Need Some Help in the Low End Area

[Maz]

The title of this thread is pretty straight forward.


I've been an amateur "self taught" bass player for 3 years now. What I can do on a bass is based off of my 5 years of playing the guitar. 3 years ago my parents bought me an Ibanez GSR-200 which, still plays amazingly to this day, but for the past 6 months or so I've been looking for the perfect bass for what I'm looking for. A couple friends recently asked me to join their punk rock band as the bass player, and I accepted, but I need more basses for what we want to do.

I've been playing a 4 string for 3 years, and I feel like it's time to go for a 5 string, but it's extremely hard, for me at least to find a bass that fits my criteria.

A) Under $1000(I also need an acoustic bass, I'm planning on going for the low end Ibanez model, because the other guys in the band want to do some acoustic sets)

B) 24 frets. I feel disabled without the extra 2 frets, I don't know why. I don't mind 22, but I prefer 24.

C) Strat-type shape. I love the strat shape, a lot of companies make basses like that, but I'm specifically looking for something with the strat/p-bass feel. I like the feel of the Ibanez GSR, but it doesn't feel like my strat, which to me is the perfect instrument.

D) 2 Humbuckers or P-J set up. One or the other.


For whatever reason, it's been hard to find something that fits that criteria, except for the Jackson Concert Bass, which I'm considering. (Specifically the JS3 Silver 5 String Model) I'm close to buying an MIJ P bass but I also feel like 20 frets will leave me unhappy.

I've played a good number of basses. So far, the ones I like are the BC Rich Heritage Mockingbird, P-Basses, and the Jackson Concert Basses. I'm looking for something that might be a little more expensive then the JS3 though because I want a bass that will offer a better wood quality.


I'm using a Fender Rumble 75 for my amplifier. I may also purchase some Bassline pickups depending on what I get.

 

[guitarkid]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

I don't know if it would interest you or not but check out a 5-string Peavey Cirrus BXP (not the american model). The reason is my brother just decided that he wants to sell his because he is only playing his jazz bass, it sounds like something you might be interested in. 5 strings, 24 fret, extra long scale neck, neck-thru body, and active humbuckers with 2 vol. and 3-band eq. Let me know.

 

[Maz]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

I don't know if it would interest you or not but check out a 5-string Peavey Cirrus BXP (not the american model). The reason is my brother just decided that he wants to sell his because he is only playing his jazz bass, it sounds like something you might be interested in. 5 strings, 24 fret, extra long scale neck, neck-thru body, and active humbuckers with 2 vol. and 3-band eq. Let me know.

If you can get me some pictures and an estimate I might be interested.

 

[guitarkid]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

Ok, I'll try to get some pics tommorrow and then I'll send you a pm.

 

[guitfiddle]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

I'd tell you to upgrade your amp first. 75 watts is seriously under powered.

 

[Maz]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

I'd tell you to upgrade your amp first. 75 watts is seriously under powered.

Not really, I used it at out first practice on Saturday, and I had to actually turn down because I was too loud.

 

[ginormous]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

Not really, I used it at out first practice on Saturday, and I had to actually turn down because I was too loud.

OK, that might be sufficient for practice in a small room. For gigs, however, you'll need some more muscle.

It's a rule of thumb that due to the physics of sound, you'll need at least twice the amp power to produce the same perceived loudness as a guitar. In fact, it's better to have more in reserve; heavy amp distortion on a bass doesn't always sound that good. Save up for some entry level Gallien-Kruger or Hartke.

A fiver for under $1k American retail? Hmmm... try the Fender Deluxe Active Jazz Bass V.

Here's a link to Sweetwater Music online.

 

[Maz]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

OK, that might be sufficient for practice in a small room. For gigs, however, you'll need some more muscle.

It's a rule of thumb that due to the physics of sound, you'll need at least twice the amp power to produce the same perceived loudness as a guitar. In fact, it's better to have more in reserve; heavy amp distortion on a bass doesn't always sound that good. Save up for some entry level Gallien-Kruger or Hartke.

A fiver for under $1k American retail? Hmmm... try the Fender Deluxe Active Jazz Bass V.

Here's a link to Sweetwater Music online.

I was thinking about the Jazz Bass, like I said earlier though, I don't know how 20 frets is going to work to me, although I REALLY want a Fender. I was thinking about checking out a Hartke, or maybe even an Acoustic. There were a couple of Ampegs I played at Guitar Center that sounded really nice too.

I'm kind of mad right now though, in February I was at Guitar Center and I found one of these for $650, I wish I picked it up now! It wasn't in the greatest condition, but it was good enough for rock.

 

[ginormous]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

It's been my experience that 20 frets on a five will fulfill my needs. Put it this way: most bassists string a five with the low B string. They're not looking to go higher, but lower. If you want some higher tones, you can string it E-A-D-G-C, or simply go balls to the wall and get a six.

However, at this point you'll be overlapping your high end with the guitar's low end, which doesn't end well unless your guitarist has a small enough ego to move over and give you some room... yeah, right!

 

[guitfiddle]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

Not really, I used it at out first practice on Saturday, and I had to actually turn down because I was too loud.

That's cool. Wait until you get onstage without any walls to give the sound back to you, and everyone plays twice as hard from excitement.

You'll see. One gig of watching the preamp clip indicator light up, and hearing the speaker fart out all the way through a set will show you what it's really like.

I use a 200 watt 1x15 combo (Acoustic B200), and sometimes even it struggles a bit to keep up with a show level. I know guys who won't step foot onstage without at least 500 watts under the hood, and others who use no less than 900 -1000, solid state.

Anyway, for me, four strings and 20 frets is plenty. Like a smart man once said about bass..."There ain't any money above the 7th fret"

 

[Maz]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

That's cool. Wait until you get onstage without any walls to give the sound back to you, and everyone plays twice as hard from excitement.

You'll see. One gig of watching the preamp clip indicator light up, and hearing the speaker fart out all the way through a set will show you what it's really like.

I use a 200 watt 1x15 combo (Acoustic B200), and sometimes even it struggles a bit to keep up with a show level. I know guys who won't step foot onstage without at least 500 watts under the hood, and others who use no less than 900 -1000, solid state.

Anyway, for me, four strings and 20 frets is plenty. Like a smart man once said about bass..."There ain't any money above the 7th fret"

Well, since we just started I wouldn't imagine I would need a BIG amplifier for awhile. I guess I could call us a "garage band" at the most for right now. I was thinking about getting an Acoustic, I play them whenever I go to the bass section at GC.

I've been so used to my 22 frets, I would imagine it won't be an issue. But in return for the loss of 2 frets I am getting an extra string.

 

[Varg]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

Punk rock? Why would you need five strings and 24 frets to play punk?

One string and two or three frets should be enough :lol:

Seriously, I would stick with Ibanez, they make good basses (as you already found out).

 

[Maz]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

Punk rock? Why would you need five strings and 24 frets to play punk?

One string and two or three frets should be enough :lol:

Seriously, I would stick with Ibanez, they make good basses (as you already found out).

I guess I just want a 5 string! :haha: I also play in the Jazz Band at my school, I wouldn't mind a new toy, since every single one of our songs seems to be in either Bb or just have Bs and Bbs all over the page.

That's true, they lead vocalist/rhythm guitar player had me learn 5 green day songs, and I learned all 5 in about 15 minutes. Probably less. He couldn't even remember "Brain Stew"

The Ibanez is amazing. The only bad part is the fact that the knobs are poorly attached, and the screws holding the neck in are really poorly placed in. I might go for an Ibanez 5 string. That shape is just so weird to me.

 

[CapoFirstFret]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

I guess I just want a 5 string! :haha: I also play in the Jazz Band at my school, I wouldn't mind a new toy, since every single one of our songs seems to be in either Bb or just have Bs and Bbs all over the page.

That's true, they lead vocalist/rhythm guitar player had me learn 5 green day songs, and I learned all 5 in about 15 minutes. Probably less. He couldn't even remember "Brain Stew"

The Ibanez is amazing. The only bad part is the fact that the knobs are poorly attached, and the screws holding the neck in are really poorly placed in. I might go for an Ibanez 5 string. That shape is just so weird to me.

Having played bass and guitar both in university jazz band settings, a 5 string is almost no use in that setting. Once the notes get below the low E of a bass, it just sounds like mud and doesn't keep the clarity that a band needs the bass to have.

Our jazz band director made the joke that the 5th string on a 5 string bass is a lot like the glissando that hammond organists like to use. You're allowed to use it once per show, so do so wisely.


I have a 5 string stingray and I got it to play in a rock band that I still play with occasionally and while I still play bass a considerable amount, and I still play my stingray, I really wish I had gone with the 4 string model. That 5th string really isn't used all that much for me and in my experience not for many 5 string bassists.


I say all this not to discourage you from the choices you have in your mind that you want to make, but to offer up that perhaps there is something out there that fits what you're looking for that you're missing because you have such stringent requirements. Go out there and try a few basses and see what you like. I also whole-heartedly agree with the previous posters, 75 watts is simply not going to be enough once you start really playing out. I don't gig with less than 600 watts.

 

[Maz]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

Having played bass and guitar both in university jazz band settings, a 5 string is almost no use in that setting. Once the notes get below the low E of a bass, it just sounds like mud and doesn't keep the clarity that a band needs the bass to have.

Our jazz band director made the joke that the 5th string on a 5 string bass is a lot like the glissando that hammond organists like to use. You're allowed to use it once per show, so do so wisely.


I have a 5 string stingray and I got it to play in a rock band that I still play with occasionally and while I still play bass a considerable amount, and I still play my stingray, I really wish I had gone with the 4 string model. That 5th string really isn't used all that much for me and in my experience not for many 5 string bassists.


I say all this not to discourage you from the choices you have in your mind that you want to make, but to offer up that perhaps there is something out there that fits what you're looking for that you're missing because you have such stringent requirements. Go out there and try a few basses and see what you like. I also whole-heartedly agree with the previous posters, 75 watts is simply not going to be enough once you start really playing out. I don't gig with less than 600 watts.

I was thinking I could use the 5th string more for doing some octaves, to add a little more flavor then just doing the same 4 notes for a bar. Plus the other guys in my band seem to like bass intros, and I'm sure I could use that B for some awesome intros!

As for your last paragraph, I obviously do have to try out a bunch of basses. There were a few I saw last time I was there, excluding the Jackson that caught my eye. I did play a Charvel a while back that was really nice though. I'm really leaning on getting a P-Bass as of right now. And for the amp, you just have to remember. A) We just started as a band, so it's not likely we're hitting any BIG venues as of right now. B) We're a bunch of Sophomores in high school again, still not going to get BIG gigs. :guilty: The biggest place I've played at is the Hard Rock Cafe up in Boston(which my guitar teacher sets up annually for bands taking lessons from him, I play with another band through him, which I just quit about a week ago.) And when I play there, I get to use his ~500 Watt Stack, plus there's a sound guy and separate speakers.


I also live in a condo, so HUGE amplifiers are a bit of a problem. I will save up for maybe an Acoustic, an Ampeg, or maybe a Mark Bass depending on what I can find price-wise. It will probably be a good year-2 years before I need an amp for gigging. And the guitar player is running a 30-Watt Line 6, it's hard not overpowering his sound.

 

[baritone]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

I have an Ibanez SR405. It's a cool instrument. If you are planning a trip to the opposite side of the country, I would give you a good deal on mine. I've had it for about 6 years (made in Korea, before moving production to China), and it is in stunning condition.

 

[CapoFirstFret]

Re: Need Some Help in the Low End Area

Alright, then for more constructive suggestions:

Ernie Ball put out a series of guitars called 'SUB'. I think they may have been discontinued now but they put out a SUB version of their Stingray and Stingray 5 bass and those would be worth looking into as you can get them in your price range (usually fairly easily) on ebay.

As far as amplification goes, I use a Carvin R600 bass head into a Red-Eye line 2x10 cab and a Red-Eye series 1x15 cab.

They made combos of this amp and I freakin love the tone of this amp. It's been nothing but reliable and solid and the tone is amazing and I live by it and I play bass a lot in many different settings. It's a lightweight amp and I recommend it because it's a good wattage amp you can get for less than $500.

Hope this helps you a bit!