Poll:How Many of You Think You Hear Any Difference Between Different Caps?

[STRATDELUXER97]

Myself and I Know Lew,has spent alot of time trying out different capacitors in different materials...I Have found that it's the differences in values that I hear making a change to the circuit than the material used..If I use say an Orange Drop 715P vs the 225P(May have wrong number here)in the same values and voltage ratings,I don't hear any difference? I've especially tryed doing this test in my guitar using a switch that would allow me to switch between two different cap brands and or different materials..Lew has had the same findings as myself...He didn't hear any difference..I'm not talking the difference between a ceramic and a good quality Poly cap,although I like ceramic caps in key places in my Marshall amps and in my pedal mods..Let's see what you all think? I say it's mostly a placebo or physcological effect more than anything else in the stuff I work with...

John

 

[Nightburst]

Well, that's what I'm going to find out when replacing those caps in the MT-2. Haven't gotten around to it yet but I will soon.

I don't think replacing caps with some other brand with the same value and same material will make any noticable difference. But different materials sound different I think.

 

[Lewguitar]

I've described MY TEST guitar before here but I'll describe it again:

In my Strat with the Duncan Antiquity Texas Hots I have a push/pull tone that lets me choose between a .02 Sprague Orange Drop cap or a .02 Hovland Oil N Foil cap. If there's a diff in tone between the two, it is so slight as to be unimportant IMO.

I have found that the "click" the switch makes when engaged is enough to cue most people that they "should" hear something differant...so they often do!

But I can also fake that "click" and not actually change to a differant cap and I've found that as often as not people hear a diff that isn't really there at all.

If there is any diff at all, the Hovland might be a tiny, tiny bit brighter...but I kind of doubt it.

I DO hear a diff in tone when differant caps are used in an amp's tone controls...but that is a differant application. The output of the tone cap stays in the audio signal in an amp and the output of the cap goes to ground never to be heard again in a guitar's tone circuit.

I think it is 100% IMPOSSIBLE to remember the tone a guitar had with one cap, unsolder that cap and install another cap, and then try to compare the two. IMPOSSIBLE. The diff is so subtle that the only way to compare, IMO, is to do the push/pull pot test I have installed in my guitar: I can go from one cap to the other in a split second while the guitar is still ringing.

Lew

 

[That90'sGuy]

Over at the LP Forums, people were arguing over them.

I remember there was a rare type (Bumblebee or something like that) and some people said that Orange Drops sounded almost the same. I think it's almost psychological myself or if it makes a difference, it's so small it'll take the strongest audiophile out there struggling to find it.

 

[Steve_R]

Over at the LP Forums, people were arguing over them.

Some people need to get a life.. and actually play the guitar.

 

[mrid]

Over at the LP Forums, people were arguing over them.

I remember there was a rare type (Bumblebee or something like that) and some people said that Orange Drops sounded almost the same.

I posted that (a link to Lew's tests)...and was summarily banned.

I can DEFINITELY hear a difference between ceramic and poly-film, but I'm not sure I could distinguish between, say, poly and metal film, unless it was in a critical section of the circuit.

 

[Martian]

Except for the mf value of the cap, it's all mass hysteria.

 

[Lewguitar]

I posted that (a link to Lew's tests)...and was summarily banned.

I can DEFINITELY hear a difference between ceramic and poly-film, but I'm not sure I could distinguish between, say, poly and metal film, unless it was in a critical section of the circuit.

Were you really banned from the LPF just for posting a link to my test? That's pretty harsh! It took me telling an administrator at the LPF what he could do with himself to get me banned!

Lew

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

I've described MY TEST guitar before here but I'll describe it again:

In my Strat with the Duncan Antiquity Texas Hots I have a push/pull tone that lets me choose between a .02 Sprague Orange Drop cap or a .02 Hovland Oil N Foil cap. If there's a diff in tone between the two, it is so slight as to be unimportant IMO.

I have found that the "click" the switch makes when engaged is enough to cue most people that they "should" hear something differant...so they often do!

But I can also fake that "click" and not actually change to a differant cap and I've found that as often as not people hear a diff that isn't really there at all.

If there is any diff at all, the Hovland might be a tiny, tiny bit brighter...but I kind of doubt it.

I DO hear a diff in tone when differant caps are used in an amp's tone controls...but that is a differant application. The output of the tone cap stays in the audio signal in an amp and the output of the cap goes to ground never to be heard again in a guitar's tone circuit.

I think it is 100% IMPOSSIBLE to remember the tone a guitar had with one cap, unsolder that cap and install another cap, and then try to compare the two. IMPOSSIBLE. The diff is so subtle that the only way to compare, IMO, is to do the push/pull pot test I have installed in my guitar: I can go from one cap to the other in a split second while the guitar is still ringing.

Lew

I do agree with lew's findings here and I will say that I do here a difference in say a Marshall amp if I were to use mica over ceramic...For example:The 470pf Marshall tone stack cap is ceramic and if I use Mica I normally don't like it,so I do hear a difference...

I also feel I've learned that I Like using Mallory 150s in my BF Fender stuff over Orange Drops,but both work great in the sameamp? i'm not so sure I hear a tonal difference,but the Mallory caps lay flat on the board and look cool! I also like the red colored Xicon caps in my amps..Again,I don't know if I hear a difference and sometimes it depends on what caps I have and what I can get...If you find something you like,that's what you stick with really...
Another great post from Lew!

John

 

[Lewguitar]

I do agree with lew's findings here and I will say that I do here a difference in say a Marshall amp if I were to use mica over ceramic...For example:The 470pf Marshall tone stack cap is ceramic and if I use Mica I normally don't like it,so I do hear a difference...

I also feel I've learned that I Like using Mallory 150s in my BF Fender stuff over Orange Drops,but both work great in the sameamp? i'm not so sure I hear a tonal difference,but the Mallory caps lay flat on the board and look cool! I also like the red colored Xicon caps in my amps..Again,I don't know if I hear a difference and sometimes it depends on what caps I have and what I can get...If you find something you like,that's what you stick with really...
Another great post from Lew!

John

Thanks John! You talked me out of trying the EVH humbucker in my Antiquity Texas Hot Strat BTW...I'll try it in my dual humbucker Strat instead. I have the 59 Trembucker in that one and I'll swap it for the EVH. I have the 59 Trembucker in my single humbucker Strat too, so I'll be able able to compare the EVH Trembucker to the 59 Trembucker soon.

As for caps, I have two old blackface Deluxe Reverbs and one always sounded a little smoother to me...even with the same G12H30 speaker and NOS RCA tubes in both. I had .02 Orange Drops in the tone stacks of both amps. I prefer that value to the stock .1 & .047 value. But I recently pulled the Orange Drops in the brighter DR and replaced them with .02 Mallory 150 caps. Now both of my DR's get the smoother tone I prefer. So in an amp's circuitry I can at least sometimes hear the difference between caps of the same value but of a different composition.

In a bright amp that I want to make smoother I'll use the Mallory 150's. In a dark amp that I want a little clearer tone with better note separation, I'll use the Sprague Orange Drops...the good ones, I forget the model number.

But in a guitar's tone control I really don't hear much difference because, as mentioned, the output of the tone control goes to ground so we don't hear the signal after it's passed through the cap and returned to the planet Earth again.

Bruce likes those Xicons too, BTW. He rarely uses Orange Drops in his amps...

Lew

 

[kevlar3000]

I just swapped a .68 sprague orange drop in my Traynor head for a soZo .68 cap. The difference is night and day. Where the Sprague has an edge to it the soZo is much warmer and richer. It is a 2.00 upgrade that changed the character of that amp.

 

[mrid]

I just swapped a .68 sprague orange drop in my Traynor head for a soZo .68 cap. The difference is night and day. Where the Sprague has an edge to it the soZo is much warmer and richer. It is a 2.00 upgrade that changed the character of that amp.

Where is that cap? Presence pot?

 

[kevlar3000]

it is tied into a resistor on V2. I had it added for a bit more gain.

 

[Wattage]

I haven't messed with amp caps but I can tell a diffeence in my guitars when I put in OD caps over the stock ceramics. I never A/B'd them against any other quality caps, I never had a reason to I guess. I've used some other poly-films and they seem to work fine but my ears have been abused for far too long to determine the finer details of those kinds of swaps.

 

[mrid]

it is tied into a resistor on V2. I had it added for a bit more gain.

Ah, a .68 cathode bypass...very Marshall-esque.

 

[kevlar3000]

Ah, a .68 cathode bypass...very Marshall-esque.

D.amn straight!!

 

[Pandemonium]

I've had 3 cap jobs done on my Bandmaster. I've never specified any particular caps and I've never heard any difference. Just had it done last summer, the tech asked me if I had any specific caps in mind and I said "whatever you usually use." He used Atoms. Sounds great, but then it sounded great to start with.

 

[Artie]

One thing folks should keep in mind, caps are notoriously imprecise. 20% is a typical tolerance. So two .68 uf caps could be .82uf and .54uf. That alone could create quite an audible difference.

 

[JALIN]

I replaced my stock ceramic disc caps in my LP with the orange drops of same value .022 and did not like them. They brightened up my tone consideribily. Went back to disc.

 

[lastwinj]

, say, poly and metal film, unless it was in a critical section of the circuit.

most caps are metal fim of some sort, be it metallized, or a true film.foil cap. aluminum foil with the dielectric of choice.

germ