Metal pickup question

N

nyk03x2

New member
I've been watching a lot of Kiko Loureiro videos lately and it seems he's using a PATB Distortion in the bridge and a Hot Rails in the neck of his main Tagima guitar. He has a dark, very middy and compressed+fluid tone with almost no overtones. I actually like it very much, doesn't sound like the regular ceramic buckers with the fizzy and harsh top end. The tone goes so well with his sick phrasing.

Which pickup in SD's regular humbucker line sounds closest to the PATB2? I'm looking for a slightly tighter humbucker than the PATB2. Dark and powerful, LOTS of mids, and tight enough for staccato riffing. I know the Duncan Distortion sounds nothing like the PATB2, the thing lacked body and just sounds scratchy.

Any thoughts?
 
Re: Metal pickup question

The closest pickup is the standard Distortion, but it's brighter and lower output. Harsher, as you noted. It is also tighter, though.

You could try an Invader, but I don't think it's quite it, either.
 
Re: Metal pickup question

nyk03x2 said:
I've been watching a lot of Kiko Loureiro videos lately and it seems he's using a PATB Distortion in the bridge and a Hot Rails in the neck of his main Tagima guitar. He has a dark, very middy and compressed+fluid tone with almost no overtones. I actually like it very much, doesn't sound like the regular ceramic buckers with the fizzy and harsh top end. The tone goes so well with his sick phrasing.

Which pickup in SD's regular humbucker line sounds closest to the PATB2? I'm looking for a slightly tighter humbucker than the PATB2. Dark and powerful, LOTS of mids, and tight enough for staccato riffing. I know the Duncan Distortion sounds nothing like the PATB2, the thing lacked body and just sounds scratchy.

Any thoughts?
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And what rig is he using? If he's a Pro, then he's probably not just running guitar-into-amp. If he's got a mic in front of his amp, it's running through a board, which has stuff like EQ and compressors/limiters to give him a particular sound that you'd find somewhat different and distinct from his "me+guitar+amp" tone.


You can trim the excess sizzle of a Distortion with EQ, use compression to tighten up the low end, and smooth it all out with a peak limiter. Then there's the channel EQ to adjust the mids/bass/highs after the first EQ treatment as well.
 
Re: Metal pickup question

Actually, an Alternative 8 might be closer to what you want. It's described as doing metal rhythm nearly as well as a Distortion, and leads nearly as well as a JB. Soundwise seems to fall between Distortion, JB & Custom, but hotter and darker due to A8 magnet.
 
Re: Metal pickup question

Thanks for the replies!

Despair said:
The closest pickup is the standard Distortion, but it's brighter and lower output. Harsher, as you noted. It is also tighter, though.

You could try an Invader, but I don't think it's quite it, either.
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True. The Distortion's resonant peak is a lot higher than the PATB2, I think of it as a totally different pickup.

Reload in 5 said:
Custom?
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I've actually tried this one, very good for palm muting but that's about it, I guess. I really didn't like the excess treble when chording and the dip in the mids, sounded very weak when soloing.

DrNewcenstein said:
And what rig is he using? If he's a Pro, then he's probably not just running guitar-into-amp.
Click to expand...

You're right, probably. I'm thinking purely in terms of the pickup though. Even with processing I'd say his Hot Rails sounded pretty much like a Hot Rails, so there must be a characteristic thing with the PATB2 as well.

marvelous_seven said:
He's using ESP now,just see in ESP Japan websites about spec details.
He also uses Tech21 NYC Sansamp pedals,also search for some of his pedal demo in utoob. :D
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He uses ESP just for endorsement reasons while in Japan, otherwise it's always been his workhorse black tagima superstrat. Even in his latest lesson videos he's using some new kind of tagima. Plus, his ESP sounds nothing like his usual tone. The Custom 5 sounded very scooped and harsh compared to the PATB2, unsurprisingly.

Despair said:
Actually, an Alternative 8 might be closer to what you want. It's described as doing metal rhythm nearly as well as a Distortion, and leads nearly as well as a JB. Soundwise seems to fall between Distortion, JB & Custom, but hotter and darker due to A8 magnet.
Click to expand...

Interesting. Are there any clips I can listen to?
 
Re: Metal pickup question

nyk03x2 said:
Interesting. Are there any clips I can listen to?
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Alt8 clips at netmusicians -- I haven't heard the Alt8 in person, and can't seem to find a clip that doesn't sound insanely processed (high gain is one thing, postprocessed to an inch of it's life is another) or poorly recorded.

Sure, Kiko's likely using effects & processing to alter the base tone, but your tone description sounds very close to what daemon barbeque got out of his PATB-2. I haven't heard another ceramic like it.
 
Re: Metal pickup question

Despair said:
Alt8 clips at netmusicians -- I haven't heard the Alt8 in person, and can't seem to find a clip that doesn't sound insanely processed (high gain is one thing, postprocessed to an inch of it's life is another) or poorly recorded.

Sure, Kiko's likely using effects & processing to alter the base tone, but your tone description sounds very close to what daemon barbeque got out of his PATB-2. I haven't heard another ceramic like it.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link. The EQ curve sounds about right, at least what I'm going for, but it sounds very... grating. I thought it'd sound smoother than a Duncan Distortion. Doesn't sound that tight either, although that might just be the poor playing.
 
Re: Metal pickup question

It's hard to tell how much is the pickup, the amp, eq or bad recording in those clips. A lot of them sound awful muffled as well.

I've had no luck finding good clips of the Alternative 8, but there are plenty of excited posts about it in this forum. Frustrating...
 
Re: Metal pickup question

Not an Alt-8, but I was able to nail this tone last night with one:

 
Re: Metal pickup question

dominus said:
Not an Alt-8, but I was able to nail this tone last night with one:
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This is the exact problem I'm hearing with the Alt 8 (and the Alt 8-alike) clips. The sound is a bit too spongy, and the definition isn't that good either. I've searched through the forum for Alt 8 reviews and most say that it has good definition, but I'm not really hearing it:( It's clearly mushing out on the lower registers:(

I'm pretty impressed with how good the Full Shred clips on netmusicians sound, though. Does it usually sound that chunky? The SD tone chart seems to suggest a very trebly EQ, but the product description says fat and chunky?
 
Re: Metal pickup question

If you want total definition, go for the Full Shred or the Dimarzio Evolution.
 
Re: Metal pickup question

nyk03x2 said:
This is the exact problem I'm hearing with the Alt 8 (and the Alt 8-alike) clips. The sound is a bit too spongy, and the definition isn't that good either. I've searched through the forum for Alt 8 reviews and most say that it has good definition, but I'm not really hearing it:( It's clearly mushing out on the lower registers:(

I'm pretty impressed with how good the Full Shred clips on netmusicians sound, though. Does it usually sound that chunky? The SD tone chart seems to suggest a very trebly EQ, but the product description says fat and chunky?
Click to expand...
It's used by a lot of players seeking chunky tones, but they are using it in very fat mahogany guitars... So it gives them the treble bite to get defition and a blazing tone. Like the Screamin' Demon, a lot of players find it cringeworthy in a bright guitar.

Check out Vivian Campbell's "Sixgunz" for an example of Full Shreds into a Soldano SLO. Awesome stuff.
 
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Re: Metal pickup question

I'd really like to hear an Alt 8 doing power metal-esque staccato riffing (I know the Full Shred can handle it more than well, but I really like the meat of the Alt 8), most of the demos I've heard so far don't test the pup in situations that require a bit more precise playing.
The problem I've had with past Duncans (Distortion, Custom) was not the bass, they're punchy and tight enough for most applications, but the mids were just as muddy as, well... mud. The Custom lacking mids for soloing is one thing, the mids being muddy is another. Speed riffing 16th notes on the A string just brought the pups to their knees. I want some clarity, weight and punch when riffing on both the bottom E and A strings, and I wonder if the Alt 8 can deliver that.
 
Re: Metal pickup question

Hmmm.... sounds a bit like an EMG85. Less overtones, still defined, big output, lots of mids.
Just my 2c.
 
Re: Metal pickup question

Alex79 said:
Hmmm.... sounds a bit like an EMG85. Less overtones, still defined, big output, lots of mids.
Just my 2c.
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Trying to stay in the passive realm. I think EMGs sound ok in the neck, not too crazy about them in the bridge.
 
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