Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

[Falloffthebonetone]

First of all what's your personal opinion and which do you like?

Second what would you suggest for me? I'm mostly an everything bassist but I lean towards rock, blues, r&b, and metal. I play with my fingers and don't slap too much and down tune occasionally. So yeah I'm pretty white. I'm getting my bass set up soon and I was wondering which I should get, or even if I should switch at all. Using D'addario 45-100 round wound right now, definitely going thicker though. The bass it's going on is a PJ with a VERY heavy, growly and loud p bass style pickup and a hotter than average sort of honky style jazz/p90 bridge pickup with two volumes and no tone. It's a G&L SB-2, ash body maple neck and board. Steve Harris, Geddy Lee, John Entwistle, Roger Glover, and Paul McCartney are my top 5 not in any order. Normally I'd stick with the rounds I'm using but I've heard there are a lot of advantages to flats like a smoother feel, longer life, and they reduce fretwear and string noise, but comes with more tension so bends are harder and a less "attacky" tone, but I don't bend too much on bass anyway and figure I can compensate with eq, plus Steve Harris' tone kills, and Paul uses Nylon which is pretty much flats to the Nth degree, so I'm pretty sure I'm not interested in that.

I do love the sound of the Rounds but I do care about my fretlife and the scraping and clanging noise can be a bit bothersome sometimes when I play.

Would Halfwounds be a good compromise or should I go balls out flats or just stick with rounds, and do Halfwounds last as long as flats? I haven't heard much about the life of Halfrounds.

Would Flatwounds sound too dark in my bass with my monster of a neck pickup? Are they harder/easier to pick with fingers? Harris picks pretty fast with them but I hear he chalks his fingers sometimes.

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Phew! I eventually worked my way through all of that exposition to find the actual question.

If you have been happily playing round wound strings for years, changing to ground or flat wound now would seem to be an over-reaction to your fear of fret wear. How worn are your frets right now?

As for artefacts such as string scrapes and fret rattles, I make a feature of these. I want people to know that they are hearing a human being playing an actual instrument, not some digital sample replay keyboard.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Phew! I eventually worked my way through all of that exposition to find the actual question.

If you have been happily playing round wound strings for years, changing to ground or flat wound now would seem to be an over-reaction to your fear of fret wear. How worn are your frets right now?

As for artefacts such as string scrapes and fret rattles, I make a feature of these. I want people to know that they are hearing a human being playing an actual instrument, not some digital sample replay keyboard.

I knew for a FACT if I didn't include all that, people would ask me anyway! hahahaha! But the bass is only about a year or so old, so there's virtually no fret wear yet. BUT if there's an alternative that I perhaps like the feel and sound MORE that will save me money on strings and fret work then I would be very open to slapping them on. I know what you're talking about with the noise, but sometimes it just sounds annoying, and if I dont keep my fingernails on my right hand clipped god help me.

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Back in the Eighties, my brother had a phase of playing Rotosound Tru Bass strings - the black nylon wrapped ones. They felt very comfortable and made no scrapy noises but they had no top end detail. He reverted to round wounds.

I have steel flat wound strings on a Squier Silver Series P Bass. The frets were severely worn when I got the instrument. I chose flat wounds, partly to preserve the remaining fret wire but mainly to get the James Jamerson type sound. This and early John McVie is pretty much all that my Squier SS P Bass is good for.

Everything else that I have uses round wound.

 

[DrNewcenstein]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Go with roundwounds for the punchier tones of Harris/Lee, and don't think about fretwear. Haven't tried half-wounds, but flats are best for fretless or getting mellow Jazzy tones, so I'm assuming that if you wanted halfwounds to punch harder, you'd have to slam them, negating any benefits they offer regarding fret life.

Alternatively, you could plan ahead and focus on getting multiple basses for multiple applications - a roundwound for rock/metal, a fretless with flats for smooth Jazz, a fretted with flat/halfwound for whatever you'd use that for, etc.

 

[Rodney Gene]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Go with roundwounds for the punchier tones of Harris/Lee, and don't think about fretwear. Haven't tried half-wounds, but flats are best for fretless or getting mellow Jazzy tones, so I'm assuming that if you wanted halfwounds to punch harder, you'd have to slam them, negating any benefits they offer regarding fret life.

Alternatively, you could plan ahead and focus on getting multiple basses for multiple applications - a roundwound for rock/metal, a fretless with flats for smooth Jazz, a fretted with flat/halfwound for whatever you'd use that for, etc.

The majority of fretless players I have known (including myself) use Round Wounds on fretless or a combination with the occasional halfwound compromise. Better 'muah' with rounds which is worth any fingerboard wear that may happen depending on your vibrato technique. Flatwounds are rarely used in 'Jazz' playing unless you are using upright bass or playing very traditional Jazz. Flats are most often used in R&B, Blues, Classic RR and Motown styles etc. If you use Thomastik Flats, definition is excellent, articulate, dynamic and punch for days. The 'punch' is actually more pronounced with flats depending on the style since they accentuate the low-end and low-mids....or reduce top end crispness to some degree. Cheers!~

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Go with roundwounds for the punchier tones of Harris/Lee, and don't think about fretwear. Haven't tried half-wounds, but flats are best for fretless or getting mellow Jazzy tones, so I'm assuming that if you wanted halfwounds to punch harder, you'd have to slam them, negating any benefits they offer regarding fret life.

Alternatively, you could plan ahead and focus on getting multiple basses for multiple applications - a roundwound for rock/metal, a fretless with flats for smooth Jazz, a fretted with flat/halfwound for whatever you'd use that for, etc.

Harris uses flats though.

 

[Johnny the Kid]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

It goes back to only you can decide what's good for you. It's worth the money to slap on a set of flatwounds and see how you jive with them. If you don't, no harm done put a new set of strings on and go back to jamming. If you do, then you've got another element to add to your tone. As a picker and a hard player, I find flatwounds to be a good investment, mainly because I play my bass like I hate it. But once again, it's all personal preference. To me, strings are such a small part of the bass tone that if you are willing to sacrifice a little bit of tone for a whole lot of comfort, then anything is worth it. f you're comfortable with your instrument, only then will you be able to really start to play well.

But that's just my opinion.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

get a set of each. I tried semis for a while, but i like flats in the heaviest guage i can find.

 

[BlueTalon]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

I had some half-rounds (or ground-wounds? Not sure if they're the same thing) once. They seemed to be exactly what you would imagine the middle ground to be between flats and rounds. Interesting, but nothing terribly special.

The first bass I ever got had tapewounds on it. I was frustrated, 'cause it seemed like I could never get a sound I liked. Then one day the tape started fraying -- I pulled on it a bit, and it started coming off. And underneath were these shiny roundwounds! So I stripped all the strings, and started playing, and I was hooked. With the exception of the half-rounds, I have used nothing but rounds for the last three decades.

 

[DrNewcenstein]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Harris uses flats though.

Hurr? I thought his signature RotoSounds were roundwound?

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Hurr? I thought his signature RotoSounds were roundwound?

http://www.rotosound.com/sh_77.php

I'm more surprised than you are.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Hurr? I thought his signature RotoSounds were roundwound?

he's a flatwound guy and always has been.
The cool thing about flatties is precisely the reason a lot of bassists prefer rounds. The lack of top end means the bass does not cut thru. Trouble with cutting thru is that the guitars also want to cut thru. So do the drummers. So if everyone is constantly trying to cut thru its pretty much a schemozzle. Flatwounds are awesome because they rule the low frequencies and stay put of the way of everyone else - which makes the whole band sound better.

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Like I said in post #4, flats = James Jamerson and John McVie as he sounded in John Mayall's Bluesbreakers and Peter Green's Fleetwood Mac. Nailin' the low end without recourse to active EQ.

EDIT - Better add Donald "Duck" Dunn to the list of flatwound users.

 

[Johnny the Kid]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Steve Harris does not need help cutting through the rest of the mix.

 

[DrNewcenstein]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Well, I'll be an Uncle's Monkey. Last time I played flatwounds, they sounded dead and felt like crap - sliding felt like it was ripping my fingers open.

I've also heard mention of "tapewound" - is that the same thing?

 

[Rodney Gene]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

Well, I'll be an Uncle's Monkey. Last time I played flatwounds, they sounded dead and felt like crap - sliding felt like it was ripping my fingers open.

I've also heard mention of "tapewound" - is that the same thing?

You are not alone. Most flats sound deadish and dull to me. If you play something like Thomastik infeld, it will change your understanding and true experience about what flats can do. Of course you have to spend $70-$100 per set, but they last and last. They are supple, they feel amazing, they are defined, articulate. If you do studio work, I think it imperative to have both flats and rounds. They both provide something very needed and cool.

Tapewounds are wound in nylon with a steel core. Similiar for sure, but not the same.

Cheers!

 

[One Bad Monkey]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

You could always try something like the GHS Pressurewound Flats or the Ken Smith Compressors. Both of them are roundwounds where the wrap is slightly flattened during the winding process, giving you a sleeker feel, less string noise and a mellower sound but still retaining the clarity of roundwounds. I've been using them quite a bit on my basses and they sound/feel great.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

You could always try something like the GHS Pressurewound Flats or the Ken Smith Compressors. Both of them are roundwounds where the wrap is slightly flattened during the winding process, giving you a sleeker feel, less string noise and a mellower sound but still retaining the clarity of roundwounds. I've been using them quite a bit on my basses and they sound/feel great.

those usually get thrown in with half wounds. Feel and life of a flatwound with the sort of preserved tone of the round wound.

 

[One Bad Monkey]

Re: Rounds vs Halves/Grounds vs Flats vs Nylons Bass

those usually get thrown in with half wounds. Feel and life of a flatwound with the sort of preserved tone of the round wound.

Exactly.

As for your question about longevity of halves, I find they last a while. A regular gig of mine is a Summerstock theatre where the pit is directly under the stage, and usually quite hot and stuffy. When you're in there for 3-4 hours a day, 6 days a week (which isn't counting rehearsals you do prior) 8-10 weeks in the peak of summer, strings get put to the test. For reference, I've had D'Addario XLs last five days, Rotosound Swing 66 last a week and a half, Dean Markley Blue Steels last a little over two weeks and Circle K balanced last about three weeks. The GHS Pressurewounds I put on last summer lasted three months; two in that climate and one month with a different (more climate controlled) theatre for a different run.

As always, what you consider a "dead" string may vary from someone else, but I usually fall into the very hi-fi, piano-like clarity and precision sound so I usually change strings quicker than most, so for a set to last three months is quite a feat.