]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

I have the Screamin Demon...try the JB or a Distortion. The bass response in the S/D isn't what your looking for. Is that guitar the road-worn fender strat looking clone? I'm prepping a Distortion to go into an Ibanez S-470 with a mahogany body at next string change...used a JB years ago in my Kramer Beretta! George invented the S/D once he was able to afford those multi-thousand dollar amps that are the cat's meow...when he was using Randalls, Laneys, and Marshalls...he used the Distortion. Read the posts about hybrid pickups-that's the direction I'm heading. The S/D has this sweet, full bottom end-but it will literally fart-out when I chug. It has no low end crispness or attack. Oh, it's "sultry" sounding, alright, but I wouldn't dig it on Whiplash!!! IMHO!!!

This is what it looks like:

I was a little disappointed when i got it & found out it was made in China.
I basically Paid $1050 AUD for an iconic paint job on a cheap guitar & i've still gotta spend even more money to change that stock ESP pickup. I probably
should have bought the $1200 Jackson DK2M Dinky in the Crimson Swirl. Much better quality guitar for a similar price tag. Has an Alder body & already comes with a JB bridge pickup & it's made in Japan not China, so better quality build & materials.
One concern i have with the guitar i bought though is when i'm not amped up & i hold any random note along the neck board on either of the top 2 strings & hit the top 3 or 4 strings simultaneously, the string i'm holding down will buzz or vibrate against one of the frets. Sounds like the distance between the neck board & strings is too low so when those strings vibrate they make contact with a fret causing a buzz. Never had this problem with of my old guitars. The guy at the ESP Australia said it was fully set up before it was sent out, but i'm hearing different. If this is a permanent thing that's not to do with the set up then it looks like up stuck with a 1000 dollar dud guitar.
I'll try the JB though, sounds like that would be the ideal pick up & out of those 3 it's the one i've actually tried. Although i tried it in the alder body Jackson DK2M Dinky, but it sounded awesome playing palm muted thrash riffs. It really nails that oldschool thinner Kill Em All era thrash sound.

 

[DonP]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

Really you should have scored one of the light Bengal DK2M's. Those are sweet.

 

[dave4378]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

Really you should have scored one of the light Bengal DK2M's. Those are sweet.

Yeah started saving for a new guitar with the intention of originally getting a Jackson in the Bengal Yellow, originally i really just wanted a Jackson, but then i learned that the mid level affordable Jacksons like the DK2M don't come in the Bengal Yellow & after some homework i learned that the models that do come in that paint job would cost me around $5000 AUD, waaaay too expensive for me.
Then i found out about the LTD M1 Tiger clone coming out this year & the affordable price tag & after about 4 months of indecisiveness i took the leap & bought it. Like i said though $1050 is a lot of money for a guitar that with those specs would normally be considered an entry level guitar even in the LTDs if it didn't have that paintjob & Lynch's name attached. Took me aaaages to save up the money for it, so if i can't get this buzzing sorted & it isn't a set up or low action issue i'll be totally shattered.

 

[Shinobi]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

This is what it looks like:

I was a little disappointed when i got it & found out it was made in China.
I basically Paid $1050 AUD for an iconic paint job on a cheap guitar & i've still gotta spend even more money to change that stock ESP pickup. I probably
should have bought the $1200 Jackson DK2M Dinky in the Crimson Swirl. Much better quality guitar for a similar price tag. Has an Alder body & already comes with a JB bridge pickup & it's made in Japan not China, so better quality build & materials.
One concern i have with the guitar i bought though is when i'm not amped up & i hold any random note along the neck board on either of the top 2 strings & hit the top 3 or 4 strings simultaneously, the string i'm holding down will buzz or vibrate against one of the frets. Sounds like the distance between the neck board & strings is too low so when those strings vibrate they make contact with a fret causing a buzz. Never had this problem with of my old guitars. The guy at the ESP Australia said it was fully set up before it was sent out, but i'm hearing different. If this is a permanent thing that's not to do with the set up then it looks like up stuck with a 1000 dollar dud guitar.
I'll try the JB though, sounds like that would be the ideal pick up & out of those 3 it's the one i've actually tried. Although i tried it in the alder body Jackson DK2M Dinky, but it sounded awesome playing palm muted thrash riffs. It really nails that oldschool thinner Kill Em All era thrash sound.

I can get both tones using the C8 in my ESP and the 598 in my Kramer.
Just takes a little change to the EQ in my amp, which I have programmed to other channels.

 

[Christopher Caruana]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

Yup, JB or Distortion. I would try the JB first.

+1 the JB is THE big hair rock humbucker. Back in the 80's when all those guys were playing kramers and charvels, the JB was the stock humbucker for all those.

but like he said......JB first, then if you need a little more.......then go with the distortion.

The distortion is the JB but with a ceramic magnet instead of an Alnico5

 

[Shinobi]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

+1 the JB is THE big hair rock humbucker. Back in the 80's when all those guys were playing kramers and charvels, the JB was the stock humbucker for all those.

but like he said......JB first, then if you need a little more.......then go with the distortion.

The distortion is the JB but with a ceramic magnet instead of an Alnico5

I would not recommend the DD for Ratt or Dokken for that matter. I am a heavily DiMartini, EVH, influenced player, and can tell you that I had difficulties getting the AH and precision sounds out of the DD in my Baretta...even using a metal pick for Ratt solos. I came closer to those tones using a CC in my cheap ESP LTD.

I know it has been stated that George Lynch used a DD on Breaking the Chains but I am thinking he may not have unless he had really weak amps or something. I couldn't really get his tone like on Tooth & Nail out of my Marshall and Kramer with DD...or with my new Hughes & Kettner Amp. The picking never sounded that precise as it did with my CC and Kramer and now with my 598...with the DD it seemed to run together no matter how deliberately I picked or splayed my hand. I am listening to "The Hunter" right now on Sirius radio and and it sounds more like the CC in my ESP did.

I find it interesting or maybe sheer coincidence that both Warren and George's sig pups use Alnico II mags in them....kind of like a CC.

DD is great for playing songs off of IJFA or MOP by Metallica.

 

[dave4378]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

I would not recommend the DD for Ratt or Dokken for that matter. I am a heavily DiMartini, EVH, influenced player, and can tell you that I had difficulties getting the AH and precision sounds out of the DD in my Baretta...even using a metal pick for Ratt solos. I came closer to those tones using a CC in my cheap ESP LTD.

I know it has been stated that George Lynch used a DD on Breaking the Chains but I am thinking he may not have unless he had really weak amps or something. I couldn't really get his tone like on Tooth & Nail out of my Marshall and Kramer with DD...or with my new Hughes & Kettner Amp. The picking never sounded that precise as it did with my CC and Kramer and now with my 598...with the DD it seemed to run together no matter how deliberately I picked or splayed my hand. I am listening to "The Hunter" right now on Sirius radio and and it sounds more like the CC in my ESP did.

I find it interesting or maybe sheer coincidence that both Warren and George's sig pups use Alnico II mags in them....kind of like a CC.

DD is great for playing songs off of IJFA or MOP by Metallica.

The Hunter is my favourite song on Under Lock & Key...beautiful tone.

 

[DrNewcenstein]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

Side Note: Robbin Crosby favored Holdsworths in his guitars. As one-half of the RATT attack, you can't ignore that tonal aspect.

As well, the guitars you see stars with on stage and in magazines is not always what they used in the studio. Biggest laff was folks trying to nail Adrian Vandenberg's tone on Still Of The Night with his sig model Peavey, when they should have been looking for John Sykes' tone, since he did all the recording with his age-old Black Beauty :lol:


Not to mention you're not considering the boutique and otherwise custom-built or custom-modded amps, or the studio engineering.

 

[WoodyTone]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

I'd still try the Screamin Demon. It sounds good and has an 80s "edge" tone-wise to it. "Crispness" might be another word, or maybe just a harder attack -- which is more Lynch than DeMartini.

 

[jhale667]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

As well, the guitars you see stars with on stage and in magazines is not always what they used in the studio. Biggest laff was folks trying to nail Adrian Vandenberg's tone on Still Of The Night with his sig model Peavey, when they should have been looking for John Sykes' tone, since he did all the recording with his age-old Black Beauty :lol:

...Also, like the Peavey was ever going to come close to matching the tone of the Mesa MK III Sykes used on that recording...


I'd agree with those who suggested trying the JB, then the DD...but hey, I kinda want to check out a Warren Demartini model too, so try that as well and get back to us...lol

 

[DrNewcenstein]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

I'm sure Vandy had the same amp, but I was referring to his Peavey Vandenberg guitar. They're calling it the V-type, last I heard.

 

[easyrider66689]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

Warren Demartini uses a JB with a A2 magnet, this actually against all what is a A2 magnet seems to really tighen up the JB!!

I get a perfect Ratt sound with a JB with A2 magnet in a Basswood jackson.

I also have shortened my screws which also adds to the tightnes. and crunchyness.

 

[dave4378]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

Yes i'm aware of all the studio tricks & the effect all the different amps have on tone. Not to mention that more than half the tone is in George's & Warren's fingers. But pickups certainly change the tone quite a bit & the right pickups can make all the difference.
I'm currently using a 75 Watt Peavey Vypyr which is a modeling amp. Nothing fancy just a bedroom type amp to knock around on. I think it's the best sound you're gonna get out of a solid state amp though & certainly the closest i've heard to a tube amp. Not only that but it has a dial for a handful of popular pedals like say a tubescreamer & another dial for popular rigs like a Marshal Plexi for example. I think they sound pretty darn close to the real thing too. And with it you can dial in George's or Warren's without too much trouble & the early thrash tone is a breeze to nail.
The 60 Watt model is a true tube version not solid state, bit more expensive than the 75 watt though

 

[Shinobi]

Re: Best bridge pickup for basswood body for Ratt/Dokken rhthym tone?

more than half the tone is in George's & Warren's fingers. But pickups certainly change the tone quite a bit & the right pickups can make all the difference.

Yes it is a lot to do with how one holds the pick and I have found that I almost have to pinch each note as it's played. What helped me with this was using the metal pick because the attack and pinch has to right or it sounds really bad with the wrong attack.

But.....I had issues getting that with the DD because it got muddy in my Kramer...by Kramer Baretta has a Maple body and that might have something to do with it when compared to an ESP w/Alder body like George's guitars. Warren used Charvel which I think are also Alder.

This is also why I think the CC sounded better in my Kramer then the DD did. The CC in my ESP also sounded great.

I am think the C8 sounds good in my ESP, but I am wondering if it sounds better then the CC did now. I am also curious how the C8 would sound in my Kramer..but am really satisfied with the 598....it's one of those things if it sounds great....why mess with it?

But I may put the DD in my ESP LTD because it is made out of a cheap South American (light wood). I know that the DD will never go back in my Kramer though.