Need Tube SUggestions....

[mwalluk]

I need to completely retube my amp. I have never retubed an amp before. Oddly enough I always ended up trading/selling my amp for something else before needing to retube it. I found an amp I like and it needs tubes.

I'm looking to cut back on the noise, get a nice clean, yet keep the gain needed.

My VHT came stock with this set up.

2 Matched Sovtek KT88s
V1: Sovtek 12AX7WB
V2: Shuguang 12Ax7
V3: Shuguang 12Ax7
V4 (driver) Shuguang 12Ax7



Per Fryette's manual......

Preamp tube locations are indicated by tube type on the rear panel of the chassis. Tube types are factory selected for superior performance, consistent tone quality and reliability. While substituting other brands may not cause damage to the amplifier this may affect amplifier performance in unpredictable ways. For best performance, replace only with factory recommended tubes. Warning! Substituting other tube types is not recommended.

Each 12AX7 has two sections/functions. Section A is shown first, Section B is second. Factory recommended tubes are listed under each location. Numbering sequence is right to left looking at back of amp starting with the row closest to front panel of amp.



V1 (shielded tube) Input Gain Stage 1 (Parallel Triodes).
12AX7A Tung-Sol

12AX7WB Sovtek
(Use in place of Tung-Sol for smoother top end and less upper mids.)

12AX7 China Selected
(Use in place of WB if more gain is required)



V2 (shielded tube) Gain Stage 2.
12AX7A/7025 China
(Gain Stage 4. Active only when MORE / LESS switch is set to MORE).


V3 (shielded tube) Gain Stage 3.
12AX7A/7025 China (Tone Control Driver).

V4 - Phase Inverter.
12AX7A/7025 China


Power Tubes MUST USE ONLY KT88 or 6550.
NOT INTERCHANGEABLE WITH ANY OTHER TUBE TYPES!

KT88 Sovtek
KT88 EH
KT88 Svetlana
6550 Sovtek
6550 Svetlana

 

[FuseG4]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

tung-sols on V1-4. they sound bold and clear, with equal and ample amounts of bass and treble. Tung-sols generally have a decent noise floor. Tung-sol 12ax7's I think are the great "all-around" tube that usually doesn't sound to heavy or spikey in any way.

I've never used KT88s. But if you don't go for sovtek again I'd suggest EH. EH makes some decent power tubes that usually don't sound too strong and bassy (like several JJ types do).

 

[misterwhizzy]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

I highly disagree with V4 being Tung-Sols. In my experience, they do not hold up well in driver positions. I think there is a fairly broad consensus that a Sovtek LPS works very well in the PI. I used it there for a while before I ended up going with a lower gain tube, and it held the note clarity better than any of the others I tried.

I think a Tung-Sol in V1 is probably your best bet. In my experience, they're fairly bright, very full sounding tubes, and it's what I keep going back to in tone-generating stages. After that, I think it's a little less important, except for the PI. I recently switched out V2 in my amp for a long-plate JJ, and surprisingly, I'm very happy with it. It tamed the harsh upper mids a little bit and gives me just about exactly the tone I'm looking for.

That being said, the devices are not all that consistent. Tung-Sols differing by one serial number will probably sound slightly different. And all these are generalizations. I think V1 and either V3 or V4 will be the most important.

Here is my humble reader's digest version:
Tung-Sol - Bright and Full, not rugged
Mullard - Smooth and gainy, not as bright
JJ - Crunchy mids, smoothed top, may sound dull (and I find the short plate version unuseable)
Chinese - Not much experience, but the cheap ones I've played are a little short in the character department
Sovtek LPS - Rugged, clear, balanced
ElectroHarmonix - Bright and a bit thin sounding for my tastes (based on a single tube)

So that's my two cents. I've done a lot of experimenting with new production tubes, and that's how I hear them. Every now and then I get curious and start swapping, but Tung-Sols always end up in V1 for me.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

Tung-Sol - Bright and Full, not rugged
Mullard - Smooth and gainy, not as bright
JJ - Crunchy mids, smoothed top, may sound dull (and I find the short plate version unuseable)
Chinese - Not much experience, but the cheap ones I've played are a little short in the character department
Sovtek LPS - Rugged, clear, balanced
ElectroHarmonix - Bright and a bit thin sounding for my tastes (based on a single tube)

Sorry whizzy, i stole your preamp tube list and added some stuff (in capitals)

Tung-Sol - Bright and Full, not rugged. CLEAR AND PRESENT.
Mullard - Smooth and gainy, not as bright.
JJ - Crunchy mids, smoothed top, may sound dull (and I find the short plate version unuseable) FAT BOTTOM.
Chinese - Not much experience, but the cheap ones I've played are a little short in the character department. COMPARABLE TO SOVTEK WA/B/C
Sovtek LPS - Rugged, clear, balanced - COMPARABLE TO EH
ElectroHarmonix - STRONG, RELIABLE BALANCED HIGH GAIN LOW NOISE
SOVTEK WA/B/C - CHEAP - A/B and C ARE PROGRESSIVELY LOWER NOISE/HIGHER GAIN. LPS IS ANOTHER LEVEL UP FROM ANY OF THESE.

 

[mwalluk]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

I believe v2 is next important for my amp. It controls the second gain stage web the more switch is engaged my amp has two gain knobs. So I'm considering tungsol in v1 and sobtek in v4 which is the pi. Only have 4 vs. What should I put in v2 and v3?

 

[mwalluk]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

I think v3 is tone. So should I put a Millard in there and a jj in v2? Also how do I find out if jj is long plate????

 

[FuseG4]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

EH in V2 and V3. These are gain stages and so I'd stick EH in there because I like the detail they have when pushed. They have a nice sizzle/edginess that comes with having enough treble (not excessively fizzy though). They're not as heavy on the bass as tung-sols and so it may help to keep the high-gain tones just a bit tighter.

 

[metalmachine]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

I really like the electro harmonix 12ax7 in the v1 and v2 position on my 5150.

 

[FuseG4]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

the JJ long-plate has the taller, rectangular grey things (plates). You can see it in pictures. the regular plates are shorter and closer to being square. The long plate JJ is called the ECC803s. regular one is ECC83

 

[mwalluk]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

Ecc803 is stll a 12ax7 right sorry for mynewbness

 

[mwalluk]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

Would you choose eh over Mullard and/or jj

 

[mwalluk]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

I don't want to lose any bottom end either.

I need my amp to be sparkly jingle and chimey on clean. And balls to the wall tightly focus overdriven goodness. It's already a raw organic cut through the mix Amp and I don't want to lose that.

 

[misterwhizzy]

Re: Need Tube SUggestions....

Would you choose eh over Mullard and/or jj

It depends on what you want. I originally liked the EH better than the JJ, but then I ended up needing the top end to lose a little bit of harshness, and I went with JJ. It pushes the mids a little more, and it was able to eliminate the harshness. That being said, I NEVER thought I'd come around to JJs.

I hear the Mullard totally different than any of the other new production tubes. It's very full, and very rounded on the top end. It gets just a touch of grit due to it being fairly high gain, but it will definitely smooth out if you EQ it properly. I think people should experience it, but for tight, high gain amps, I don't think it fits the bill.

I don't want to lose any bottom end either.

I need my amp to be sparkly jingle and chimey on clean. And balls to the wall tightly focus overdriven goodness. It's already a raw organic cut through the mix Amp and I don't want to lose that.

I think these guys may be right with Tung-Sol, EH, EH, Sovtek. That's a full cadre of Russian tubes, comrade, but I think the motherland would approve. For grins, and because it won't cost much more, pick up a JJ ECC803s just in case you get inquisitive. Plus, I think it's something you've just got to try to get a feel for what people are talking about.

And 12AX7, ECC83, ECC803 are all synonymous. And all variations thereof are as well, such as 12AX7-WA, -WB, etc.