Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

P

Prozac

New member
Hi there,
i'm going to order a Custom ESP soon, i got almost all specs on the paper, but i'm struggling with my body wood choice. I thought, maybe some of you guys have an idea that could help me.

The guitar should be an 80s metal shreddy type guitar, and i'm a huge george lynch fan, so my order is influenced by that. Oh yeah, and i play an 83' Marshall 2203.
Some of the Specs are:
- Maple Bolt on Neck with Maple Fingerboard (and maybe SS Frets)
- Strat Style Body with Floyd Rose
- H/S Pickup Configuration (Demon and SSL-1)
- 1 Push/Pull Volume Knob, no tone
- Floyd Rose (recessed, for up and down action)

That's about what i want to order. The Guitar is going to be painted solid besides the neck, so the look of the Body wood doesn't matter.
I personally liked the demon with harder woods (i got one in a Maple Bolt on Guitar with mahogany body and Floyd Rose), but i'm not sure, which tone wood(s) i should choose.
Everytime i played an ESP Lynch (all Maple), i liked the aggressive tone, but it was a bit "blah" for my taste.
The guitar i have with the Mahogany body and the Maple neck is better in that term, but lacks a bit of the upper middish thing going on i think.

So it would be nice if somebody would post an answer if he/she has an idea.
My first suggestions were something like a Limba Body with 1/4" Maple cap, but i don't know, if that works well with a demon and an SSL.

Thanks very much!

Jerri
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

You've probably already considered it, but what about Alder? Alder to me has the upper mids as good as or better than anything else. It should be smoother toned than maple and it should have some decent midrange "cut" or presence.
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Thanks guys, i really appreciate your help!

Alder, lets see, i had an ESP M-II with a 59 and a JB, and i sold it, because i didn't like the alder tone quality that much. Not that alder is a bad tonewood or i didn't like the sound, it's more that i didn't like the sound, when i play the guitar.

Koa sounds interesting, it has more the tonal characteristics like limba and mahogany, hasn't it? It's a pitty that i never heard a guitar with koa body.
Do you suggest that with or without a maple cap?
Thin light finish? That the wood can resonate better?

Thanks
Jerri
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

I've had a few of the Lynch ESP's, the one that the Demon sounded best in to me was the Serpent, which was an alder body if my memory doesn't fail me. It also had a rosewood fretboard instead of maple. That said I still hated it.

I had a CS neckthru maple/maple/ebony kamikaze that the Demon was horrid in, I can't imagine someone liking that, but apparently he does, it was supposed to be just like what he actually plays.
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Most of his more recent guitars have been alder bodies, Haji, GL-56... His old guitars have heavy maple bodies, and during the Dokken years, supposedly SD Distortion pickups, although, he changes stuff quite a bit so it's hard to really tell what was in which when... I'm not sure I would get too attached to the Demon to get his sound, it would also help to know what "Lynch era" sound you are going for.

Also be aware that there is hard rock maple that is used in necks (and for the bodies of the old Kamis and Tigers) and there is softer maple (quilt and flame are softer). The softer maple is warmer sounding.


This is a solid quilt maple body with a maple/ebony neck and who knows what pickups:



This is a heavy maple body, maple/ebony neck and SD Distortion:



My <$0.02 and too much typing....
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Hi there,

the demon, well i picked the pickup not because i'm a Lynch Fan, i picked it, because it responds the way i like it. I had many Pickups in my guitars, the first thing i realized is, that real singlecoils (in a H/S/S Guitar) fit my playing most. I swapped several in and out and i liked the SSL-1 best.
Then i tried different pickups in the Humbucking position, i really liked the JB and the 59, but at the moment i swapped in the demon, i only thought "that's it, dude".
That's why i want to use the Demon, not because i'm a Lynch Fan.

I think it's better , if you have your tone, then if i would chase exactly Lynchs tone, because i'm not Lynch, and i don't play like him, so i won't sound like him.
So i don't hunt 100% for a Lynch tone, more lets say for an "80s Tone" :).

The Video Clips:
I have the one on DVD, on the first Video the only amp that has power is the purple Marshall you can see in the back. Pickups are a Demon and two ESP Blade Humbuckers in Singlecoil size.
The Second Video is from the same DVD, and the Desert Kami has a PATB (to my Ears the normal one, not the Distortion) and a SSL-1 lefty.
And the Duncan Distortions he played were wound differently, to 12.6k if my memory is right, and they have a more 59ish Voicing, like the Demon, i think that's more a Ceramic demon Version and it sounds damn close to the PATB (he plays later in the clip a guitar with the Demon).

I can't record my guitar Tone well, i tried it two weeks ago, when i got new tubes, but the camera doesn't do justice (sorry for the flaw in Mr. Scary):
Click the link!

Edit: In that Clip i'm playing an Ibanez RBM-1 (Tremolo has a brass block instead of the normal Zinc one), Demon in the Bridge and two SSL-1 in the neck.

Jerri :)
 
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Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

If that's true about the 12.6 pickup he was probably using a Seymourizer, which is just a Distortion neck, so you could try that.

Me personally, I'm not a fan, I just liked the way his guitars were set up in the mid-late 90's, the first thing I did was put in Super3's, haha.

Now I hate that wide ass neck, funny how times change you.
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Hehe, yeah, i know what you mean, i can't stand those modern necks. I really dig those 18" radius super jumbo fretted wide necks.

So we've got Koa, Limba, Mahogany and Maple now.

Has anybody a suggestion for a nice combination? (Bolt on Maple neck)
I don't know how koa sounds, can anybody describe that one?

Mahogany has that rumbe thing and the lower mids, Limba is a bit more hi middish and airy if i'm correct, how responds koa?

Thanks

Jerri

Edit: I think we don't need to think about the 80s thing, i think it is there with all these woods, because of the bolt on maple neck!
Oh here, just to get some prove of the Lynch Distortion:
Click here!
But i didn't found the youtube vid, where he says how much k ohms his old Distortions have :banghead:
 
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Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Prozac said:
Thanks guys, i really appreciate your help!

Alder, lets see, i had an ESP M-II with a 59 and a JB, and i sold it, because i didn't like the alder tone quality that much. Not that alder is a bad tonewood or i didn't like the sound, it's more that i didn't like the sound, when i play the guitar.

Koa sounds interesting, it has more the tonal characteristics like limba and mahogany, hasn't it? It's a pitty that i never heard a guitar with koa body.
Do you suggest that with or without a maple cap?
Thin light finish? That the wood can resonate better?

Thanks
Jerri
Click to expand...

Jerri,
Sounds like a cool project! I have to ask, did you try the Demon in the MII? maybe it was the pickups and not the alder you didnt care for? Just wondering.

Most of the Lynch axes are Maple IIRC. I just reread an old guitar world where they interviewed him and he said that he actually had one made back in the 80s out of maple but it was twice as thick cuz he liked a heavier guitar. Im not sure if more maple would be brighter or may fatten it up.. Just found that interesting.
Look forward to seeing what you come up with!
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Kami's are real thick, and maple. My neckthru was heavier than all but 1 LP i've ever played.
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Limba (Korina), it's basically a Mahogany but with more mids.

And if you REALLY want it to cut then perhaps even pair it with a maple top (not necessary but you might like it).
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Prozac said:
Hehe, yeah, i know what you mean, i can't stand those modern necks. I really dig those 18" radius super jumbo fretted wide necks.

So we've got Koa, Limba, Mahogany and Maple now.

Has anybody a suggestion for a nice combination? (Bolt on Maple neck)
I don't know how koa sounds, can anybody describe that one?

Mahogany has that rumbe thing and the lower mids, Limba is a bit more hi middish and airy if i'm correct, how responds koa?
Click to expand...


When I suggested Koa I was going off of your sound description everyone else seems to be stuck on the whole George Lynch thing in their recommendations. But if thats what your after just buy one of his guitars and not worry about it. But from what you said I think sound wise it will leave you a bit disappointed going off your description.

Koa has more zing than mahogany does but not a ton. Though your pairing it with a maple neck and maple fret board so you should still have plenty of snap to the attack. Its anything but blah sounding.
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

dagmar_gretchen2.jpg
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Sorry for the "weird" descriptions etc, and i don't want to sound ignorant or arrogant or something, it just isn't that easy for me, because english isn't my native tongue.

Don't missunderstand me either, Lynch is the reason why i started the guitar, i almost freaked out, when i heard his shredding from back then.
Usually my tone has enough "lynchiness", i like the top endy burning harmonic thing and how the amps sound with greenbacks, the H30 55hz and that kinda stuff.
I wanted to say more, that yeah, i'm going for a Lynch type of sound, but i don't want to copy him or his tone exactly, i wanna sound like me :), and i'm a huge 80s freak, hehe.
Hope that description is better :1::thanks:

If you ask me for my favorite Lynch era, it would be the late 80s and early 90s. And if you ask me for the favorite of his guitars, it would be the Neon Green Kamikaze, but don't forget, the buyable ESP version is way different than the original. If i have to pick a youtube video of one of my fav. lynch moments, that would it be, i think: Click!

That as far as the Lynch thing goes :). Yeah i know, the guitar i want to order would be the same Body size and Headstock look, like the Neon Kami, but with a different finish, and 1 or 2 changes to fit my hands/playing better.
F.e. my hands aren't that big, so maybe i go 43mm neck with at the nut.

Koa, like i said, it's a pitty, that i didn't heard that one, but i listened to some clips with koa guitars , and i quite liked it, so go on with that :).
As far as the Maple Cap on Mahogany goes, i think i would put one there, because i miss a bit more hi middish things going on , if i listen how my guitar sounds.

The M-II, yeah of course i tried many pickups in there, but my favorites were the JB and the Custom Custom in the Bridge Position. I like the JB very much, but in that guitar i think the Custom Custom was my favorite.
I couldn't stand the Demon in there, and i didn't like how it sounds with an alder guitar, when i hear lynch playing the demon.

Damn, a long post, hope you guys have time to read that.

Thanks
Jerri
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Prozac said:
Hi there,
i'm going to order a Custom ESP soon, i got almost all specs on the paper, but i'm struggling with my body wood choice. I thought, maybe some of you guys have an idea that could help me.

The guitar should be an 80s metal shreddy type guitar, and i'm a huge george lynch fan, so my order is influenced by that. Oh yeah, and i play an 83' Marshall 2203.
Some of the Specs are:
- Maple Bolt on Neck with Maple Fingerboard (and maybe SS Frets)
- Strat Style Body with Floyd Rose
- H/S Pickup Configuration (Demon and SSL-1)
Click to expand...

It's almost impossible that you will be happy with a Demon and a Floyd, unless you do funk or something.

Prozac said:
- 1 Push/Pull Volume Knob, no tone
- Floyd Rose (recessed, for up and down action)
Click to expand...

What's the push/pull gonna go?

Prozac said:
That's about what i want to order. The Guitar is going to be painted solid besides the neck, so the look of the Body wood doesn't matter.
I personally liked the demon with harder woods (i got one in a Maple Bolt on Guitar with mahogany body and Floyd Rose), but i'm not sure, which tone wood(s) i should choose.
Everytime i played an ESP Lynch (all Maple), i liked the aggressive tone, but it was a bit "blah" for my taste.
The guitar i have with the Mahogany body and the Maple neck is better in that term, but lacks a bit of the upper middish thing going on i think.
Click to expand...

I see no reason why you shouldn't pick alder. Highest chance of getting something nice.

In a guitar like this the neck has more impact than the body wood anyway. Make sure they put in a kosher truss rod and all.
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

walnut or padouououk or something relatively dark/middy
everything else going into the mix is quite bright

sure you don't want to get yourself a squier or a japanese fender or something first?
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

@uopt:
Why should it be almost impossible to be happy with the demon?
The Push/Pull will be the switch for Bridge (down) and Neck (up) Pickup.
The alder one is difficult to answer, but i had a 1977 hardtail strat, a 1976 1Humbucker Strat with floyd (bought it modified), the ESP M-II i mentioned, and i sold em all, because it wasn't exactly the sound i was looking for. I had a Gibson Les Paul and a Angus Young SG, too, but i've sold em all.

Over the time i figured out, that i really like the sound of bolt on Maple necks, the ones with 22 Frets, because the Neck pickups then sound nicer to my ears.
And i figured out, too, i liked Gibsons because of the "rumble" that was going on on them.

The guitar i most like, was my 1993 Ibanez RBM-1 Voyager (Body=Mahogany):


I'm usually not the Ibanez guy, but i liked how that guitar looked and felt (has a thicker neck than usually found on ibanez). The tone was awful at the beginning, i changed the tremolo block from the ibanez zinc one to a huge Brass one, and swapped the Pickups several times, until i got happy.
For myself that's the best guitar i have ever had.

And because i like the sound, but i want it a bit brighter, but i didn't like the all maple guitars, i thought a mahogany body with a maple cap would be nice. And because everytime i hear lynch with his Guitar, that has a mahogany body with maple guitar, i thought, there could be just a little bit more mids, so i came up with the idea of Korina+ Maple.

Thats the story behind that. I thought, uhm, maybe the guys at the duncan forum have some nice ideas, too, lets open a thread there, and now i'm here.

Thats the story.

@dr.ad.:
Haha, no thanks, i sold my last strat a few months ago , to be able to order a custom ESP one.

Anyways, i'm interested in the differences between Koa and Limba, both have a bit more zing and mids than mahogany, but where exactly are the differences between them? I'll search for the walnut/ pad.... (what the heck?) thing, too, thanks.

Jerri
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Prozac said:
@uopt:
Why should it be almost impossible to be happy with the demon?
Click to expand...

Very thin sound and the Floyd is the thinnest sounding bridge you can find.

Prozac said:
The Push/Pull will be the switch for Bridge (down) and Neck (up) Pickup.
Click to expand...

Oh so it's a simple pickup selector.

Prozac said:
The alder one is difficult to answer, but i had a 1977 hardtail strat, a 1976 1Humbucker Strat with floyd (bought it modified), the ESP M-II i mentioned, and i sold em all, because it wasn't exactly the sound i was looking for. I had a Gibson Les Paul and a Angus Young SG, too, but i've sold em all.

Over the time i figured out, that i really like the sound of bolt on Maple necks, the ones with 22 Frets, because the Neck pickups then sound nicer to my ears.
And i figured out, too, i liked Gibsons because of the "rumble" that was going on on them.
Click to expand...

And do you like neck pickups in Les Pauls?

I find myself only/mostly liking neck humbuckers when they are in a guitar with tremolo sustain block.

Prozac said:
The guitar i most like, was my 1993 Ibanez RBM-1 Voyager (Body=Mahogany):


I'm usually not the Ibanez guy, but i liked how that guitar looked and felt (has a thicker neck than usually found on ibanez). The tone was awful at the beginning, i changed the tremolo block from the ibanez zinc one to a huge Brass one, and swapped the Pickups several times, until i got happy.
For myself that's the best guitar i have ever had.

And because i like the sound, but i want it a bit brighter, but i didn't like the all maple guitars, i thought a mahogany body with a maple cap would be nice. And because everytime i hear lynch with his Guitar, that has a mahogany body with maple guitar, i thought, there could be just a little bit more mids, so i came up with the idea of Korina+ Maple.
Click to expand...

It's a good plan but IMHO you underestimate how much the bridge dictates the sound.

A tremolo with sustain block dominates the outcome more than any wood choice. And there are very bright piece of mahogany. You can pick up half of the SGs in guitar center and they take your head off. The Les Paul sound fat because it has a very thick body and a carved top.

What tremolo did that Ibanez have, exactly?
 
Re: Custom ESP - Body Wood Help

Hi there, that's a very good standpoint, i think, so thanks for the answer!

The Bridge: In that guitar is a Ibanez Lo Pro Edge, think of a low profile Version of the Ibanez Edge found in guitars that were made in 1987-1993.
To my ears the Ibanez ones always sounded a bit thinner, than the Floyds, but that was more because of that zinc block in there.
The bridge that i want to use for the Custom one is an unused ~1987-1988 Original Floyd Rose.

Pickup Selector and Pickup Question: Yeah, i really digged that on the Lynch guitars. On the H/S/S guitar i uploaded the picture, mostly the time i always use the Neck SC or the Bridge HB. And i never go on soloing like up/down/up/down/up/down, so i thought, thats perfect to keep all simple. I never use Tone knobs on guitars either.
My Amp is one channel only, too, i like to keep it simple :1: , from clean to lead with the guitar volume knob.

The Neck Pickups on Gibsons, lets see, on the angus SG it was a 57 Classic , i hated that one, it sounded only muddy to my ears. In the Les Paul the two 59s were ok, but i barely used that one, too.
I like Singlecoils in the Neck much more tonewise, i use them quite often.

The funny thing is, today i swapped my 12BJ (demon) out of the guitar, and put a 59 and later a JBJ in that position.
The JB had that cool hi mid thing as usual, but sounded fairly dark in the high end and a bit to loose on the low strings.
The 59 was quite good, sounds a bit brighter through the Marshall, than the demon.
I don't think that the 59 is brighter, i think the demon has just different highs, less bite and less gritty, but glass like single coilish highs. And the demon has that lower mid thing going on, that lets that thing sound a bit like a higain pickup, without being that higain on the lower strings.
That was what i heard, when i swapped em.
 
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