Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

N

NothingHappens

New member
I'm a life-long musician. Aged 31 now, started at 3. My uncle gave me a newer American Strat back in 1993/4 when he heard me finally learning SRV from Wolf Marshall CDs, and he bought it from some guy at an airport a little earlier, say 1991-2ish - the guitar's birth year. Nevertheless, it was white, had a rosewood board, I had no clue it was American at the time. I was 7 or 8 so I had little idea about anything like that. He just gave me a cry-baby, the guitar with the plastic "USA" molded case and a little peavey amp to screw with. I lost that guitar when I traded it moronically for a Mexican made Telecaster in 1996 or 1997. The older kid took me for a ride - he knew my guitar was American and that I was unaware.


After that, I never got too "connoisseur" about anything. Mom took me back to the music store in 1998 to get another Stratocaster, new, but this time it was a Mexican one! She couldn't really justify swinging the American price. To her "American" truly meant nothing...she wasn't then and is not now a musician!

I've spent my life playing and obsessing over what makes great intricate music like 1970s Yes "spark". But, I've never had access to the kind of diversity of equipment they had. Despite being a fine player I've never known about tones at all. I even had my step dad's 1970s Les Paul Deluxe in my hands for 8 years, and only until recently have I known how the different guitars sounded.

For example, I always played this cassette in my car "open road rock" which has "Sweet Home Alabama" on it. I always thought that guitar solo was played by a long-haired thin hat-wearing hippie on an exotic 1950s Gibson Firebird or something like that. It sounded so special, so bell-like and juicy that I assumed it had to be something special like a Firebird or a Les Paul.

Do you know how surprised I was to find out that it was a 1972 Stratocaster with stock pickups? I couldn't believe it.

I've owned at least 4-6 Stratocasters in my life, endlessly tinkered and played with them, how could this be that I didn't recognize a Strat sound??

Anyway, I just recently got back in the good guitar game, at least in my opinion. I use a 1978 Greco Super Stratocaster guitar with 1974 AlnicoV staggered pole Maxon pickups I put in there. When I use the bridge and middle pickup simultaneously, it sounds identical to Sweet Home Alabama. But I often find myself able to confuse my ear. Especially when I'm running this 1978 guitar into a 1973 Traynor YBA-1A Mark II tube amp into my 1972 Shure vocal column. The tones are stinging and tubey....but a lot of times I don't automatically think "that's a strat". It sounds like a high powered guitar of some sort..twangy and deep like a maybe a Maple Gibson L6-S. How would you really know unless I took the blind-fold off and told you what guitar I'm using?
 
Last edited:
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Eh, I think a Strat is 'something special' :) I'm a recent convert, in a year I bought two and am building a third; SSS, HH, and HS.

The guitar I have that can fool people is my Jaguar; it's fairly quiet for a single coil guitar and even with the vintage (SJAG-1) pickups the driven sound is solid and clear. People comment on being able to use a Telecaster for metal with success; it's in that vein, but using a Jaguar is even more surreal, like watching an old Chrysler go around Laguna Seca or something. Alnico 5 Strat pickups come in many flavors, some squishy and fuzzy, others more solid and tight. A good guitar, by my definition, comes close to doing whatever you want it to.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Then you got a lot to learn from this forum kiddo.

In a month or two you'll be able to recognize the string gauge, type of finish, scale length, nut material Gary Rossington used in 'Sweet Home Alabama'. Stick around for a little more.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Your tone is based not only on a guitar.....but a whole chain of elements. You could record a LP on a certain setup and make it sound more single-coil like than a strat on another setup. Simply asking someone to ID a guitar on an unknown rig is about THE most pointless idea known to man.

And a firebird (which wasn't released until the 60's) is the closest thing to a Fender that Gibson does. They sound like overwound strat pickups. It wouldn't take much to eq one to sound like the other.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

I can't say I can always recognize what guitars are used on a recording, but I have to admit to not being a good mimic, either. I spend more time trying to make my own sounds.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Mincer said:
I can't say I can always recognize what guitars are used on a recording, but I have to admit to not being a good mimic, either. I spend more time trying to make my own sounds.
Click to expand...

Ditto... on all three points. I've given up on trying to mimic, except in a general sense. I try to make my guitars versatile enough to give me a relatively wide pallet of sounds, but when it comes right down to it I sound like me. Also, don't forget that most of your sound comes from your own fingers and playing style... just as it does from the artists you like to listen to. Sweet Home Alabama would still have the same feel (if not the exact sound) if the solo had been played on a flying V, and would still be every bit as effective to the listener. The guy (or gal) that's doing the playing makes a bigger difference than the equipment being used IMHO.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Hehehe, I've had my own share of this

Many years ago I found out that Stairway To Heaven's solo was done on a Tele and not a Les Paul... SAY WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT BUT JIMMY ALWAYS PLAYED LP!!

I then found out that Eruption was done on a 6-screw trem because Floyd Rose bridges didn't exist back then. Oh and that giant dive bomb? That's Eddie literally physically switching OFF the echoplex, then switching it back on! SAY WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT!!!!!!!!

You see an artist in a video or magazine cover holding an instrument and you imagine that one favorite riff of yours on the record being played on that instrument: it's human nature. But no, it's not really how it is at all, haha

I'm sure you already know this: forget trying to get the gear they used on that record, and figure out how exactly they played that lick, if you're so inclined to replicating that sound yourself. Like Mincer I don't try to replicate things much myself anymore, I just try to play things my way, with my sound, while still respecting the original spirit of the piece. Even classical musicians do this. Every orchestra and soloist will try to play the piece as the composer originally intended, but they always have a bit of their own touch to it.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Back in the old days, people didn't have umpteen million different pickup choices if something wasn't quite right, so they tweaked the amp, pedals, etc. It's funny to me how there are some crybabies today who have a fit if they don't have every single detail exactly the way they want it-----to the extent that it prevents them from enjoying what they are doing. It's like a mental block, they simply can't bring themselves to leave the original pickups in their guitars.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

MkIII Renegade, in the spirit of pickups, I try to go the opposite of what you're saying. And you're right, folks can get very picky. I go picky in the opposite direction though. I assume if it's a 1998, MIM strat, it should have the original pickups in it! Somehow I find there's beauty in limitations.

Of course with the strat, it's easy to try out other pickups because the plastic comes off easy, so that's nice. But every guitar I've owned I just wish it had its original pickups in it.

By the way, I can't believe that every single post in this thread has been great. I guess that's what happens when you log into a guitar forum! I love the feedback, and yes, I too had no clue that Stairway's solo was on a Tele. I love information like this. Any other stories like this are appreciated!

Another example would be this song by Yezda Urfa recorded in 1976. If you fast forward directly to 3:47 ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6cLHayzT6k ) you hear a guitar that I've always assumed was a special Gibson. Now I'm beginning to think it might be a Fender here. Edit: upon further research is looks like all pictures indicate they're Gibson guys. Now I'm truly confused. It's a twangy springy sound, but it looks like in pictures they're holding either LPs, 335s, or an SG. Crazy.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

I don't really care what instruments are used on recordings. For the most part you can get in the ballpark with just about anything if you know how to tweak your gear.

There are some iconic tones that you can only get on certain instruments, like a strat neck pickup with a clean or slightly gritty amp. Other than that, learn how to alter your tones with the gear you have and you will be surprised at the sounds you can get.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

daenius said:
Hehehe, I've had my own share of this

Many years ago I found out that Stairway To Heaven's solo was done on a Tele and not a Les Paul... SAY WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT BUT JIMMY ALWAYS PLAYED LP!!
Click to expand...

A bit more learning is in order then - the first 2 zep albums were a Tele.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Black Dog was layered guitars played into two 1176 Studio compressors ran direct into a mixer. People spend literal thousands and years buying Marshall voiced amps and pedals to get that sound.

"There were three guitars on “Black Dog” so I triple-tracked it. When I mixed it, these three guitars were down here and the rest of the tracks were up here. Since the sound was so loud, it gave me much more room for the other stuff. Anyways, he meant two 1176s in series, one of which has the compression buttons punched out, so it is like an amp. You hit the front of the next compressor really hard and make the mic amp distort a bit with the EQ – a bit of bottom to make it sing."
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Yep, whatever else he might be, Page is a recording studio genius.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

I think many people associate some players with their most well known guitar and gear. Take Mike Bloomfield for an exsample. He first played a telecaster on records, then a Les Paul Goldtop with p90s and then the 59 Les Paul. I think he used the 59 on The Supersession and the Records that came after that.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Lovegun said:
I think many people associate some players with their most well known guitar and gear. Take Mike Bloomfield for an exsample. He first played a telecaster on records, then a Les Paul Goldtop with p90s and then the 59 Les Paul. I think he used the 59 on The Supersession and the Records that came after that.
Click to expand...

Then there's all these "signature models", that in worst case have nothing to do with the said artist.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

The only way I'm able to recognize what equipment was used on a record is if I've had similar equipment in my hands and tried it in person.

Even then, there are some that can remain ambiguous. I learned through experience it is possible to make a Tele sound like a Strat or a Les Paul, to a surprising degree, in a produced record - enough that it's difficult to be sure. The trick is choosing amps, speakers and other outboard equipment that brings the two disparate guitars closer together in sound. Knowing what it takes to bring two different guitars closer together in sound is a part of how 'somebody' is always able to sound like themselves, no matter what guitar they pick up.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

beaubrummels said:
The only way I'm able to recognize what equipment was used on a record is if I've had similar equipment in my hands and tried it in person.

Even then, there are some that can remain ambiguous. I learned through experience it is possible to make a Tele sound like a Strat or a Les Paul, to a surprising degree, in a produced record - enough that it's difficult to be sure. The trick is choosing amps, speakers and other outboard equipment that brings the two disparate guitars closer together in sound. Knowing what it takes to bring two different guitars closer together in sound is a part of how 'somebody' is always able to sound like themselves, no matter what guitar they pick up.
Click to expand...

I think that is the key. I get bored if 'standard' Strat sounds are being used today in a song. I don't hear the personality of the player- unless you are in Dire Straits or a similar band that pioneered that sound. Blackmore used both a 335 and Strat for his famous recordings, but his personality is so strong, it transcends what he uses.
I think, for me, as long as the guitar I am using works well, has light weight, and good balance, I will use it.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

I believe that electric guitar tone can be described by this formula:

60% - Player's hands
20% - Amp
10% - Pickups
10% - Construction of guitar (scale length, bolt-on vs. set neck, woods, etc.)

The player's hands percentage could probably be increased to 70 or even 80% for players with very unique styles. The famous example is Ted Nugent playing through Eddie Van Halen's rig and still not sounding like Eddie.

Pickups percentage could be increased in cases where the pickup is extremely high output (81, Invader, etc.).

But the gist is there. When I hear Robben Ford get essentially the same tones out of an SG as a Telecaster through the same rig, I know that what matters is not the SG or the Tele, but Robben Ford.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

I don't know if I go with that particular ratio. What is a true artist to me is 90% intent, and 10% everything else. An artist uses whatever tools are around to realize his/her vision. But not every player is an artist, which, then your formula might be more accurate.
 
Re: Some Commentary About Classic Guitar Tones

Its always hard with this ratio bit. Mainly as the style of playing can transcend any guitar/amp played through. Yet many players can also sound incredibly different with a switch of equipment despite a strong individual style.

So 'style' and 'tone' almost occupy parallel spheres
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top