FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

[OlinMusic]

LEW:

I noticed you have a lot of duncans in your gear listinbg. I also believe you are a Duncan AND Fralin dealer. Can you enlighten me on what you perceive are the tonal differences? Can you make comparisons based on current Duncan models? Are Fralins better than Duncans for certain applications? Can you describe differences in feel? Which sound meaner, bark more, or are "fuller"?

I tend to lik eyour opinions and would like to hear from you. I have considered Fralins HBs for a guitar I am getting, but I must think twice about the price.

Thanks much.

 

[Rev Donzo]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

After trying dozens of pickups in my les paul, I finally settled on voodoos. Near the end of my experimenting, I sprang for a set of these fralins humbuckers, because I have like his strat pups in the past. I cannot tell you how disappointed I was with these fralin pickups. Very flat sounding with no balls whatsoever. I think it has something to do with the fact that the fralins are very heavily potted....I have never seen so much potting on a pickup. I thought about swapping them for another set using lindys return policy, but they were working at 4-6 weeks delivery, and the tone of the first set was so far from what I like to hear in a pickup that I just sold them as fast as I could.

 

[gripweed]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

I'm not Lew, but I do have a 7.5 Fralin in the neck of my "V". I can tell you that there is nothing flat or castrated sounding about these pickups at all! It is true that some players don't like the Fralins, and I think that there are two reasons why. 1) Some players like *really* hot pickups, 2) some players want that truly vintage tone. The Fralin does have some vintage quality, but it's not a PAF copy if that is what your looking for. It's just eq'ed a little differently (see below.)

The Fralins are indeed ballsy. They don't have any of the boomyness of a5 pickups, and there is a lot of clarity to them. My Fralin neck reminds me a little of the Jazz neck as far as clarity goes. It has an unreal and beautiful midrange as well. It is the best neck pickup I've ever tried.

In all fairness, I haven't tried the bridge pickup yet. I have to find a new guitar to put that in first

 

[Curly]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

Lew said he's off to NAMM.

he has comments on the Fralins on his site:
http://www.lewsguitars.com/Lindy.html

 

[gripweed]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

After trying dozens of pickups in my les paul, I finally settled on voodoos. Near the end of my experimenting, I sprang for a set of these fralins humbuckers, because I have like his strat pups in the past. I cannot tell you how disappointed I was with these fralin pickups. Very flat sounding with no balls whatsoever. I think it has something to do with the fact that the fralins are very heavily potted....I have never seen so much potting on a pickup. I thought about swapping them for another set using lindys return policy, but they were working at 4-6 weeks delivery, and the tone of the first set was so far from what I like to hear in a pickup that I just sold them as fast as I could.

http://www.harmony-central.com/Guitar/Data2/Lindy_Fralin/Humbucker-01.html

 

[Fresh_Start]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

Here's a thread from the Les Paul forum that might be helpful, including an opinion from Lew: http://www.lespaulforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=52605&highlight=fralin

My search over there yielded a lot more results for Fralin P-90's than for humbuckers.

I didn't know that Lindy Fralin supposedly makes a special PAF type humbucker just for RS. Might be BS, but might be worth checking out.

Had to look into this since Lindy's shop is about 5 miles from here... and I haven't bought a pickup from him yet. (Last contact was "Do you make any tapped single coils?" w/ answer "NO" with tone implying "you idiot")

Chip

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

I'm not Lew, but I do have a 7.5 Fralin in the neck of my "V". I can tell you that there is nothing flat or castrated sounding about these pickups at all! It is true that some players don't like the Fralins, and I think that there are two reasons why. 1) Some players like *really* hot pickups, 2) some players want that truly vintage tone. The Fralin does have some vintage quality, but it's not a PAF copy if that is what your looking for. It's just eq'ed a little differently (see below.)

The Fralins are indeed ballsy. They don't have any of the boomyness of a5 pickups, and there is a lot of clarity to them. My Fralin neck reminds me a little of the Jazz neck as far as clarity goes. It has an unreal and beautiful midrange as well. It is the best neck pickup I've ever tried.

In all fairness, I haven't tried the bridge pickup yet. I have to find a new guitar to put that in first

Fralin uses Alnico 4 exclusively on his humbuckers. He does keep some Alnico 5 in stock in case somebody sends one back to him asking for a little more output or bite, but he's otherwise married to A4.

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

Had to look into this since Lindy's shop is about 5 miles from here... and I haven't bought a pickup from him yet. (Last contact was "Do you make any tapped single coils?" w/ answer "NO" with tone implying "you idiot")

Chip

Duncan makes tapped single coils, and I don't know what Lew has but you can get them pretty quick and easy from www.gtrheaven.com. They have everything Duncan makes IN STOCK -- no need to order and wait.

And if Duncan/Lew/Guitar Heaven don't have what you want or otherwise can't help you, I can make you one.

 

[J Moose]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

After trying dozens of pickups in my les paul, I finally settled on voodoos. Near the end of my experimenting, I sprang for a set of these fralins humbuckers, because I have like his strat pups in the past. I cannot tell you how disappointed I was with these fralin pickups. Very flat sounding with no balls whatsoever. I think it has something to do with the fact that the fralins are very heavily potted....I have never seen so much potting on a pickup. I thought about swapping them for another set using lindys return policy, but they were working at 4-6 weeks delivery, and the tone of the first set was so far from what I like to hear in a pickup that I just sold them as fast as I could.

One of my friends put a set of Fralin buckers in an ES-334 (336? like 335 without F-holes) years ago and we came to the same conclusion. No balls or guts, no magic dust...they just kinda sat there. Our take on 'em was that Lindy's a Strat guy making 'buckers with a Strat ear. He swapped 'em out after week or two for a pair of Seth Lovers and all was well in the world.

 

[OlinMusic]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

I have used the Voodoo's and I have to say they sound very nice, clean, and vintage low output. Unfortunately, I felt they sounded small and too sweet. I actually sat at the amp shop A/Bing them against a LP with 57 classics, and felt the 57's sounded "bigger". Before anyone starts freaking out, SORRY, it's what I felt. I would have taken a leap on Voodoo's bc the tone was so sweet, but a) I use my LP for a lot of Rock as much as jazz, etc. so I need a big sound b) They cost wayyyyyyy too much for my tastes.

Actually, I have my eye on Nordstrands, but I figure I should think about a Fralin set since they are the talk of the town.

 

[Fresh_Start]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

And if Duncan/Lew/Guitar Heaven don't have what you want or otherwise can't help you, I can make you one.

Thanks for the generous offer!

I'm really happy with a tapped Quarter Pound in the MIM Strat, especially with a dial-a-tap control in place of a second tone control. IMHO hot single coils with a tap are under-rated. Makes me wonder what a tapped P-90 might sound like...

chip

 

[gripweed]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

I have used the Voodoo's and I have to say they sound very nice, clean, and vintage low output. Unfortunately, I felt they sounded small and too sweet. I actually sat at the amp shop A/Bing them against a LP with 57 classics, and felt the 57's sounded "bigger". Before anyone starts freaking out, SORRY, it's what I felt. I would have taken a leap on Voodoo's bc the tone was so sweet, but a) I use my LP for a lot of Rock as much as jazz, etc. so I need a big sound b) They cost wayyyyyyy too much for my tastes.

Actually, I have my eye on Nordstrands, but I figure I should think about a Fralin set since they are the talk of the town.

It really shows you how different people have different tastes when it comes to something as personal as guitar and pickup choices. For those who think it is flat and dull -- I'd like to hear what their idea of a great pickup is. It's probably not right or wrong, but maybe different from mine. They also may have put them in the wrong kind of guitar *for that pickup.* As far as the flat and dull is concerned, I find the Fralin to have nice but not piercing highs, perfect bass ( not overbearing or boomy) and complex midrange. YMMV!

 

[hamerfan]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

My concern is that there is something about this A4s. I used them in a DiMarzio PAF to fight a booming bass. That works very well since the A4 are very similar to a A5 in himids and treble. But in all bridge applications they sounded bland, gutless, bassless, flat or whatever. A A3, a A5, a A8 or even a small ceramic are better in this slot.

 

[gripweed]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

My concern is that there is something about this A4s. I used them in a DiMarzio PAF to fight a booming bass. That works very well since the A4 are very similar to a A5 in himids and treble. But in all bridge applications they sounded bland, gutless, bassless, flat or whatever. A A3, a A5, a A8 or even a small ceramic are better in this slot.

I don't think Dr. Barlo would agree with you. He said that a4 sounded almost exactly like aged a5 to him. It may have more to do with how much wax Lindy puts on them. I did not have that problem BTW.

Maybe it is the bridge position that is a problem, I don't know. I sure trust Lew's ears though, and I know he likes the Fralins. He says that the Duncans are warmer and more familiar though. I guess I should probably wait and let him speak for himself though

 

[OlinMusic]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

HMMM WAIT UP

I don't think you read me CLEARLY
I wasn't blown away by the voodoos. I like them just fine. I think they sound great, just not as big are mean as I want in my les paul. The models I tried were very very very sweet. Sweet is VERRRRRY GOOD for some things, and not so good for others.

I use my Les Paul for a lot of stuff that can be heavy and bluesy. I have the Jp wiring. So for me, I have special needs. I do not come from the school that vintage output is the only school. I like medium output for this particular guitar. I just happen to have found other sounds that were good for me besides voodoos. I also did not feel I could risk the price of voodoos, when I wasn't absolutely blown away. If they were $50 I would buy them tomorrow just for fun.

Voodoos are great. My friend has them, and he likes them, but even he has considered some other things. In other words, after a year, he is not a die hard convert. It does not knock the pickup, but it's interesting to observe.

They are by NO MEANS flat or dull.

SOMETIMES (not always) I do feel that this forum is dominated by 3 extremes, 1) metal guys who are looking into vintage tones 2) guys with some years under their belt (was that polite?) who seem to think the retro is king 3) people with tons of hard core opinion who just do NOT seem to play enough gigs to be dishing out so much advice. Either way, in the end I do quite like this forum.

Did I allay any confusion / Ramble enough here? hahahahaha

 

[dr.barlo]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

Never tried Fralins. It is interesting to read Donzo's opinion. But he is not the only person I have read who thinks Fralins are flat and dead. On the other hand, Lew with his vast experience seems to like them quite a bit. So all these is a mystery for me.

But one thing makes sense. If Fralin buckers are potted very heavily, they might not sound 3d. I've experienced that on Rio Grande BBQs and Texas'. In TDPRI(great forum) I've read a guy who was taking off the wax by putting a duncan pickup into the oven. :smokin:

I installed antII bridge two weeks ago, first baked it wrapped in toiletpaper in the owen at low temp for an hour taking away wax. Done this to my 5/2 and it opens up the sound, fatter, grainier twangier. And man this alnico 5 Antiquity twangs so crazy, have Glendale twangsaddles and that aluminum saddle on E and A is more Bakersfield then i´ve ever heard on record. Really satisfied with it. I must say that the old 52 RI pickup is also Alnico 5 and resembles the AntII.

Here is the link:

http://www.tdpri.com/viewtopic.php?t=45783

Very cool!

And I do not think the a4 magnet is to blame tho. I have 4 a4 magnets (from fralin) and used them in antiquities, pearly gates', 59s... As was described above, a4 to me sounds like an aged a5. If you want bass, don't go for an a4. If you want lotsa snap and attack, don't go for an a4. Whether or not a4s perform well depends on the guitar. That said I think 59n's sound best with a4 magnets.

Regarding voodoo's: Peter Florance is a very cool guy. Very nice to talk to. I owned a set of his 59s. While the neck was a to die for PAF clone (that's why I've gotten into a3 magnets in the first place ) the bridge sounded thin in my guitar. The bridge is a 8.10K a5 PAF clone. Obviously, could sound thin with that much brightness under the hood. But if you have a dark LP which does not sound that alive, this bucker is the one you should consider. Anyways, after getting my first set of timbuckers, I've sold the voodoos.

B

 

[gripweed]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

Never tried Fralins. It is interesting to read Donzo's opinion. But he is not the only person I have read who thinks Fralins are flat and dead. On the other hand, Lew with his vast experience seems to like them quite a bit. So all these is a mystery for me.

But one thing makes sense. If Fralin buckers are potted very heavily, they might not sound 3d. I've experienced that on Rio Grande BBQs and Texas'. In TDPRI(great forum) I've read a guy who was taking off the wax by putting a duncan pickup into the oven. :smokin:



Here is the link:

http://www.tdpri.com/viewtopic.php?t=45783

Very cool!

And I do not think the a4 magnet is to blame tho. I have 4 a4 magnets (from fralin) and used them in antiquities, pearly gates', 59s... As was described above, a4 to me sounds like an aged a5. If you want bass, don't go for an a4. If you want lotsa snap and attack, don't go for an a4. Whether or not a4s perform well depends on the guitar. That said I think 59n's sound best with a4 magnets.

Regarding voodoo's: Peter Florance is a very cool guy. Very nice to talk to. I owned a set of his 59s. While the neck was a to die for PAF clone (that's why I've gotten into a3 magnets in the first place ) the bridge sounded thin in my guitar. The bridge is a 8.10K a5 PAF clone. Obviously, could sound thin with that much brightness under the hood. But if you have a dark LP which does not sound that alive, this bucker is the one you should consider. Anyways, after getting my first set of timbuckers, I've sold the voodoos.

B

Just a clarification-- Rev's response is not his. He copied and pasted it from Harmony Central.

Olin, I think you misunderstood me. I did use a quote from you to show how different people respond differently to pickups. I did address things that others said too, and that is probably where I caused the misunderstanding.

If you need to put put people into camps, go ahead. I am not a hot pickup kind of guy, although I certainly remain open minded. I'm certainly very open to mid output pickups. I really don't gig much anymore, and I never was a road dog like some guys here. If you want to discount my opinion, go right ahead. I just try to be as helpful as I can. I am the only one here who has answered your questions that has a Fralin humbucker in his guitar.

 

[dr.barlo]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

Just a clarification-- Rev's response is not his. He copied and pasted it from Harmony Central.

Olin, I think you misunderstood me. I did use a quote from you to show how different people respond differently to pickups. I did address things that others said too, and that is probably where I caused the misunderstanding.

If you need to put put people into camps, go ahead. I am not a hot pickup kind of guy, although I certainly remain open minded. I'm certainly very open to mid output pickups. I really don't gig much anymore, and I never was a road dog like some guys here. If you want to discount my opinion, go right ahead. I just try to be as helpful as I can. I am the only one here who has answered your questions that has a Fralin humbucker in his guitar.

I thought that was Rev.'s input over in the HC user reviews. Anyway, its cool!

B

 

[Lee_M.]

Re: FRALIN HBs - Calling on LEW for opinion

Versus say a SD AII Pro, the Fralins are much brighter, chimier pickups in both positions. Great overall pickups at reasonable output levels.

Just not my cup of tea at the moment.