Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

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StormJH1

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http://www.seymourduncan.com/products/duncan-designed/all/

I know that most Seymour Duncan aficionados have opinions on the DD pickups ranging from "meh" to utter dislike, but I have a pair of black bobbin HB-103's that came stock in a Jackson guitar, and I think they're among the best pickups I own. Being ceramics modeled after the SH-6 Duncan Distortion, they certainly handle higher gain playing better than many other humbuckers, even more expensive ones from Gibson, etc. When posted on eBay, they routinely sell for about $30 to $40 for the set. I would happily plop in a used pair of DD's for the price of one GFS pickup!

I've been looking to pick up a pair of either HB-101's or HB-102's. Are DD sold by any vendor directly? Or are they just manufactured in Asia to drop into mid-level guitars as stock pickups (and then ripped out by pickup snobs and posted on eBay)?

Also, I've never seen the following DD versions on eBay for sale - has anyone been able to try any of these (or could tell me where to find them?):

fg101nb.jpg
(FG-101, similar to GFS Nashville, a rockabilly pickup)

hb104.jpg
(HB-104, a set of high output rail pickups, likely ceramic)

hb112.jpg
(HB-112, budget version of the Screamin' Demon)

Thanks!
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I'm not a pickup snob, but the argument "they handle high gain well" cannot be the only rule to define a pickup quality. Specially if you're comparing with the most commom Gibson ones, made with Alnico Magnets and more in the PAFish side of the road. It all depends on which pickup are you comparing them to.

You must compare your set to the Duncan Distortion, Gibson 500T or things like that.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

Over the years, I have tried various permutations of HB101, -102 and -103, an Invader lookalike, TE-101n, TE-101B, SC-101m, HR-101, Jazz Bass N and B and P-90 clone N and B single coils. I might have tried the DD version of the MT Blackouts.

How they sound depends on what they are installed in. Sometimes, you'll get lucky. Often, you won't. Fussy people like me notice the finer details. They become conspicuous when they are absent.

The DD pickups that I enjoyed the most were the high output humbuckers. I would not delude myself that these are the equal of their American equivalents but they are perfectly serviceable in their own right. An acquaintance of mine is still playing a Cort G series guitar that I modified for him with Rails N, SC M and HB-103 B pickups. That li'l beggar rocks.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I've changed the slugs, screws and keeper in a HB103N and put an A4 in, and it sounded very good in the neck of a LP copy.

In the same guitar I too changed the baseplate, screws, slugs and keeper nd put an A4 in an Epiphone neck p'up and made it a quite nice bridge p'up.

For the price of the modding I could've had a second-hand '59 set, but it was a good experience nonetheless.

HTH,
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I haven't used many DD's, but the HB-102 (JB/Jazz) set in my "budget" Tele-Gib, is one of my favorite axe/pickup combos.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I'm still a big fan of the Detonator, not only for being cheap, but for being something that isn't available in Duncan's US lineup. It looks like an Invader with the big poles but only has the 1 center thick ceramic mag, making it thicker than the Distortion and less mushy than the Invader.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

Duncan Designed pickups are primarily OEM. However, you can still buy the retail version of the HB-108, called the "Detonator", through Musician's Friend and Guitar Center under the label of "Duncan Performer". The HB-108 is essentially an HB-103 model with larger Invader-style pole pieces. Previously, the "Duncan Performer" retail series also included the "Scorcher", which was an overwound Hot Rails single coil, the "Buckshot", which was the OEM HB-103 (Distortion) model in retail packaging and the "Great White Snark", which was a strat single coil.

Obviously, you've already experienced the HB-103, which is fairly close to the Distortion in spec, although it has a standard ceramic mag, rather than the double-thick version of the real Distortion. It's balanced, articulate and holds up very well under gain.

The HB-102 set is modeled after the JB/Jazz and does a fairly close rendition of these models, though I prefer the USA versions if given the choice (nicer harmonics, more "depth" to the sound of the USA models). The HB-102 is the same physical wind as the HB-103, but uses an Alnico V magnet instead of ceramic. The neck is clean and crisp, as you would expect. Overall, a very versatile set.

The HB-104 neck/bridge set was only available for a limited time in early-2000s Jackson Warrior guitars, before Jackson started using the HB-108 "Detonator" models instead. The HB-104 bridge was offered in some limited edition Schecter models, as well. The HB-104 set was designed after pickups crafted for a Tony Iommi signature Eggle guitar (UK) in the '90s that never made it to standard production. The HB-104 features a standard pickup construction in that the "rails" are metal strips and the magnets are underneath the bobbins. I believe these are triple-ceramic in the bridge AND neck, as well. They are very tall/thick and weigh a ton (big magnets, lots of winds)! The bridge is high output, full of harmonics (the good kind) and very articulate, but the top end can lose its presence in some guitars. The neck has a very unique tone that I always enjoyed for ambient cleans (it is very deep sounding, round and a tad bass-heavy). This set sounds best in a balanced guitar.

The HB-112 was produced in 2 forms. The first run was for the Ibanez "SZ" series. These are labeled "IBZ/Duncan" or "Ibanez/Duncan" and were often stickered "HB-103" on the bottom because, as with the HB-108 and HB-102, the HB-112 used the HB-103 wind. However, the proper HB-112 can be identified by the top row of hex poles. The second run was for the Fender Squier "Vintage Modified" HSS Strats. If you see a Squier "Vintage Modified" model strat with 2 white single coils and a black humbucker at the bridge, it's probably the HB-112. These are marked "HB-112" and were available only very shortly through Fender's parts suppliers, as they were very popular. The HB-112 shares the HB-103 wind and standard ceramic magnet. The hex poles added a bit of tightness to the pickup and tamed the top end slightly.

Of all the Duncan Designed models, my favorite stock model would have to be the HB-112.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

My Hamer EchoTone came with a set of HB-103's. I quite like them. It might sound crazy that they are in a semi-hollow but they work well there. New higher quality pots really opened things up. At some point I may change them out for a set of 59's but I'm in no hurry.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I don't have much experience with DD stuff.

I do have an HB103 though, in which I've done a number of mag swaps. I find that overall it's a pretty good pickup, and definitely reminiscent of the JB/Distortion wind, but it tends to be a little bit harsh on the high end and a little bit anemic in the lows. Also on the whole it doesn't have as much depth of character as the actual Seymour Duncan pickups, but other than that, I have no complaints. It's still nicely voiced, and articulate.

A roughcast, oriented A5 makes it sound VERY close to a JB. But A8 and A2 also sound great in it.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

symptom said:
I'm not a pickup snob, but the argument "they handle high gain well" cannot be the only rule to define a pickup quality. Specially if you're comparing with the most commom Gibson ones, made with Alnico Magnets and more in the PAFish side of the road. It all depends on which pickup are you comparing them to.

You must compare your set to the Duncan Distortion, Gibson 500T or things like that.
Click to expand...

I'm not a pickup expert either - perhaps my description was not well thought-out. What I was trying to say is that I have the HB-103's in a Jackson DR6, and switching it back and forth with my Les Paul with 490/498's on the same amplifier/settings/etc., the HB-103 absolutely holds it's own. Granted, the HB-103 is a ceramic magnet wound for higher output, but the quality of both clean tones and distorted chords on the HB-103's is very good - I would use them again in another guitar.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

@masta'c - Thank you! I appreciate the very detailed information on what the various DD's are and where you might find them. Just based on tracking them for a few weeks on EB, the HB-103's are either the most popular or the most prevalent (or both).

I was aware of the HB-108 Detonator through Musician's Friend, and I believe it is only $30. I nearly pulled the trigger on it a few times, but was scared off by two things: (1) I'm not a particularly heavy player into metal and that type of music, so I didn't think it fit the more rock/blues type stuff I play; (2) Both the Duncan website descriptions and people on forums who used it described it as extremely dark. It's bassy even with 500k pots, and a lot of the guitars I would potentially put it into are H-S-S guitars with a single 250k pot, which sounded like a recipe for disaster. For the right guitar, I still would be interested in trying either the Detonator or Invader someday.

The information you provided for the HB-104 Rails was extremely useful, and I will refer back to it if I ever even see a pair for sale. I have yet to see them on eBay.

I will definitely keep an eye out for HB-112 pickups that might be labeled as HB-103's, but have the hex row on top.

I've seen the FG-101 in guitars, usually semi-hollows, but not for sale by themselves. If I were going that route, however, I think I'd rather try out the Nashville by GFS.

I'm still also keeping an eye out for a good deal on the chrome (or gold) plated HB-101's or HB-102's (maybe one of each in the neck/bridge), which I think are sharp looking. I understand the snobbery that comes out about the DD's to a degree because if you have $800 dollar LP Studio, or even a $400 Epi LP Std, the DD pickups aren't really an "upgrade" in quality over stock, and $70 - $90 for a single pickup really isn't that much if you have an expensive guitar you want to play for a long time. In my case, I like to fix up cheaper guitars (Squiers, Peavey, etc.) that have otherwise good bones, but it becomes tough to justify $160 in pickups for a guitar that didn't cost that much to begin with. I think that if some of these DD's sound even 90% as good as the Seymour Duncan's they're inspired by, it's can be an extremely good value.
 
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Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

Well I dunno about the models these DD's are based on but I'm pretty sure that a pickup machine wound in the USA is not really better than a pickup machine wound in the USA. Sure a "pickup snob", as you guys put it, will be convinced beforehand that the DD is not going to be as good as a made in USA Duncan (I'm talking machine wound... We all know that the winders just work so much better in that Santa Barbara air as opposed to the harsh conditions in Asia.... ;) )
I mean you get guys who rip out stock pickups the moment they get a new guitar without giving them a chance....
But honestly, I have a pair of Duncan SC101's that are pretty awesome. I played the Duncan designed JB/Jazz (HB102 I think?) and it rocked!
I think those Duncan designed pickups are great especially if you're on a budget.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I have the dd p90s in my squire tele custom. They rule. They sound insanely close to my 60's Gibson p90's and my lollars. I like them at least as much or better than regular Duncan's. please don't tell Seymour I said that. I have no desire to replace them. Did I just say that?
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I also have a Squier VM Tele Custom II. Great fun. I am about to sell mine because my Seymourised Hamer XT Junior poops on it.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

LtKojak said:
For the price of the modding I could've had a second-hand '59 set, but it was a good experience nonetheless.
Click to expand...

+1. With used American-made PU's often going for half price, sometimes less, why not just get a set of them?
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I took the HB-103's out of my Schecter and put HB-101's in. I like the 101's better myself. The hb-103's are for sale if somebody wants them. Bridge is trem spaced.
 
Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

I currently have a 103N headed for the neck of a CAdillac, and a Detonator intended for a Vendetta project. Detonator is basically a Distortion with Invader poles.
 
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Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

Wow, I just won a 33 dollar "make offer" bid on eBay for a DD H-S-S set (used). The bridge is definitely a HB-102, and the neck and middle appear to be the alnico SC-101 single coils. That's a pretty good deal isn't it? Suddenly I'm swimming in Duncans, haha.


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Re: Duncan Designed: The Good and the Bad?

Chocklit_Thunda said:
Well I dunno about the models these DD's are based on but I'm pretty sure that a pickup machine wound in the USA is not really better than a pickup machine wound in the USA. Sure a "pickup snob", as you guys put it, will be convinced beforehand that the DD is not going to be as good as a made in USA Duncan (I'm talking machine wound... We all know that the winders just work so much better in that Santa Barbara air as opposed to the harsh conditions in Asia.... ;) )
I mean you get guys who rip out stock pickups the moment they get a new guitar without giving them a chance....
But honestly, I have a pair of Duncan SC101's that are pretty awesome. I played the Duncan designed JB/Jazz (HB102 I think?) and it rocked!
I think those Duncan designed pickups are great especially if you're on a budget.
Click to expand...

Haha. Yeah, I feel pretty much exactly the same way. Interesting that you liked the SC-101's, I wasn't even looking to pick those up, but now that I got them pretty much as a throw-in along with the bridge HB-102, I might have a new project down the road.

Thing is, the two guitars I have with unmodded single coils are both ceramics that I actually like. The projects never end :)

Since the HB-102 is most closely related to a SH-4, I'll have my first real "comparison" between DD and SD.
 
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