How to pick a good 1st Les Paul?

[alex1fly]

What up SDUGF! I always appreciate y'alls opinions... hoping for some thoughts from any Les Paul enthusiasts. So I exclusively played a Strat for 20 years. In 2020 I decided to start adding iconic guitars to my arsenal so I have an incredible SG and an amazing fat necked Telecaster. Next up is a Les Paul. I am excited, but they seem to be THE most controversial guitar in terms of what makes a good one. Plus, the Les Paul is pretty far outside of my Fender comfort zone. So, how do you find a good one?

Generally when I shop guitars I play them unplugged, get a feel for the natural responsiveness, and then plug in to a low wattage amp clean channel. Is this still a good approach for a Les Paul?

Also does it need to be a Gibson/Epiphone or can the copies also have “it”?

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Generally when I shop guitars I play them unplugged, get a feel for the natural responsiveness, and then plug in to a low wattage amp clean channel. Is this still a good approach for a Les Paul?

I would skip plugging into a clean channel altogether. At least when making the decision. I mean, if a guitar has the resonance and the tone unplugged, you can just change the pickups to fit whatever you want. If a guitar does not have it acoustically, then you'll just be polishing a turd by changing pickups.

That's just the way I see it, though. I'm sure people will have other opinions.

I mean, it's obviously fun to get to hear the guitar plugged in, but when I bought my Les Paul Tribute, it came with the crummiest pickups ever (490R/490T). But acoustically, it just rings. So I just swapped them out. And I've had good luck, because whatever I've put in it, it's sounded good, just to varying degrees.

Also does it need to be a Gibson/Epiphone or can the copies also have “it”?

Depends on how "authentic" (LOL) you want it. I feel even Epiphones don't quite nail the Gibson experience. I own the highest-end Epiphone Les Paul and the lowest-end Gibson. But it's still a different thing. For me, it's down to three things. First, the placement of the pickups in general is slightly different on the Epi. Particularly, the bridge pickup. No way they can sound the same when the pickup is picking up a different part of the string. Second, the wood they use. I wouldn't go as far as to say one is better than the other, but what is a fact is they're certainly different. Not the same species of Mahogany. Third, the finish. And I'm sure there is debate on how much of a difference this makes. But I find it does, just not nearly as much as the pickup placement, TBH.

If you're spending Epiphone money, I would much recommend you take a look at the more traditional offereings by Schecter or LTD. Much better guitars for the money, TBH. Not to say Epis are bad, but they are not as well-spec'd as the higher-end Schecters and LTD's and are around the same price range.

That is if you're buying new, if not, many of the Japanese copies have a very good reputation. I've never played one, TBH.


That's also me being picky, TBH. I've had and tried a couple LP-shaped guitars that have sounded really good. LTD gets my top recommendation as far as budget LP-types go, personally.

If your budget is higher than that, I would look at Heritage, PRS, or Gibson.

But if you shop Gibson, make sure to try them before you buy. Gibsons are REALLY hit or miss. Some of them are magic. Many of them aren't.

 

[Mincer]

Before any of that, do some research. There are tons of different LPs out there, so decide on the features that are important to you. Set your budget and do not go over it. Find out what models have the most features that you want.

 

[Chistopher]

I think the big thing to think of is do you want a historically accurate LP or one with modern appointments? Usually the reason you get a Les Paul is you fall a little closer to the first group.

 

[jeremy]

first id suggest playing a few to see what you like as far as neck shape since there is a good amount of variation.

for the most part a gibson sounds the most les paul like of anything out there, duh. but what i mean is even though i have other single cutaway guitars, they dont sound exactly like a les paul to me. not better or worse per se, but different. my hamer monaco elite on paper is basically a really nice usa made les paul, but it sounds different than my les paul, even with the same pups in there. i played at least 30+ gibson les pauls before i found the one i loved enough to pay for it and bring it home

 

[alex1fly]

I think the big thing to think of is do you want a historically accurate LP or one with modern appointments? Usually the reason you get a Les Paul is you fall a little closer to the first group.

Nailed it. In my head I'd like to embrace the historical one, to see what inspired generations of guitarists.

first id suggest playing a few to see what you like as far as neck shape since there is a good amount of variation.

for the most part a gibson sounds the most les paul like of anything out there, duh. but what i mean is even though i have other single cutaway guitars, they dont sound exactly like a les paul to me. not better or worse per se, but different. my hamer monaco elite on paper is basically a really nice usa made les paul, but it sounds different than my les paul, even with the same pups in there. i played at least 30+ gibson les pauls before i found the one i loved enough to pay for it and bring it home

Can you elaborate on what makes something "the most Les Paul?" Obv I need to go play a bunch and that's the plan, but I'm coming into this pretty blind. I know I like LPs in music but there seems to be this elusiveness around "Les Paulness"

I would skip plugging into a clean channel altogether. At least when making the decision. I mean, if a guitar has the resonance and the tone unplugged, you can just change the pickups to fit whatever you want. If a guitar does not have it acoustically, then you'll just be polishing a turd by changing pickups.

That's just the way I see it, though. I'm sure people will have other opinions.

I mean, it's obviously fun to get to hear the guitar plugged in, but when I bought my Les Paul Tribute, it came with the crummiest pickups ever (490R/490T). But acoustically, it just rings. So I just swapped them out. And I've had good luck, because whatever I've put in it, it's sounded good, just to varying degrees.


Depends on how "authentic" (LOL) you want it. I feel even Epiphones don't quite nail the Gibson experience. I own the highest-end Epiphone Les Paul and the lowest-end Gibson. But it's still a different thing. For me, it's down to three things. First, the placement of the pickups in general is slightly different on the Epi. Particularly, the bridge pickup. No way they can sound the same when the pickup is picking up a different part of the string. Second, the wood they use. I wouldn't go as far as to say one is better than the other, but what is a fact is they're certainly different. Not the same species of Mahogany. Third, the finish. And I'm sure there is debate on how much of a difference this makes. But I find it does, just not nearly as much as the pickup placement, TBH.

This works for me too. I like playing unplugged so lively guitars are more fun for me in general.

 

[Securb]

The budget would be the driving factor behind which LP I would suggest. That said, all four of my Les Pauls are very different, with my Traditional and Standard being the most closely related.

 

[GuitarStv]

I would skip plugging into a clean channel altogether. At least when making the decision. I mean, if a guitar has the resonance and the tone unplugged, you can just change the pickups to fit whatever you want. If a guitar does not have it acoustically, then you'll just be polishing a turd by changing pickups.

Personally, I've never played a solid body guitar that was louder and more resonant unplugged than an Epiphone Sheraton strung with heavy strings. The Sheraton has a hollow body that resonates better acoustically.

I'd skip playing the guitar acoustically unless you gig and record with the acoustic sounds from your electric guitar. For the overwhelming majority of us, all that matters is how the guitar sounds through an amp.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

Some good advice above. There are so many LP models available now that it's good to have specs in mind going in.
If buying used, you have more variety available but less control over the exact specs of what you get.

If you're buying new, definitely go someplace big where you can try out several of the model you want.
Wood varies and guitars with identical specs can be surprisingly different from one another both in tone and in feel.
I look for a lively neck myself - if the guitar feels alive in your hands when you play it, you can alter the tone later if desired.

If you're buying used, some of the Made In Japan LPs (this includes MIJ Epiphones) are closer to Gibson than the present day Epis are.
Many 80s/90s LPs from Tokai, Greco, Burny, and Navigator are the real deal. But bear in mind that these often were made at several levels.
Best to avoid buying an entry level/student guitar; get one of the better grade models and you'll be happier.
Orville LPs (and Orville-By-Gibsons) are genuine Les Pauls too - sanctioned by Gibson made to the right specs.

Modern LP equivalents like ESP usually have decent build quality but tend towards thinner necks, I think.
If you're good with that, they're worth considering. Myself, I prefer a chunkier profile.
I have a ten year old Edwards LP Custom that's quite nice.
I think FGN is a quality brand too. Some of my 80s MIJ guitars are Fujigen-built and they're very good.

You might also consider a PRS singlecut. Not 100% Les Paul, but a very good option for a longtime Strat player.

 

[ICTGoober]

Buy something used.

 

[Securb]

If you're buying used, some of the Made In Japan LPs (this includes MIJ Epiphones) are closer to Gibson than the present day Epis are.
.

I have only seen one in my life and regret not buying it. There was a used MIJ Gibson Les Paul in a local music store that had one of the most amazing tops I have ever seen. It was a burst with a very exotic and interesting grain, not flame or quilt. It is hard to explain.

 

[chadd]

As some of the others have said, having an idea on budget and what you're looking for is a really good way to start. The next step is to play as many as you can get in your hands. You don't need to spend a mint to get a good one, but at the lower price points, you will definitely run into fewer "great" guitars than if you were comparing to Historic Reissues. When you find "the one" and you never want to put it down, buy it. Don't worry if it's the best value or if there is another of the same model available cheaper. If it's within your means, it's ok to splurge a bit for the guitar you're always going to reach for first. That said, keep trying them until you find that guitar for you. Don't just latch on the first good one you play

 

[beaubrummels]

When I bought my first Les Paul, I played a 1960's with P90s, a 1970's with mini-humbuckers, a 1980s with (T-Tops? Or Shaws?) and a 1994 with 498T/490R. They all sounded very similar and had 'that' Les Paul vibe going on. The older they were, the worse they were for trying to play in tune, frets were bad, bridge had problems, etc. So I just bought a new one that was set up and played in tune and sounded great. It's been my #1 and I've been the only owner for 30 years.

When I bought my second, I started looking more closely at specs. There were Customs that were all mahogany, Studios with a mahogany cap on a mahogany body (why?), and it appeared Gibson was using different pickups to counter act the differences in construction, for example, maple capped standard types (which can be brighter compared to all-mahogany) were getting the 498/490s, which are do-all pickups depending on how they are adjusted/setup, while certain mahogany Studios were getting Burstbucker Pros (presumably to get a little top end and vintage vibe out of a darker guitar, getting it back to 'that' sound.). I started getting picky about the specs, wanted to get close to historic/vintage as I could without getting into 5-figures. I got it down to where I knew I wanted a post-2012 Historic because those had the solid body (no weight relief), had the vintage truss channel, all hide glue, and used aniline dye for the burst. I searched and waited patiently for almost 12 years for just the right one, with the right grain and right flame. I got lucky because of an error in the listing; the price was listed as the markdown, not the price. So I paid what the markdown was, not the actual price it should have been. It was used / B-stock, and I don't think the store person who listed it realized what it was because they pointed to the aging as defects from use.

Doing research on all the models and years, determining what exact specs you want, and being completely patient until you find 'the' one for you is my best advice.

 

[Mincer]

Funny thing, I've never owned an LP! But this thread got me thinking...if I were to buy one, what kinda specs are important? Would I buy new or used? What would I be willing to swap out?

 

[beaubrummels]

If you've been a Fender guy all your life (Howard Roberts aside), you might like Securb's Custom Lite.

 

[jeremy]

Funny thing, I've never owned an LP! But this thread got me thinking...if I were to buy one, what kinda specs are important? Would I buy new or used? What would I be willing to swap out?

always used. i almost always swap pups but always give the stock ones a chance first. i like fat necks. i swapped the bridge on my current one for a resomax

 

[Seashore]

Someone mentioned weight relief above and it's something to keep an eye on. There are three main styles of weight relief - traditional, which is just some holes drilled in the body and still leaves a lot of weight (my latest one is 9.5 lbs); modern, which removes a lot more wood, in v-shaped patterns if I remember right, and leaves the guitar significantly lighter; and chambered, which is as it sounds, large cavities cut out inside the guitar. You can't see any of this from the outside but it should be in the spec. For whatever it's worth, I don't like much weight relief. It affects the midrange in a subtle way I find myself fighting against. I think part of the LP vibe is the feel and sound you get from playing a large, solid hunk of wood. If I want to play something hollowed out and acoustically resonant, there are other guitars that do that.

I think the 24.75" Gibson scale length is another part of the recipe. A little more thuddy and chunky if you're coming from a Fender scale, but you should still be able to get all the high end and clarity you want. A 25.5" LP-style guitar isn't gonna sound or feel like an LP. Another difference that's important to me is the neck angle; I'm used to Gibson's 4-degree-ish neck angle and I find that flatter LP-style guitars make me reach my fretting hand out in a weird way that puts strain on my shoulder over time. It's subtle but it adds up.

I don't find that unplugged sound or the "lively" feeling of resonance in the body translate to the plugged-in experience. I have some guitars that sound like gangbusters unplugged but don't really do it for me plugged in, and vice versa. For whatever reason I find I get more of what I like out of guitars that are pretty heavy, solid, and don't vibrate as much with my playing.

I know people who love their copies (Tokai, Burny, etc) but have no hands-on experience with them. The closest I've found to a "real" Gibson is a good Epiphone. There are differences that other people have enumerated above, but they can be right in the ballpark. The Schecters and LTDs of the world can be very nice guitars but my impression of them is that they're farther afield.

 

[JB_From_Hell]

I've owned several of those not amazing Gibsons. The Les Paul I have now (and intend to keep) is a Studio that's heavily weight relieved (7.5 lbs) and has the most even tone across all the strings and up and down the neck. The stock pickups (490 set) suck, so I've swapped a few in and out. It currently has a DiMarzio Norton in the bridge, Air Classic bridge in the neck, and absolutely sings.

I'd recommend looking at Studios from the last few years. Mine even has neck binding and trapezoid inlays, looks like a Standard with no body binding.

 

[Mikelamury]

You can probably find a Gibson Les Paul tribute used for around $1000. That's how much I paid for mine used on reverb. It would be better than spending the same amount of money on a high end Epiphone.

 

[zionstrat]

First of all, you've got a lot of good advice on this thread. Play lots of different models at all price points to figure out what you really need. But keep in mind, especially with the Gibson quality issues, you may find a low cost Epiphone that outplays all the Gibsons in the shop. It just depends.

So that's pretty much the same thing everyone else has said, but having started off on strats, I also have another suggestion. The sound and feel going from 25 and 1/2 to 24 and 3/4 is pretty big. In fact I ended up building a 25 and a half Les Paul Jr so that I could get the best of both worlds.

And also note that a good Les Paul is going to sound incredibly thick, which can be extremely useful, but you're not going to have the fast attack and nimbleness that you're used to on a strat.

So another approach would be something that sounds close to a Les Paul, but plays more like a strat. Think EVH.

For me, Explorers and SGs are far more comfortable, because of the neck access, and they retain a little bit of the spank that strats are famous for. Roll off the treble and they can do pretty much anything a Les Paul can do.

Not trying to talk you out of a Les Paul, just want you to be very aware, that at least for me, it's a totally different beast... Think Sultans of swing verse Money for nothing
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