De-mudding Humbuckers

jafo

jafo

New member
Any techniques you'd like to share? Cheap ones, preferably!

EQ is always an option, but the best is probably to save up the pennies to buy a Jazz neck or bridge, but here's a few cheaper solutions.

First, there's ArtieToo's de-mud mod -- send it through a highpass filter.

Second, try parallel and coil-split wirings. This is very cool, because with the right switch, you can get all three options.

Mismatched coils are also workable and cool, if your skills are up to it.

But here's one I just tried: take out the screws from one coil. This gives a good singlecoil kind of sound, but with more warmth -- and no hum. Kind of like a P90 that plays nice (does such a thing exist?!). It's also remarkably cheap. I'm still playing with this, but I think I like it; I'll keep you updated.

Any other ideas?
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

ArtieToo (or someone) posted a great mod that turns your 'tone' knob from a tone-cut (low-pass) to a bass-cut (high-pass) circuit.

I tried it in a guitar where the neck-humbucker has it's own tone control, and it works great!
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

Ooh, that sounds interesting... I'll have to try that in my Frankenstrat.
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

Between filters like Artie's, and different levels of coil splitting, there are a lot of options (if you're willing to get your hands dirty).

I'm planning on bringing out leads from my guitar to actually do breadboarding with it. Then to use switches to flip between high and low output modes, each with its own EQ/split level. I think that the possibilities are really interesting.
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

Very cool; I'm intrigued! Could I ask you to post detailed notes, pics, and clips?
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

Btw, removing the screws from one coil seems to be working well: it's an odd sound, kind of phased, but unique. (It's a stock generic pup, and something good would probably sound much better.)
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

The best de-mudding technique is changing either the magnets and/or the pots.

HTH,

Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
Milano, Italy
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

LtKojak said:
The best de-mudding technique is changing either the magnets and/or the pots.
Click to expand...

That's a good point, yes; but alas, I'm already at 500K, and A5. But I think I'm overly sensitive; of all the neck clips on the site, the Jazz and Full Shred were the only ones which didn't seem painfully muddy, woofy, or woolly in the low mids. lol
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

jafo said:
I'm already at 500K, and A5. But I think I'm overly sensitive; of all the neck clips on the site, the Jazz and Full Shred were the only ones which didn't seem painfully muddy, woofy, or woolly in the low mids. lol
Click to expand...

So you have three choices:
1. you need to check your EQ
2. you need to check your speakers
3. you need to check your ears.

I'm not trying to be sarcastic, mind you. After twenty years of music as a profession, I've got my ears checked and to my dismay they were NOT perfect, to say the least.

HTH,

Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
Milano, Italy
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

I'll post stuff when I do get done with it (nothing soon, though).

But on the other point, I've had humbuckers that I thought were too muddy with 500k and A5 magnets, and I don't need my ears or my rig checked. When adjusting my tone, I play through a very clean tube amp, and I simply don't appreciate mud in my tone.

This dogmatism that the best way is always magnet swapping and pot values, is not helpful. There are many ways to adjust EQ that are often more appropriate, such as magnet degaussing, passive filters (like the de-mud mod), and different levels of coil splitting.

Changing to a higher pot value will just take out less treble. It won't take out excessive low frequencies at all, which are what most people perceive as mud. Changing magnets to A5 will bring out more treble, but also bump up the bass, which can bring in mud as well. For instance, the '59b sounds clearer with degaussed A2 and A4 than it does with A5.
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

LtKojak said:
So you have three choices:
1. you need to check your EQ
2. you need to check your speakers
3. you need to check your ears.

I'm not trying to be sarcastic, mind you. After twenty years of music as a profession, I've got my ears checked and to my dismay they were NOT perfect, to say the least.

HTH,

Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
Milano, Italy
Click to expand...

No worries about the supposed sarcasm, and I'm sorry about your dismay. All three of your points are good. I think most of it is substandard equipment; when I play my guitar through a decent amp or record direct, even the neck pup sounds good -- warm, if a bit soft, and not at all muddy. Unfortunately, the closest thing to an amp I have right now is a GuitarPort, and it's mud city.

I agree with you on the ears; I should have mine tested. I've also noticed that your personal tastes can really affect how you hear things -- right now I'm so hypersensitive to lower mids from mixing things, that even the Full Shred neck clip sounds muddy to me. lol

Anyway, thanks for the tips!
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

I guess I am a little different with neck buckers... I like that thick syrupy tone... I LOVE the 59 in the neck! If you really like a clear neck bucker with no mud, try the Bill Lawrence L500R... Very clear, almost too clear for me. I compensated by having the tone on my guitar set up so it only affects the neck so I can 'mud it up' a little. I also have it closer to the strings than normal I suppose to to bring in more bass.
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

Switching to hex screws has helped me, but to my ears at least, degaussed A5 has MUCH less mud than full stregnth A5. Also, +1 on degaussed A2 being clear, I have one in the bridge of my les paul, and it's almost as tight as my strat (through a plexi clone, though, which has tight bass with just about any pickup, so YMMV). Also, where's the artie bass-cut filter? I think I might hook one up to my bridge pickup in my strat to get more of a single coil sound out of it, for even more versatility...
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

jafo said:
EQ is always an option, but the best is probably to save up the pennies to buy a Jazz neck or bridge, but here's a few cheaper solutions.
Click to expand...

Just my $.02...

EQ is great. Since I got an EQ pedal, I haven't turned it off. It has worked wonders with my tone. I give a little cut at 200, 400, 1.5k, which reduces the lower mid mud - the 1.5 k isn't so much lower mids, its more just my taste in mids. I also cut 6.4k all the way down, which smooths the tone and eliminates that high frequency buzz that accompanies high gain tones. I boost 800 hz, which is my sweet spot for pick attack and clear chugs. Between the 200/400 hz cut and the 800 hz boost, my tone is worlds better and much, much clearer.

And yes, P 90s can play nice, as long as you know how to coddle them :biglaugh:
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

ModestCargo said:
Get Phat Cats. :)
Click to expand...

Yes, those are lovely pups in the right guitar! I've got a bridge one that sounds fantastic there, but the hum drives me fscking nuts. I tried putting it in the neck to get an idea of what a neck one would sound like, and it was too midrangy and muddy, with too much punch and attack for this guitar. (First-run PRS Santana SE, really murky in the neck.) A Jazz neck with probably a Jazz bridge is probably best -- smooth, clear, and singing. Besides, the PC sounds unbelievable in my Strat, and it's going nowhere! lol
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

well, Ive heard people that were really pleased with the DoMarzio PAF in the neck, and after all, its a famous and time honered combination with either a Super D, or a another PAf in the bridge.
Yet ,when I tried it, it was a very muddy neck sound with that DiMaz PAF.
I checked around, and found that one person here that seemed to know his stuff,wound his DiMarzio PAF down to 3K, and said that took care of all the mudd!!
So consider winding down youre neck PAF!
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

I'll definitely try winding down the coil sometime (once I have more confidence in my soldering skills) -- that should raise and widen the resonance, perhaps giving me exactly what I want. Thanks for the tip!

In the meantime, I've found that lowering the pup a lot seems to balance the lows and high with the mids, and gives more string resonance and sustain. To my ears, there is a bit less character, but a lot more responsiveness. To wit, I can control pick thunk.

I'd imagine that airbucking would produce much the same result (smoother eq, better string action), but with a tighter resonance (since the magnetic poles would be closer to the strings). Any ideas?
 
Re: De-mudding Humbuckers

jerryjg said:
people that were really pleased with the Di Marzio PAF in the neck, and after all, its a famous and time honered combination with either a Super D, or a another PAf in the bridge.
Yet ,when I tried it, it was a very muddy neck sound with that DiMaz PAF.
I checked around, and found that one person here that seemed to know his stuff,wound his DiMarzio PAF down to 3K, and said that took care of all the mudd!!
So consider winding down youre neck PAF!
Click to expand...

Well, I got a 1980 Eko Guitar (335 copy) with that combo (PAF on neck, Distortion on bridge), and the neck p'up was kinda muddy when the volume turned down, so I went the extra mile and change both all components and the wiring as well.

I used the '50 mod with a 500k pot .47 cap on the neck and a 250K .22 cap on the bridge and it was like to get a completely new guitar.

I don't use that guitar anymore, but the owner, which was using other guitar altogether to play live, now he uses it as his n. 1.

HTH,

Pepe aka Lt. Kojak
Milano, Italy
 
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