Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

[papersoul]

Hey guys,

I have been boucing back and forth between the zinc and aluminum tail for my LP and can't decide. I should try recoridng both with new strings and compare. I had it totally stock but have been trying the aluminum tail but now am considering the Tone Pros set up and maybe the Tone Pros set up but rather than their zinc hardware, I'd maybe use their alumiunm tail. I guess I could use the Aluminum tail I got from Pigtail.

I hate that my saddles move a little when changing strings but it doesn't seem to effect intonation. Is the TonePros worth it?

I play predominantly high gain hard rock but that doesn't mean you anything in this case I guess.

Thanks!

 

[Luke Duke]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

Hey man tonepros DOES have aluminum tails now. I've got one on my guitar. I got the Tone Pros groved modern bridge and the aluminum tail. The old LP's from the 50's had aluminum, supposedly the drop in mass helps transfer the string vibration better or something.

While we're talking about tailpieces................
I just actually changed my strings on my Heritage last nite and am going to continue to wrap my strings over the tailpiece. By doing this I can screw my grub screws all the way in and have the tailpiece as far down as possible AND the strings won't ride on the back side of the bridge AND to me it makes the action feel a little better....not as stiff.

Hope some of that helps Papersoul

Luke

 

[papersoul]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

Thanks dude, i have the Puigtail tailpiece so I could just use that with the locknig studs and the Tone Pros bridge unless I say the heck with it and don't do anything! LOL. I mean the saddles move a little during changes but the intonation seems just fine.

 

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

hmmmm

I have no idea what the tailpieces on my 3 pauls are made from.

I have 2 Standards....one is a 1990 the other is a 2000. I also have a 2001 Classic.

They all sound pretty good regardless of the tailpiece composition.

 

[casblah]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

They say (whomever "They" are..) that the aluminum tailpcs. sound much more open than the standard zinc-plated t.p.'s. I have a guitar on order with and alum. t.p., so I'll have to wait to A-B them and hear the difference for myself.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

Just for the record (and maybe the vault?):

Gibson used aluminum stop tailpieces on all of the 50's Les Pauls. All of the zillion dollar Burst's like Billy Gibbons' have aluminum tailpieces.

In 1962, Gibson switched to zinc.

Zinc is at least three times or more heavier than aluminum. I've weighed them...that is a fact.

One reason (not the only reason!) most Les Pauls do not sound like old ones from the 50's is because of the zinc stop tailpiece.

(Other reasons are the lack of a Brazilian rosewood fingerboard, the neck joint, body construction and hardware. Tho the most recent Historic Les Pauls are pretty darned accurate...except for the lack of a Brazilian rosewood fingerboard on all but a few of the Plaintops.)

Bottem line: if you want your newer Les Paul to sound more like a '56, '57, '58, or '59 Les Paul, install an aluminum tailpiece.

As for the Tone Pros stuff, what I hear when everything is clamped down tight with locking studs, etc. is a fuller, denser tone that's both bassier and tighter than stock with no rattles.

It's a very good tone and I guess an "improved" tone but not what I'd call a vintage tone.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

That's a very accurate assessment Lew. So much is made of 'improving the tone' that it just gets overboard, to the point of spoiling some of the sweetness in a guitar's initial design. I figured I needed the Tonepros for my McCarty, since tunings besides standard with 9's or 10's, don't intonate very well on PRS's fixed bridge. As for my Les Pauls, all those aftermarket tailpieces just seem like an unnessessary expense.
Changing to aluminum might give me a more resonant airy tone, and the Tonepros will give a very hard, articulate feel. I opted to just leave my LP's as Gibson intended.
Should I think differently, or is this just a matter of splitting TOO many hairs?

 

[papersoul]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

Well, I did some tests tonight. I installed the aluminum tail and strung up the guitar and then installed the stock tail again and strung up the guitar making sure the tail was about at the same location for both tests. I preferred the thicker and warmer tone from the guitar with the stock tailpiece and I also felt the guitar sounds more balanced this way as if the highs are pulled back where as the aluminum tail added highs and a touch of clarity but not enough to offset the tone I got in stock form. I think the aluminum tail may be better for vintage tones where the stock form does the thick and heavy tones well but I still get vintage clean to crunch no problem just more to my liking.

I doubt I'd spend the money on a tone pros set up. My set up does just fine.

I do hear stock as tighter, bassier, and maybe a little harder and denser than with the aluminum tail. I think some day I'd like to own a Historic LP but I am more than thrilled with my current LP. My tech friend owns a totally stock '89 LP and man his live tone is to die for so they sound good none the less.

Lew, what did you mean by no rattles? I don't hear rattles on my LP, plus I think your assessment of a more dense, solid, and tighter tone with the tone pros is most likely subtle at best, no??? I doubt you'll hear a guy in the audience tell his friend that the guy on stage playing the Les Paul must have switched to a Tone Pros. Know what I mean? I am learning if it aint broke, don't fix it!

Even if I did get the Tone Pros solution, I'd get the zinc version and not the aluminum tail because I sense a more solid and thicker tone with less airy highs with the stock hardware. I like it this way.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

I was thinking of the change in tone I heard in my Hamer Studio when I installed a Tone Pros locking bridge and tailpiece. The tone got bassier and more solid. Thicker.

As for rattles, I can hear minor rattles when I play my Strat or when I play my Les Paul. The tune-o-matic bridge's individual saddles rattle a tiny bit as do the individual saddles on my Strat. Not alot...and not a big deal.

I don't think anyone in the audience can hear this stuff...including other guitar players in the audience!

We hear this stuff because it's a fun hobby for us.

But no one else can hear such subtle stuff.

Just us obsess-o-holics.

 

[strat_master]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

I think the 59 re issue has brazilian rose wood. Hmm i always thoguht they were eitehr made of chrome gold or nickel..... ive never even thoguht of zinc..

 

[Luke Duke]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

In my opinion the tonepro bridge and tailpieces best asset is the fact that the tailpieces and bridge don't get accidentally reset or (in the case of the tailpiece) fall off when changing strings. Tone-wise I can't say too much because mine had a schalelr super-duper heavy weight tailpiece and the tonepros set increased sustain and put in a bit mor treble but then again I had a roller bridge so obviously this one's different.


Luke

 

[GHWelles]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

The Tone Pros locking bridge makes a huge difference on my Korina V. The sound is louder and stronger and there is better sustain. Plus there is no wandering of bridge height when changing strings.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

The Tone Pros locking bridge makes a huge difference on my Korina V. The sound is louder and stronger and there is better sustain. Plus there is no wandering of bridge height when changing strings.

That's right. Tho Albert King never needed Tone Pros to get sustain or great tone from his korina '58 Flying V. :laugh2: Like I said, we're a bunch of obsess-o-holics. The real players play the damn things...not talk about 'em. :laugh2:

 

[papersoul]

Re: Les Paul guys - do you prefer aluminum or zinc tails?

I find the zinc tailpiece is more balanced sounding to me than the aluminum tail and the bass is warmer plus it hass pulled back highs to my ears anyway - basically more modern compared to the vintage and open aluminum.

I like what Lew says about the bassier and more solid/deeper tone with the Tone Pros.

Any idea if the notched saddles are okay to use and line up fine?