Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

[Benthedemon007]

I am completely torn. Part of me wants the vintage Marshall but the other part wants the Orange. I play in a band, but this amp would have to function as an all purpose amp as well. I wont be playing at bedroom levels, but which would be better for home practice in a basement of a two story house? I play retro/traditional metal and hard rock/classic rock (the sword, iron maiden, Led Zeppelin, black sabbath, Jimi Hendrix, etc.) Which would be better for this?


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[Empty Pockets]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

They're both going to be great for those styles, and not having a ton of experience with either specific model but lots of experience with each of those brands, I'm going to assume the Orange will have a thicker, heavier sound with much more gain on tap than the Marshall. You're probably going to have to play through each to know for sure. I call it "taste testing."

 

[MetalManiac]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

They're both going to be great for those styles, and not having a ton of experience with either specific model but lots of experience with each of those brands, I'm going to assume the Orange will have a thicker, heavier sound with much more gain on tap than the Marshall. You're probably going to have to play through each to know for sure. I call it "taste testing."

Or in the case of E.P.; Tasting Testes.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

What is the JTM master volume?

 

[Benthedemon007]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

What is the JTM master volume?

Look it up. It's a Marshall from the mid-late 70s that looked a little like a plexi (but with a master volume) and sounds very similarly to a jcm800, but a little smoother.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

I think what you are really looking for is Marshall Vintage Modern. It has a plexi type circuit with a post phase inverter master volume, and some modern features such as extra pre-amp gain (in high dynamic range mode) and effects loop. It is based somewhat on the JTM45/100 used by Hendrix and Clapton during the 60s and so uses Kt-66 tubes. These are usually available used for much less cost than plexi, plexi clones, or plexi re-issues too. It will be manageable for home or gig use.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

Look it up. It's a Marshall from the mid-late 70s that looked a little like a plexi (but with a master volume) and sounds very similarly to a jcm800, but a little smoother.

Oh, That's a JMP. Okay. There was a 90s JTM30 and JTM60, but these are not what you want for your music styles and a have a bad rep for reliability.

 

[NecroPolo]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

Oh, That's a JMP. Okay. There was a 90s JTM30 and JTM60, but these are not what you want for your music styles and a have a bad rep for reliability.

Yep it must be a JMP that the OP needs.

On recording / mixing experience, the Orange is a little darker. The JMP has that kind of edge that I try to find in every amp so it would be my choice without hesitation despite the fact that the OR100 has a richer texture.

 

[beaubrummels]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

My first gut reaction was Orange for Zeppelin and Sabbath, Marshall for the others.

In my experience, however, if you dime the bass on an Orange, you get Sabbath. If you roll the bass back a ways, you get an early Marshall sound (not quite the tight Plexi or 70's sound, but the 60's slightly loose low end KT66/tube rectifier sound) In short, the Orange might be more versatile.

But I strongly recommend you find the two you are interested in (even if you need to be patient and travel a ways to do it) and play them and hear them with your ears, and your guitar, playing the songs you intend to play. It is pretty expensive to buy one sight-unseen/sound-unheard and be disappointed. But your call.

 

[Benthedemon007]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

So they're both good amps for what I play, and I should play them and decide?


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[Empty Pockets]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

So they're both good amps for what I play, and I should play them and decide?


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Yes. Apply this logic to food, clothing, cars, and romantic partners as well.

 

[beaubrummels]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

You are in the $2000 per item territory. I've paid big money for things that didn't see that much use and are hard to sell quickly unless you take a $$$ bath. You can decide what you want to do. I would recommend playing them and hearing them with your own ears before laying down that much money, if you can find the opportunity to play them in person. If you can't, then you can take a little risk, and just know you may need a little patience to unload them before you can buy the next replacement item. But I will say the risk is low because both amps are good amps and cover much ground. For you, I think the Orange will provide the versatility to cover from Hendrix to Sabbath to Maiden. The Marshall would be dead on authentic for the 1980's metal sounds, but not the older Zeppelin/Sabbath/Hendrix stuff, IMHO / IME

 

[Benthedemon007]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

You are in the $2000 per item territory. I've paid big money for things that didn't see that much use and are hard to sell quickly unless you take a $$$ bath. You can decide what you want to do. I would recommend playing them and hearing them with your own ears before laying down that much money, if you can find the opportunity to play them in person. If you can't, then you can take a little risk, and just know you may need a little patience to unload them before you can buy the next replacement item. But I will say the risk is low because both amps are good amps and cover much ground. For you, I think the Orange will provide the versatility to cover from Hendrix to Sabbath to Maiden. The Marshall would be dead on authentic for the 1980's metal sounds, but not the older Zeppelin/Sabbath/Hendrix stuff, IMHO / IME

Wait, didn't Hendrix and Page use Marshalls? Also, is it a mistake to look into the used market? That's the only way for these amps would be in my budget.

 

[GilmourD]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

Look it up. It's a Marshall from the mid-late 70s that looked a little like a plexi (but with a master volume) and sounds very similarly to a jcm800, but a little smoother.

You mean the JMP version of the 2203 and 2204?

The JTM45 evolved into the JMP 1987 (lost the tube rectifier and switched from 5881s to EL34s) and the JTM45/100 evolved into the JMP 1959 (always solid-state rectified, initially had two 50-watt output transformers but changed to a single 100-watt, went from 5881s to EL34s). JTM were produced until 1967, although there was a little bit of overlap in not only the circuit being used but also some JMP circuit amps ended up with JTM faceplates.

If you're talking about a four-hole Marshall, it's non-master volume. If it's got one or two inputs it's a master volume amp.

Jimi used JTM45/100s and JMP 1959s (and some Fender Showman heads towards the end).

Jimmy Page used... Everything? He used Hiwatts, Vox, and Marshalls, but the Marshalls he used were model 1959 (four-hole NMV) and he ran them loud on the bright channel.

 

[Benthedemon007]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

You mean the JMP version of the 2203 and 2204?

The JTM45 evolved into the JMP 1987 (lost the tube rectifier and switched from 5881s to EL34s) and the JTM45/100 evolved into the JMP 1959 (always solid-state rectified, initially had two 50-watt output transformers but changed to a single 100-watt, went from 5881s to EL34s). JTM were produced until 1967, although there was a little bit of overlap in not only the circuit being used but also some JMP circuit amps ended up with JTM faceplates.

If you're talking about a four-hole Marshall, it's non-master volume. If it's got one or two inputs it's a master volume amp.

Jimi used JTM45/100s and JMP 1959s (and some Fender Showman heads towards the end).

Jimmy Page used... Everything? He used Hiwatts, Vox, and Marshalls, but the Marshalls he used were model 1959 (four-hole NMV) and he ran them loud on the bright channel.

I'd be all for getting a plexi if they were cheaper and had a master volume. That's why I'm looking into the JMP 2203/2204.

 

[dystrust]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

I'd be all for getting a plexi if they were cheaper and had a master volume. That's why I'm looking into the JMP 2203/2204.

Don't rule out JCM800s either. The 2203/2204 circuit didn't change much between '77 and '84 at the very least. Some of the later 80s 2203/2204s can be a bit on the bright side, so I wouldn't want to buy one of those sight unseen. I'm not saying they're all bad, but I've noticed that the early ones tend to be more reliably good. Be sure to avoid the first revision 2203/2204s from '75 and '76. They look like the one in GilmourD's post and sound kind of goofy due to a rather different preamp layout. They revised the circuit and went to rocker switches in '77, that's the one you want.

 

[beaubrummels]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

Wait, didn't Hendrix and Page use Marshalls? Also, is it a mistake to look into the used market? That's the only way for these amps would be in my budget.

Hendrix used Marshalls. Page used Orange (and Hiwatt and others) more than people realize. Depends if you want to cop his live tone or his studio tone. You're trying to get an amp that does both. I've been able to coax Marshall tones out of a tube Orange, but not the other way around, so in my experience, I would recommend an Orange. Used is a fine option. All the more reason to hear it if you can, to make sure it doesn't have issues once it's warmed up.

 

[GilmourD]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

Don't rule out JCM800s either. The 2203/2204 circuit didn't change much between '77 and '84 at the very least. Some of the later 80s 2203/2204s can be a bit on the bright side, so I wouldn't want to buy one of those sight unseen. I'm not saying they're all bad, but I've noticed that the early ones tend to be more reliably good. Be sure to avoid the first revision 2203/2204s from '75 and '76. They look like the one in GilmourD's post and sound kind of goofy due to a rather different preamp layout. They revised the circuit and went to rocker switches in '77, that's the one you want.

The really early 2203/2204 preamp was actually basically the 1987/1959 preamp with a master volume.

Rumor has it that a bunch of early AC/DC was on the oddball non-cascaded 2203/2204 amps.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

I'd be all for getting a plexi if they were cheaper and had a master volume. That's why I'm looking into the JMP 2203/2204.

A plexi circuit with a master volume is what the Vintage Modern is-at least on paper. So is this if it doesn't need to have an M or an O on the logo, using power scaling instead of a master:

http://shop.fender.com/en-US/guitar-amplifiers/vintage-pro-tube/bassbreaker-45-head/2266000000.html

But I don't blame you you for wanting a JMP master volume if you can swing it. Extremely well built amps compared to today's, that also sound great, although they will still be really, really loud, where they sound like the records. Plus all the history behind them. Unfortunately JMPs are plenty expensive now too.

 

[ex-250]

Re: Marshall JTM Master Volume head vs Orange OR100 head?

Also, is it a mistake to look into the used market?

It'd be a mistake not to, primarily at that.



I'll second the above suggestion for Vintage Modern. I was recently between the VM and an OR50, think I would've been equally pleased with either but I ended up with the Orange due to availability. Honestly, given what you're looking at its a battle of great amp vs. great amp. If you can't try before you buy I'd just go with whatever pops up at a better price.