darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

[appar111]

Been digging on old Rainbow albums the last couple days ("Straight Between the Eyes" is kickin' my ass!) and I'm thinking of putting together an alternate strat pickguard with an SSS setup.

Thinking of doing either two SSL-3s, or just going with the California set of three SSL-1's with the RW/RP middle pickup. I never use the middle position on a strat (or the 2 & 4 positions, I'm more of a neck or bridge pickup guy). A California Set is only about $120, and a couple SSL-3s would be about $90 (or about $115 if I opted for one of them RW/RP).

Which would get me closer to 80's Rainbow era Blackmore-ish tones with overdrive? I know most of Blackmore's sound is in how he overdrives stock pickups, but if I don't have his sort of rig (insanely loud marshalls, rangemaster pedal, etc. or the Engl amp he's currently using), would the SSL-3s and a Marshall-ish overdrive get me in the ballpark? Or would SSL-1s serve me better?

I already have both a 3 and a 5-way switch, two 250K tone pots and I can drop either a 250K volume or 500K volume depending on which set I go with.

If I went w/ SSL-3s, would a 250K volume be way too rolled off? Guitar in question is a swamp ash body, vintage strat trem and maple neck w/ rosewood board.

 

[uOpt]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

I would use two Lace Sensor Gold (not "hot gold").

At that time he didn't use them yet but his sound was heavily drifting in that area. As a side benefit they control the hum. And they go very cheap on Ebay since they came stock in some Fenders for a long time and people swap them.

The SSL-3s won't do at all, Blackmore never used hot pickups.

 

[appar111]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Wasn't he using some sort of pickup that looked alot like the Quarter Pounders, but was actually some other brand entirely, that wasn't high output? Not sure how that got translated into the actual Quarter Pounders that went into the MIJ RB sig strat, but there you have it.

So just some regular ol' Lace Sensor golds? Those should be pretty easy to find on Ebay for cheap, especially the "Fender Lace Sensor" labeled ones.

Back last December I tried a Lace Sensor set (the red/silver/blue) for a Corgan-esque strat and the red sounded terrible, no balls or power at all, but I really liked the blue. Warm, but still stratty, not super high output at all.

Off to check the 'Bay for some used Laces!

 

[appar111]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Looks like I can snag a NOS Fender Lace Sensor gold for $40 shipped, and an NOS Fender Lace Sensor blue for $43 shipped.

 

[hermetico]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Did you ever tried the Antiquity II surf set?.
I think that was my best purchase, hands on!.

I recently uploaded a video on youtube, improvising over "Mistreated" free downloadable backing track. You can hear that set of pickups here:



Don't focus on my performance, because it lacks any interest but, here how those pickups deliver. I love them clean, overdriven or distorted. They are awesome and, one of my best findings.

 

[Laughing Kookaburra]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

^Dig your critic!^

 

[uOpt]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Wasn't he using some sort of pickup that looked alot like the Quarter Pounders, but was actually some other brand entirely, that wasn't high output? Not sure how that got translated into the actual Quarter Pounders that went into the MIJ RB sig strat, but there you have it.

Right, those were Schecter F-400s, which are having the larger magnet rods but unlike the Quarter Pounders have vintage wind.

So just some regular ol' Lace Sensor golds? Those should be pretty easy to find on Ebay for cheap, especially the "Fender Lace Sensor" labeled ones.

Back last December I tried a Lace Sensor set (the red/silver/blue) for a Corgan-esque strat and the red sounded terrible, no balls or power at all, but I really liked the blue. Warm, but still stratty, not super high output at all.

Off to check the 'Bay for some used Laces!

Well if you want to go after Blackmore you will be starting out with "weak" pickups. The trick is that you need to boost them up in the rig.

 

[appar111]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

The other missing piece is just the way Blackmore plays. I checked out this site: http://www.treblebooster.net/blackmore.html and no matter what pickups etc, he played through, he always sounds like him.

There's just something about the way he plays (sounds like he's plucking the string with his fingers and pick at the same time) and the way he switches so quickly between neck and bridge pickups, almost without one noticing, that really defines his sound.

 

[hermetico]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

The other missing piece is just the way Blackmore plays. I checked out this site: http://www.treblebooster.net/blackmore.html and no matter what pickups etc, he played through, he always sounds like him.

There's just something about the way he plays (sounds like he's plucking the string with his fingers and pick at the same time) and the way he switches so quickly between neck and bridge pickups, almost without one noticing, that really defines his sound.

That's why Blackmore is Blackmore and me and you, don't!!!.
Tone is always in our own soul and it's being "transduced" by our fingers.
Rest of gear helps in more or less ways but, to play like Blackmore, Hendrix, Gilmour, Gary Moore, Santana, Page, John Mayal, etc, you should be some player something similar to those cracks that are able to accuratelly reproduce a picture of a painter master (Dali, Picasso, Van Gogh...).
But, in that case.... what's your real personality, if you are only able to accurately copy to everyone else?.

And all this, without taking into account how the Studio post-processes the sound to bring you a finished product that can have subtle or big differences respect of the original raw sound.

Some of the subtleties that you are describing on the way Blackmore's play can be due to the fact that he used fully scaloped fretboard?.

 

[appar111]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

I don't think much, if any, of it has to do with the fretboard being scalloped. I really think it's in the way he attacks the strings. Whether it's a light touch or a heavy one (looks to me like he has a fairly light touch), and probably the type of pick he uses and how he holds it when playing, it's all Blackmore. It's the phrasing, etc. rather than the gear.

If that's the case, then perhaps searching for pickups to get me "the Blackmore tone" is a search in vain?

 

[appar111]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Did you ever tried the Antiquity II surf set?.
I think that was my best purchase, hands on!.

I recently uploaded a video on youtube, improvising over "Mistreated" free downloadable backing track. You can hear that set of pickups here:



Don't focus on my performance, because it lacks any interest but, here how those pickups deliver. I love them clean, overdriven or distorted. They are awesome and, one of my best findings.

awesome demo, Hermetico! Definitely sounded very Blackmore-like in your playing!

So those are the Ant II surfers? Is the bridge model the Custom Surfer bridge that's a little hotter? Is it the full set, or did you just go with neck and bridge pickups?

 

[hermetico]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

If that's the case, then perhaps searching for pickups to get me "the Blackmore tone" is a search in vain?

Not really, to search for pickups to get you Blackmore tone is a good start.
As said, use vintage output single coils. Antiquity II surf are the best I've tried but, I guess the Fender CS-69 will leave you in the ballpark, as well.

If memory doesn't fail, a Marshall SL type, a compressor, some overdrive and/or fuzz and a delay with a medium slap delay and, you will be closer.

Study his riffs up to the minimal detail, try to make those yours, to interiorize them, until they naturaly flow from you, without thinking.
After all this, you could be damn close but, forget it, you will be never Blackmore.

But, seriously, do you want to be Blackmore?.
I think the good thing is to learn his way of doing things and try to get something usefull to be included and adapted to your own style (was that called 'influenced by'?).

Usually, that wrong tries to copy a signature riff becomes in a brand new riff that will form part of yor own signature sound. You didn't achieved your first goal (to be Blackmore) but, now you have your own signature sound enriched, and that sounds to me way better!.
:biglaugh:

 

[hermetico]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

awesome demo, Hermetico! Definitely sounded very Blackmore-like in your playing!

So those are the Ant II surfers? Is the bridge model the Custom Surfer bridge that's a little hotter? Is it the full set, or did you just go with neck and bridge pickups?

I will never sound as Blackmore, I even didn't tried to learn the song, riff by riff. Just the overall structure and, I've only used that sound to check the Wampler' Sovereign distortion with something well known, to get a completer picture that complements my testings with my own stuff.

Respect of the Ants, those are the standard Surf set, no custom bridge.
I find the Xotic EP Booster of great help just to give an slight omph to the pickup's gain without affecting their awesome voice.

I've tried those pickups with 3 very different amps: Fender Princeton, Vox Night Train and Marshall 1923C, lots of pedals. Clean and dirty, they always give me the tone I am after. They have some hidden complexity in their tone that makes you smile when it suddenly comes up.

Just FYI, before testing the Ant II, my preferred set was the Bareknuckle's Mother's Milk, those are really awesome but, the Ant II have some i-dunno-what-else-more.

 

[appar111]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Yeah, i definitely don't want to sound exactly like him, but if I can try to pick up on some of his Blackmore-isms, then hopefully some of it will make it's way into my style and morph into something new.

thanks for the advice man!

 

[tonello]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Or you could check out the specs on this:

http://www.fender.com/products/ritchie-blackmore-stratocaster

 

[appar111]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Yeah, but he rarely used the Quarter Pounders in his career, and even when he did, he didn't use them at full power. I still find it weird that they put those in his signature guitar. What year did Fender first introduce that particular guitar?

 

[idsnowdog]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Do a search on Blackmore, F500 and Dummy coil. I posted some stuff about his setup just last month. Someone in those threads was going to replace his Schecter F500 pickups with Duncans. You might be able to buy the pickups Blackmore was using at that time from him. Blackmore also had one of his tone controls wired as a Q Filter.

 

[Mincer]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

His first signature series had 2 Gold Lace Sensors. I always liked his tone when he used the ES-335 as well. He is one of those players that sounds like himself no matter what he does or uses.

 

[tonello]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

Yeah, but he rarely used the Quarter Pounders in his career, and even when he did, he didn't use them at full power. I still find it weird that they put those in his signature guitar. What year did Fender first introduce that particular guitar?

According to Wikipedia, the second incarnation of the Blackmore strat was introduced in 2009. The first featured a CBS era headstock and hardware along with two Gold Lace Sensor pups. The second is the one we have today, with SD Quarter Pounder pups. I was never a huge Blackmore fan, so I never really payed attention to what he was using for gear.

 

[tonello]

Re: darn you, Ritchie Blackmore! (SSL-3 vs. SSL-1 questions)

His first signature series had 2 Gold Lace Sensors. I always liked his tone when he used the ES-335 as well. He is one of those players that sounds like himself no matter what he does or uses.

IMO most good players will sound like themselves no matter what guitar. Clapton can sound like himself on a classical guitar. Kirk Hammett sounds like himself even when he's playing those POS ESP's.