New stack technology for single coil size

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The old stacks like Dimarzio HS3 read very high resistance yet are super weak pickups. newer style like the virtual vintage and Areas, do something different. Anyone know what they did differently with construction?

Also, was reading that Duncan has a new patented style too. Anyone know how they all vary? I'm wanting an aggressive pickup that still looks like a normal strat pickup but is a firebreather underneath. I ordered a pickup from MJ years ago and had them make a stack that was as hot as they could. It reads 23K ohms, but it's just a tad hotter and smoother than a traditional single coil output.

I'm wondering if with these new stacks, there's a way to do what I want.
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

The thing with stacks is that, in essence only the top coil picks up the sound.
The one bellow is just there for "bucking the hum".

In fact the efforts with stacks are basically aimed to make the bottom coil NOT affect the tone AT ALL, achieving a true single coil sound but with no hum.

The parallel coils on the other hand (i.e. the SC sized mini-buckers) are where one could get HOT output from a SC sized pickup.
However, they obviously don't look much like ordinary single coils...
 
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Re: New stack technology for single coil size

Keeper, I'm aware of that. I'm talking about the new style stacks vs. the old, it seems they are made differently. For example how is the construction different between an HS-3, an area 61, and a Duncan ST-4? They are all stacks, yet all different designs.

I've read where the HS3 is "old stack technology" and the virtual vintage is a new way to do it. So what's different in the way they're made? That's what I'm asking about.
 
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Re: New stack technology for single coil size

and that is a little of what keeper is getting at. it used to be that to make a good quiet stack you needed the top coil and bottom coil to be the same, so you would wind a 14k coil for the top and then another 14k for the bottom giving you a 28k pup that has the output a little lower than the same 14k top coil by itself. if you look at the newer stacks the resistance is significantly lower, under 10k for some of them. honestly i havent taken one apart to see whats going on but i would guess the bottom coil is significantly smaller and uses different construction than the top coil which is generating 90% of the tone.

so in theory yes, i believe that the duncan custom shop could wind you a stack that is much hotter than the bridge model stack plus or the hot stack for strat. how close to a firebreather you can get depends on how much they can fit on the bobbin. if you are willing to have an extra tall pup you should be able to get it pretty hot
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

Easy: do what blind coils where for in the first place. Put them somewhere else than under the magnet-holding coil.

You see, there is no reason for the magnet holding coil and the blind coil to be directly on top of each other. As long as you have the orientation in all dimensions right it will kill the hum.

So you tell the custom shop to make you a Strat pickup that is underwoundd for combining with a same-wind pickup with no magnets. Then you place the blind coil in your electronics cavity but as I said the orientation must be the same.

That way you get a wind as fat as you want, you get full-sized magnets (not cut in half and shielded with MU-metal), you don't have to use thinner wire etc etc etc.
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

That's the gist of it, yes.

My guess would be that they use a wire than has the most resistance with the least length so that it leaves more room for the upper coil that produces all the tone and then try to find a way to make the lower coil not pick up any sound.


Another method, similar to what uOpt says is to not really use a stack pickup at all but a real single coil pickup and a dummy coil somewhere outside.

Suhr does exactly that thing using the back cover of a strat.
In it he hides a dummy coil that is used to counteract the hum of real single coils that are mounted on the pickguard :)
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

I think that the Hot Rails is your best option and I do like the looks of it in a guitar but if you insist on vintage looks, try listening to the demos on the Dimarzio website - I think you can find what you want there. Have you considered the Dimarzio Heavy Blues 2?
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

KeeperOS said:
That's the gist of it, yes.

My guess would be that they use a wire than has the most resistance with the least length so that it leaves more room for the upper coil that produces all the tone and then try to find a way to make the lower coil not pick up any sound.


Another method, similar to what uOpt says is to not really use a stack pickup at all but a real single coil pickup and a dummy coil somewhere outside.

Suhr does exactly that thing using the back cover of a strat.
In it he hides a dummy coil that is used to counteract the hum of real single coils that are mounted on the pickguard :)
Click to expand...


I've read from a few people that tried the Suhr and they said it cut the hum but not entirely, and it works better somehow when it's designed with the guitar. I guess that's better than nothing but it's too expensive. I don't mind the hum from the other pickups, so I'd rather not compromise their sound. I just need noise cancelling on the bridge pickup.
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

JohnnyGuitar said:
I think that the Hot Rails is your best option and I do like the looks of it in a guitar but if you insist on vintage looks, try listening to the demos on the Dimarzio website - I think you can find what you want there. Have you considered the Dimarzio Heavy Blues 2?
Click to expand...


I REALLY don't like the tone of the hot rails. By firebreather, I mean aggressive and crunchy. To me the hot rails was sludgey, dark and muddy. I guess that's too hot.

I have played a Dimarzio virtual solo which is hotter than the Heavy blues. It was okay, if it could be just a little hotter/thicker I'd be happy.
 
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Re: New stack technology for single coil size

Evan Skopp himself touched on the new technique many, many moons ago. IIRC, it had something to do with Helmholtz coils. One coil would be wound much smaller than the other, (to reduce high-freq loss), and then current through the two coils was balanced using a carefully selected resistor.

Something like that. :)
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

ArtieToo said:
Evan Skopp himself touched on the new technique many, many moons ago. IIRC, it had something to do with Helmholtz coils. One coil would be wound much smaller than the other, (to reduce high-freq loss), and then current through the two coils was balanced using a carefully selected resistor.

Something like that. :)
Click to expand...

Now that's what I'm wanting to know. Thanks Artie.
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

BTW, check this out!

hc-strat1.jpg
 
Re: New stack technology for single coil size

Just a thought:
How about going active? either for the new Blackouts or just installing an EMG or a GFS booster in the guitar?
 
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