Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

[ThatGuyAgain]

Hi guys,
I'm here cause i wanna hear other people's thoughts about making a guitar company with a different concept.
You see, i really like guitars and all the tecnology behind it, and i've always wanted to make my own guitar without the cost of making a custom guitar.

Most of us are gigging guitarists who dont get a lot of income coming from venues, making this some sort of hobby, though in our hearts this is our real profession. I'm one of those guys, but i don't want to be discriminated because of it. I still want nice guitars, that are pretty, play well and dont break the bank.
For that im starting to see that a lot of people want it as well, and it wouldnt be too hard to start a kind of hipster guitar company that made guitars by order, small but with not very high profit rates.

Wouldnt it be nice that you could come with a jazzmaster that has a universal routing and a custom pickguard? If you want a p90 configuration, or double humbuckers, or a input/knob that serves as an expression control to one of your pedals. Everything you could think of.
And the only thing changing would be the pickguard, and the body would remain the same, like a blank canvas. The costs would really come down. The only thing that would raise the price were the after-market products (pickups, bridges, etc) But it could come blank or without pickups for example if you can find the parts at better prices. You know?

Is this even a good idea? If so, i dont even mind if you steal it, i wanna see it in action. (made by me or whoever else)

 

[Mincer]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Welcome to the forum!

Are you saying, build it from parts, or actually doing the woodworking? I don't see how either could allow you to sell a guitar for less than $1000 unless you like giving your time away. I don't think you could buy enough inventory to keep costs down. It isn't a terrible idea, but it might not be a good business decision.

 

[jeremy]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

welcome to the forum!

in order to stay in business you need to make money. "small but with not very high profit rates" sounds like a short lived frustrating business with a good amount of debt when it folds.

 

[Masta' C]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Sounds like you want to be the "Custom Shop" for GuitarFetish/GFS (LINK)...offering a limited range of parts and pre-made bodies that you can swap around to customer specs.

Basically, a low margin builder of personalized parts kits.

Also, small margins mean you need high turnover just to stay in business. Think of it in monthly wage terms...if you're making $100-$150 per build, how many guitars do you need to build in a month to make a sustainable wage and pay for your website, tools, space and 25% taxes?

To make any money on true semi-custom guitars whose parts aren't all sourced from China, you're going to be in the $1K range easily and need a lot of resources.

Here's what I would do...contact GuitarFetish/GFS and see if you can work out a deal for a perpetual discount on parts and recognition as a "preferred builder" on their site. Use his substantial internet traffic to funnel business to your "Hipster's Custom Shop", where you are able to offer completely built and set-up guitars made to customer specs, using GuitarFetish/GFS parts, at a price that competes favorably to the customer just ordering the parts straight from GuitarFetish/GFS.

Basically, if you can get a 20% discount on parts from GuitarFetish and offer their full catalog of options to buyers who are wanting a semi-custom guitar, but don't want to build it and set it up themselves, you could potentially "build in" some profit on the back end and perhaps offer them a completed guitar with their desired parts for maybe $100 to $150 more than the parts alone would cost.

 

[Southbound Suarez]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Welcome to the club...

The pup routing idea sounds like the "swimming pool" route that Fender already uses. When it comes to anything musically related, one really needs to get creative and to think outside of the box as there are a million and one guitar makers/builders, amp companies, effect companies, etc. In those cases, what can you offer that the other manufacturers, builders, winders don't that will really make your product stick out from the rest of the crowd? I already have my own ideas and it doesn't deal with what we speak of here although my ideas are proprietary and reserved for myself.

 

[aleclee]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Your definition of "custom guitar" is more like my definition of "hot rodded". I'm a lot less interested in pickup configuration than I am in neck carve, fret size, body shape, and balance.

What do you think shops like Kiesel are missing that you would offer? How big is that market and how much money can you make filling that gap?

Not looking to rain on your parade but those are the sort of questions that make the difference between having a profitable business and a very expensive hobby that sucks up your time.

 

[Masta' C]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

...those are the sort of questions that make the difference between having a profitable business and a very expensive hobby that sucks up your time.

Agreed

 

[Wildkat]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Sounds like you want to do what Warmoth does

 

[Nashvillebound]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

The Chinese have all the bases covered. To try and build in the states your not going to make it. Best option would be to hook up with one of the Chinese companies. I have not worked with Chinese manufacturers but have worked with Koreans. If you give them clear specs and hold there hand to make sure they understand and hold to the specs they can do a great job. Here are some links that will get you started if you really are interested. I was going to do something like your talking about through using a Chinese company as the source but could never get the start up capital and I sure wasn't about to go for it with my money - big gamble for a lot of reasons.

http://www.made-in-china.com/multi-search/Guitar/F2--CD_Guitar-Catalog--PV_3114080000_651064_238934/1.html

http://hanhaiguitar.en.made-in-china.com/product/nvzxUQryvOVG/China-Hanhai-Music-Semi-Finished-Red-Electric-Guitar-Kit-DIY-Guitar.html

http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/daphon2007/product-detailNBvQtWFGZmcb/China-30W-Tube-Guitar-Amplifier-TG30-.html

 

[HiFiRebel]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Check out John Benson. He is building some cool stuff in New York, but they aren't exactly mid level either. Low margin is what makes it a hobby. You can do it, but it won't be easy.

 

[stratguy23]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

While I agree that skimping on profit doesn't seem like a great business philosophy, I am likewise intrigued by the possibility of a custom-ish guitar in around, say, $1K USD. $1500 can get you a Fender American Design Experience guitar, so we're probably talking about a lower price point.

There are some makers out there that are sort of the custom guitar equivalent of Chipotle/PizzaRev/etc. - choose from base models, add options on top, add to cart. Halo, Moniker, and yes, Carvin/Kiesel come to mind. These companies do have some builds that can come in around $1K basically if you forego any bling/fat.

Guitar making, as far as I can tell, is a really expensive proposition. Not only do you have to source all the materials, you need a shop/factory to work in. A cost-cutting operation of this sort almost certainly would require a CNC machine - that's a 5-digit investment right there. And you need a booth for painting (make sure it complies with all environmental/health/safety laws, etc.). Once you start sinking in all that money, you'll be wanting as much as profit as you can get.

A customer investing in a $1K guitar is probably not going to want GFS parts, especially when better parts come stock on production guitars at that price. For a custom build, I'd choose a TonePros/Hipshot bridge, Grover/Schaller/Sperzel/Hipshot tuners, Duncan pickups, etc.

There's probably some market space out there for folks marketing themselves as *assemblers* of custom guitars ("I will put together your box of Warmoth parts"), like how assembling Ikea furniture for others can be a viable business.

 

[Archer250]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

It's a great idea if you can source the materials. I have a <1k guitar that uses the same grade of wood as 4k custom shops.

That said, your profit margins will be *very* low, your safety net virtually non-existent, and your ability to expand limited.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

 

[Archer250]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

To lessen your costs, some parts might be better made in-house.

Pickguards, for example, could be ordered as a sheet of plastic and CNC'd to shape.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

 

[Jeff5]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

It is nice in concept, but unless you are independently wealthy or have more time on your hands than anyone I have ever heard of, owning/running a company means you have to make money.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

While I agree that skimping on profit doesn't seem like a great business philosophy, I am likewise intrigued by the possibility of a custom-ish guitar in around, say, $1K USD.

Why on earth would anyone gamble $1,000 on a new and unproven guitar maker when they can spend that money on a guitar from a well-known American company or luthier? You'd expect a working man with limited funds to take a risk like that? Someone with more money is going to go to a pro with an established reputation. There would be almost no resale value to a guitar from a mystery maker. What kind of warranty could he offer, that wouldn't wipe out the little profit he might make? You can buy a decent used Gibson or Fender for $1,000. How would the OP compete against that?

The OP's looking at a best-case scenario of a hobby that might eventually break even. To make enough to live on is unrealistic. Too late to the party, with too little to offer.

 

[dave74]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Good luck.

 

[AlexR]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

There's one way to make a small fortune in the guitar building business.....start with a large fortune.

in guitars, you have several pricepoints. Very cheap, middle then going onto the top brand level.
The middle area you want to inhabit includes the budget lines of the expensive brands, so the people you are trying to entice would have to be attracted away from a brand they know well.
They would also be players who wanted he potential to mod guitars well beyond even what we do on this forum.

But just routing bodies isn't going to help really. Its a narrow market of people who only want a small amount of potential customisation. I think Warmoth would offer more overall changeability overall. And finished guitars from them are a bit over 1k.

I can also forsee about 10k or more worth of tooling before you even got to be able to buy wood.

 

[Rand-O-Monium]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

If you're that handy,mebbe just start a Tech Service(set-ups,p/up-hardware swaps,etc) to start off with.

Then perhaps let the customers do some entire assemblies for them as your rep builds.

 

[ThatGuyAgain]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Before i start i wanna thank you all for replying to the thread. You put more things on the table that i had not considered.

My purpose would be to make a 500$ guitar that would allow a lot of customisation, in a way like Chapman Guitars was at first. You can buy a custom Warmoth, Kiesel or Halo guitar for the same price and with more quality and with a good brand backing up your guitar. But what if I want my own pickguard? or made in aluminium? In these brands, a different approach means a lot more money being spent and i want to change that particular concept.

I want people to be creative, and stop getting stuck in the stock models. It's like we live in a world where there only is one type of pickup, one shape, one neck, one everything. And if you want to make a different something, boy will you get in trouble. The company that i'm proposing would be that one friend of yours that would give you a hand and help you out. Have the cnc to make the custom pickguard, the custom body or simply a stock, existent body, and thats it.

You could move along with the rest of your project, knowing you spent as much doing that custom stuff as if you made it yourself. As if you had the know how and materials for it.

Again, thank you all for the replies

 

[AlexR]

Re: Making a mid-range custom guitar company(?)

Well, there are quite a few custom pickguard places about. They allow for any regular shape of an existing guitar with just about any pickup combinations possible. But these tend to be plastic....any metals cutting needs a level of tooling that is not for the small company.
And of course warmoth offers quite a range of guards already, with almost all pickup combinations available.

Maybe you need to look at how much Warmoth can supply, and see how you are going to offer a viable alternative........and think just how many people are really going to be interested in the level of customisation extra.

Maybe you can give the forum some precise examples of what you propose that isn't already done and available.