What is "Roughcast"?

[Edgecrusher]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

And why exactly is that? :scratchch

Cause I have had 2 A2 mags that sounded wildly different but purchased at the same time. Thought nothing of it, thought maybe one didnt get charged so well, but for curiosities sake compared it to an A2 out of a PG and got a different result again.
Then had a similar situation happen with a pair of UOA5's but less severe. But put in the same pickup there was a definite audible difference, Now maybe these are normal variations within the mags themselves and is nothing but it still makes me wonder about mag quality and consistency.

 

[koshikas]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

no disappointments here. i only had 4 magnets(the stock double thick ceramic/standard sized alnicos of A2/A5/UOA5) to compare against in the same humbucker in the same basswood shred-stick. All alnicos types were from AFx, and i was very impressed with all of them relative to the stock ceramic which was only nice with highest of gain stuff. I replaced the ceramic goin in A2->A5->UOA5 order. by the time A5 was in i was pretty pleased (A2 was simply too polite, endless singing though). Then all your marvelous peer-pressure made here, made me change into UOA5. Well all i can say is that tiny bit missing punch that i lost from crossing over from ceramic to alnico has mostly been accounted for with all the niceness alnicos give, that i ve grown to like.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Cause I have had 2 A2 mags that sounded wildly different but purchased at the same time. Thought nothing of it, thought maybe one didnt get charged so well, but for curiosities sake compared it to an A2 out of a PG and got a different result again.
Then had a similar situation happen with a pair of UOA5's but less severe. But put in the same pickup there was a definite audible difference, Now maybe these are normal variations within the mags themselves and is nothing but it still makes me wonder about mag quality and consistency.

If that's so you should also question Gibson, Di Marzio, All Parts, Stew-Mac and most "boutique" winders. They all get their magnets from the same american, goverment-appointed, 9000 ISO-compliant foundry that has several plants in the US and its own hi-tech foundry in China.

Or maybe you should look at your own way of stocking mags and/or p'ups, which could be at fault to start with?

HTH,

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

If that's so you should also question Gibson, Di Marzio, All Parts, Stew-Mac and most "boutique" winders. They all get their magnets from the same american, goverment-appointed, 9000 ISO-compliant foundry that has several plants in the US and its own hi-tech foundry in China.

Or maybe you should look at your own way of stocking mags and/or p'ups, which could be at fault to start with?

HTH,

Or maybe you should save your malarky for someone who doesnt know better. The AFX mags are all chinese (not saying thats the issue but clarifying their source) There are a few places to get mags in the US though most require a large industrial sized order. And no not everyone gets their mags from the same source. Ive never had the same issues from mags that I got from magnetic hold or throbak. Foundaries are not government appointed and 9000 ISO is just a set of standards about what things should be but as we have seen in many industries there is still room for interpretation. Really not impressed with the just throwing around of big terms and words that dont really bolster your argument they are just there to try and dazzle someone with BS.

How can I be at issue for the mags when I get them from DHL open the package and install them and there is a problem? Mags are not that sensitive if they were they wouldnt last for 60 years in a guitar.

Keep in mind I said i was scratching my head wondering meaning I havent passed judgment but iam curious about it and willing to admit it might be a fluke.

I get it anytime someone say anything remotely disparaging about AFX you come running to white knight them, you can save it. I'm free to wonder and form an opinion myself and you certainly dont see me bashing them and considering the ordering issues I had in the past I have more reason than most to do so.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Or maybe you should save your malarky for someone who doesnt know better.

I KNEW you'll bite. You just can't accept to be called out, don't you? And to consider the possibility of being wrong? You'll be dead before you'll even admit to the possibility. Congratulations, you came to the right country; you're in very good company then!

The AFX mags are all chinese (not saying thats the issue but clarifying their source)

Of course they're MADE in China. Just like all the others I've cited. The company I was talking about is american, though. If you've gotten an UOA5 from Jon, you've already have one of the same company. Located in Illinois, to be precise.

And no not everyone gets their mags from the same source.

You remember I SELL magnets, isn't it? That means dealing with different sources, that in my case have been american (all with plants located in China, FYI), chinese and european (yes, they exist; the one I deal with supplies the Ferrari F1 Team). Guess how I know what I've said?

Ive never had the same issues from mags that I got from magnetic hold or throbak.

How many have you tried so you can have that judgement? From how many batches? In my case, I had to sample different suppliers for at least a year, comparing notes of different charges from different batches to be able to assess the reliability of the source. I'm sure you did the same, didn't you?

Foundaries are not government appointed

OK, you got me; it's called "contracting". Sorry!

9000 ISO is just a set of standards about what things should be but as we have seen in many industries there is still room for interpretation.

Well, if you wanna be contracted by the goverment, that's one of the BASIC requirements... and you just wanna dismiss that?

Really not impressed with the just throwing around of big terms and words that dont really bolster your argument they are just there to try and dazzle someone with BS.

To impress you was not the meaning of my post. Trying to put a little bit of prospective to your harsh words about a whole industry was.

You can call it anyway you want. I just call'em "facts".

An anecdotal note: I got from an acquaintance of mine a dozen of short mags taken out from broken Gibson p'ups from mid 70s. Half of them don't hold a charge for longer than three months, and one of'em can't even stay on the fridge holding a note. Those were made in america, by an american company, using american materials and american industrial manufactoring processes. What's your take on those? Would you judge an entire industry just by them?

No, you won't; isn't it? Now, WHY you do with others? Because they're chinese?

Let's hear it...

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Keep in mind I said i was scratching my head wondering meaning I havent passed judgment but iam curious about it and willing to admit it might be a fluke.

Reading comprehension you fail at. Ill post it again in bolt in case you miss it again

[

Keep in mind I said i was scratching my head wondering meaning I havent passed judgment but iam curious about it and willing to admit it might be a fluke.

So in short your just trying to start a fight with me. Nothing you said actually refutes anything I said. You even back tracked on some of your statements but consistency has never been a strong suit in your trolling.

If you like next week I have to go to Pavia if you like I can stop by and we can have a mag measuring contest.

 

[Chocklit_Thunda]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Ummmm... Did ubermetaldood just lose it??

 

[Archer250]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Ummmm... Did ubermetaldood just lose it??

Funniest thing is how the comments after that ignored it.

 

[Letus]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Funniest thing is the comments after that.

When the titans rage, the pretty sentiments of the humans below them are of no consideration.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

You mean nobody talks about the White elephant ( pun intended) in the room?

Well, at least he'll get banned, so nobody will need to put up with him anymore.

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Its better no one pays him any attention. So it can be erased without having to disrupt everything. Sadly it will be ban number 5 that i know of for him. Might be time to consider an IP ban.

 

[JCM900MkIII]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Psycho-acoustics alert...


A magnetic field is pretty steady, even and SMOOTH.
If you hold and move a compass near a magnet, it doesn't flip, jump, flick (whatever you want to call it) because there is an uneven surface.
In fact if you damage a magnet (chipping off a little bit) the magnetic field changes for the whole magnet, not just in that specific damaged area.

So the rough surface is just that. Nothing more. A rough surface.
It's probably CHEAPER because there is no extra work needed.
Maybe that is why some winders use "rough cast" magnets...

The magnetic field is pretty constant (yes it changes over time, but in the case of guitar pickups, I wouldn't hold my breath to see the change).
And I don't see the winding doing a lot of physical moving or changing shape.
Playing the guitar gives those "weird little" alterations in frequency and volume, not the smoothnes of a magnet's surface.

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

So the rough surface is just that. Nothing more. A rough surface.

There is a very real very audible difference between rough cast and polished mags. This is not in question at all. A compass is not a pickup its a false analogy.

 

[JCM900MkIII]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

You mean to say that there are measurable fluctuations in a single magnet's magnetic field?

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

You mean to say that there are measurable fluctuations in a single magnet's magnetic field?

I play guitars not measurements. Not everything that can be heard can be measured. Not everything that can be measured can be heard.

 

[Archer250]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

I play guitars not measurements. Not everything that can be heard can be measured. Not everything that can be measured can be heard.

I'm pretty sure differences *can* be measured. Hell, people like to underestimate small numbers because they seem insignificant. How much lead in water is considered unsafe? Pretty damn little if you merely look at the numbers.

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

I'm pretty sure differences *can* be measured. Hell, people like to underestimate small numbers because they seem insignificant. How much lead in water is considered unsafe? Pretty damn little if you merely look at the numbers.

I get what your saying and I think it might be possible to do without any real equipment using like a thin pane of glass and some fine iron filings... my point is i dont care what the magnetic field measures or looks like I only care how it interfaces with a pickup. If i can hear a difference that is enough for my purposes.

 

[blueman335]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

There is a very real very audible difference between rough cast and polished mags. This is not in question at all.

+1. There are a number of experienced players here that can tell the difference in tone between polished and roughcast. I use roughcasts in the bridge slot because it gives a little smoother, less harsh high end.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

next week I have to go to Pavia if you like I can stop by and we can have a mag measuring contest.

I'm actually in holidays in a location near Taormina, Sicily.

I'll be back the first of september. Maybe in November I could come and visit you; I'll be in Verona for a week for project; maybe we can arrange a meeting.

I'll get back to you in due time. Stay tuned!

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: What is "Roughcast"?

Verona's a good middle ground Iam often down that way.