Need Rack FX input....

[Binnerscot]

The rack of doom is coming together well. I am still waiting on a power amp(Fryette/VHT), but the Peavey Classic 120/120 is doing very well in the mean time.

I need some input on rack FX units. I am looking for US made, badass, and around the $1K to $2K range.

I don't need any modelling/preamps, but I know many have them in this range. Specifically, I am looking for really good delays, verbs, and chorus. Right now my old G-Major is filling the spot well enough. I am not FX crazy, but I do like really high quality time based FX.

I am eyeballing these in order of interest:

Axe-FX Ultra - I'll bypass all the modelling. If they are really that good, then they may be fun to play around with, but the FX are supposedly on par with Eventide in quality. Seems to be the best match for what I need and I know its US made.

Eventide Eclipse - a little leary of reading about patch change delay (the H series is just overkill for what I need). US made and pretty tough to beat in FX quailty.

TC-Electronic G-Force - a little concerned that the technology behind it is getting a bit dated, aren't they due for a new high end unit? I think its US made, but may not be that great of a sonic improvement over the G-Major?

Rocktron Prophesy II - seems kind of limited with FX signal chain ordering and mainly geared towards its preamp features, which I would bypass anyway. No idea where it is made, no idea how its sound quality stacks up with the rest.

Do have any other ideas? Experience?

The rest of the rack is really based around the Bogner Fish, Mesa Recto Recording Pre, a handful of pedals at the front end, and Voodoo Lab GCX/Ground Control.

 

[Despair]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

There are demos of people doing absolutely insane things with the Axe-Fx Ultra. Mangling the attack & sustain, even overall impulse response of a guitar to behave like a bowed violin, even combining it with pitch shifting & delays to build an analog modelled string section. And the tones are influenced by the starting instruments, it's not at all like a sampler. That video alone made me want an Ultra... It didn't just do crazy stuff, it sounded amazing doing it.

Given you are talking about using tube power amps, and presumably guitar cabs, you probably want to bypass the cabinet modelling & probably the power section models.

Apparently the GSP1101 is pretty fantastic, for a much cheaper unit. It even has an effects loop, and what they call the 4CM (4 Cable Method) of hooking it up with a preamp in the effects loop, and bypassing the builtin sims.

 

[crguti]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

.. I am looking for US made...

why? other countries produce less quality products?

TC-Electronic G-Force - a little concerned that the technology behind it is getting a bit dated, aren't they due for a new high end unit? I think its US made, but may not be that great of a sonic improvement over the G-Major?

sorry dude, TC Electronic is a Danish company, same than T-Rex and Carl Martin.

 

[Binnerscot]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

why? other countries produce less quality products?


sorry dude, TC Electronic is a Danish company, same than T-Rex and Carl Martin.

Thanks for contributing. I like rooting for the home team (I know TC is a Danish company, not sure where they make their upper line of gear though)

 

[Binnerscot]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

There are demos of people doing absolutely insane things with the Axe-Fx Ultra....

Apparently the GSP1101 is pretty fantastic, for a much cheaper unit.

Yeah, the Axe-FX seems to be the most appropriate for a high quality FX unit that can be used in a live midi switching rig.

While I am sure Digitech has made great improvements over the years, I just can't bring myself to even consider Digitech. 1U rack effects units "Made in China" from <insert any number of companies here> are a dime a dozen and with similar outcomes. Not bad, but not inspring.

 

[Mincer]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

Kinda silly to buy the Axe and not use the modeling- that is mostly why it costs so much.
I'd go with the Eclipse, or make that 2 Eclipses if you are worried about delay in switching (it is a big deal for me too). For just time-based stuff, nothing out there twists the sounds like an Eclipse. It is overkill though, if you just want basic reverbs and delays. If you like the weird stuff like I do, the Eclipse is the one.

 

[Binnerscot]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

Kinda silly to buy the Axe and not use the modeling- that is mostly why it costs so much.
I'd go with the Eclipse, or make that 2 Eclipses if you are worried about delay in switching (it is a big deal for me too). For just time-based stuff, nothing out there twists the sounds like an Eclipse. It is overkill though, if you just want basic reverbs and delays. If you like the weird stuff like I do, the Eclipse is the one.

Hmmm...I didn't think of running two units. At 1U, I have enough rack space to fit two. I don't go crazy with FX, but there is a delay/verb sound in my head that may just in an Eventide, though I have heard the Axe-FX sound pretty close in clips.

Thanks for the two FX unit idea...

 

[Despair]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

Yeah, the Axe-FX seems to be the most appropriate for a high quality FX unit that can be used in a live midi switching rig.

While I am sure Digitech has made great improvements over the years, I just can't bring myself to even consider Digitech. 1U rack effects units "Made in China" from <insert any number of companies here> are a dime a dozen and with similar outcomes. Not bad, but not inspring.

It's supposed to be the next-best amp sim, and have great effects, but the difference between Fractal Audio and all the other hardware modellers is pretty enormous. For the price it has amazing features, but given the budget I'd be surprised if it made the cut.

Axe-Fx Ultra can do surprising things with replacement impulse models. And the constant stream of firmware updates is a quality of service beyond anything I've heard of in the industry.

 

[J Moose]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

TC & Eventide are both top shelf boxes... Lexicon stuff is worth a look too, even the old PCM 80 is still hard to beat. They all have vastly different "feels" to the sounds.

As for the switching delays... are you running a wet/dry/wet rig or just stereo?

 

[DrNewcenstein]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

As long as China, Japan, and Indonesia have the lowest labor costs, everything will at some point be made there. As a fellow American I can appreciate the "Buy American" ideal, but honestly even the Fractal Audio stuff is made with foreign components - ICs, etc.

That said, the Yamaha SPX90 was a studio standard for 20 years ( if it's not anymore), as well as in the road rack of many pros.

 

[Binnerscot]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

TC & Eventide are both top shelf boxes... Lexicon stuff is worth a look too, even the old PCM 80 is still hard to beat. They all have vastly different "feels" to the sounds.

As for the switching delays... are you running a wet/dry/wet rig or just stereo?

I was just looking at the PCM92 on Lexicon's site, looks to be around the range I am looking for in both quality and within budget.

Answer: D - all of the above.

I have it set up to A/B between pre-amps, with loops before to include the pedals, and a stereo loop after the pre-amps for the rack processor. It is pretty flexible, but if I switch from patch A to patch B and they both use the rack processor but with a different effect patch, the switching delay would become apparent (if one exists). The G-Major has been really good with that.

That said, the Yamaha SPX90 was a studio standard for 20 years ( if it's not anymore), as well as in the road rack of many pros.

I have considered, the SPX2000 - I might be able to find one of those locally to try out.

 

[J Moose]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

I haven't played with the PCM92 but historically, the PCM series primarily offers one effect at a time, or reverb and a "limited" version of some other effect, like chorus. I was actually thinking of something like the MPX1...

If you're only going to have one effects unit I'd think that there would be a lot more mileage to be had in something like the Eclipse or the TC Fireworx that are true multi-effects boxes.

Any time you get into midi switching there's always a slight delay when switching patches... the way around it is to either have a line mixer or run a wet/dry/wet setup with the effects in stereo and a mono dry signal... tri-amped.

 

[Binnerscot]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

...historically, the PCM series primarily offers one effect at a time, or reverb and a "limited" version of some other effect...

Thanks...that is one of the questions I had about it, I was about to download the manual.

 

[Warheart]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

No thoughts about the G-Major 2? There are a lot of G-Majors floating around now because of the new model!

 

[aleclee]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

Unless you want some of the Ultra-only effects, save yourself some coin and get the AxeFX Standard. If you're not using amp/cab models, it'll do everything the Ultra can at about 25% less cost.

 

[Despair]

Re: Need Rack FX input....

Unless you want some of the Ultra-only effects, save yourself some coin and get the AxeFX Standard. If you're not using amp/cab models, it'll do everything the Ultra can at about 25% less cost.

I thought that lacked a lot of the wilder effects & impulse model replacement options, which if you are looking at an Eventide for sonic mangling, is probably of interest...