Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

[Cdwillis]

I'm just curious. I read a description on the SD blog saying the PAF style pickups used butyrate bobbins. They listed the 59, Seth, and Antiquities specifically if I recall correctly. I didn't think the 59s were butyrate and what about the PGs? They're PAF style, plus modern four conductor wiring.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

I see the Antiquity pickups do.

It makes zero difference in how the pickup sounds. It’s just marketing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Discharged]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

Both the Seth Lover and Antiquity HBs use Butyrate bobbins.

/Peter

 

[ICTGoober]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

It makes zero difference in how the pickup sounds. It’s just marketing.

So true. Would apply to many guitar parts, not just pickups.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

So true. Would apply to many guitar parts, not just pickups.

Also people doing silly things like top wrapping stop tailpieces on Gibsons.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jacew]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

Also people doing silly things like top wrapping stop tailpieces on Gibsons.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't know about top wrapping. Might make damping easier/more comfortable?

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

I don't know about top wrapping. Might make damping easier/more comfortable?

People have the idea that screwing the stop tail all the way down to the body somehow increases sustain. It doesn’t.

But that applies too steep of a break angle over the bridge, so they top wrap to reduce this angle.

But that’s no different than just raising the stop bar up and stringing through the tailpiece the way it was intended. That’s why it’s adjustable.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jacew]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

People have the idea that screwing the stop tail all the way down to the body somehow increases sustain. It doesn’t.

But that applies too steep of a break angle over the bridge, so they top wrap to reduce this angle.

But that’s no different than just raising the stop bar up and stringing through the tailpiece the way it was intended. That’s why it’s adjustable.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know that. Just pointing out that having strings on top would make controlling damping easier. I do play strats though, but often keep smoothing out notes with a slight touch at the bridge. When get it right it improves sound considerably.

 

[ItsaBass]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

Antiquitys and Seths when it comes to standard stuff. A handful of Custom Shop models have them (e.g. the Amos set), plus you can spec them on any Custom Shop build of a standard-style humbucker.

The '59s are supposedly wound on an old Gibson winding machine, but don't have butyrate bobbins.

Also, DiMarzio P.A.F. '59s and Mojotone '59 Clones have the butyrate bobbins.

The Mojotones use A4 mags (which, according to old Gibson purchase records, made up 70 percent of the bar magnets purchased during the P.A.F. years). The DiMarzios use weakened A5s. The Seths use A2s. The Antiquitys use weakened A2s.

Butyrate is only an issue if you will have uncovered coils and want them to break in cosmetically like butyrate bobbins do. It's a visual thing that manifests only after years of play, not a tonal thing.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

I know that. Just pointing out that having strings on top would make controlling damping easier. I do play strats though, but often keep smoothing out notes with a slight touch at the bridge. When get it right it improves sound considerably.

You mean palm muting? It’s exactly the same. You don’t rest your hand on the tailpiece, and the tailpiece should be adjusted up so the break angle is correct.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Cdwillis]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

Antiquitys and Seths when it comes to standard stuff. A handful of Custom Shop models have them (e.g. the Amos set), plus you can spec them on any Custom Shop build of a standard-style humbucker.

The '59s are supposedly wound on an old Gibson winding machine, but don't have butyrate bobbins.

Also, DiMarzio P.A.F. '59s and Mojotone '59 Clones have the butyrate bobbins.

The Mojotones use A4 mags (which, according to old Gibson purchase records, made up 70 percent of the bar magnets purchased during the P.A.F. years). The DiMarzios use weakened A5s. The Seths use A2s. The Antiquitys use weakened A2s.

Butyrate is only an issue if you will have uncovered coils and want them to break in cosmetically like butyrate bobbins do. It's a visual thing that manifests only after years of play, not a tonal thing.

It was just kind of a curiosity thing as far as how much the PAF style humbuckers have the same construction.

Speaking of magnets, I've got some polished A4 mags on the way to play with. I'm gonna try them in my Pearly Gates and maybe a Custom and a Gibson 490R I've got laying around. I was reading that the polished mags have a little more high end (don't know if that's really noticeable or not?) and that the Gibson ones from back in the day were probably rough cast and a little more mellow.

 

[freefrog]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

FWIW, the earliest 59's had also butyrate bobbins (with specially shaped bobbin cores designed by Seymour to avoid bending, since butyrate is a soft material bending over time under wiring tension... food for thought: https://www.lespaulforum.com/forum/...yrate-bobbins-of-today-PAF-replicas-wont-bend ).

 

[Archer250]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

There's no real reason to top wrap the tailpiece

We do it because our heroes do it and it looks cool.

You could just raise the tailpiece instead and the end results would be the same.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Tapatalk

 

[AlexR]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

You can do either, topwrap or raise. Certainly the look is more ugly with a tailpieces raised up to the heavens. The result at the bridge end is the same, it's just some people get annoyed for no reason when others do it......they seem to use it as a vehicle to complain about one thing or other.
And the tailpieces as it was designed was most certainly designed to topwrap......as it was a bridge/tailpieces in one originally. The only difference in construction when it became a tailpieces alone was the lack of grubscrews.
Not only did it serve this function in 54, but SGs and Firebirds also used them as bridges by themselves......of course with the lightningbolt version.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

I've got some polished A4 mags on the way to play with. I'm gonna try them in my Pearly Gates and maybe a Custom and a Gibson 490R I've got laying around. I was reading that the polished mags have a little more high end (don't know if that's really noticeable or not?) and that the Gibson ones from back in the day were probably rough cast and a little more mellow.

Both of those PU's have A2's so you're going to get more high end, thinner mids, and a firmer low end. I like 490R's much better with a brighter magnet, I use A5's.

Roughcast (sandcast) magnets have a slightly smoother high end, and some of us like to use them in the bridge slot because of that (like Zhang). Not a big difference, either way.

 

[Jacew]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

You can do either, topwrap or raise. Certainly the look is more ugly with a tailpieces raised up to the heavens. The result at the bridge end is the same, it's just some people get annoyed for no reason when others do it......they seem to use it as a vehicle to complain about one thing or other.
And the tailpieces as it was designed was most certainly designed to topwrap......as it was a bridge/tailpieces in one originally. The only difference in construction when it became a tailpieces alone was the lack of grubscrews.
Not only did it serve this function in 54, but SGs and Firebirds also used them as bridges by themselves......of course with the lightningbolt version.

Yep. I was thinking bridge and tailpiece as one block, like in junior gibson. Like I said I haven't played that much with LP style guitars...

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

You can do either, topwrap or raise. Certainly the look is more ugly with a tailpieces raised up to the heavens..

Top wrapping is ugly. It’s like the person doesn’t know how to string a guitar. Same person will have a million wraps around the tuning posts going the wrong way. [emoji23]

You can leave the tailpiece the way it came from the factory. They know how to set it up.

With top wrapping people are screwing the tailpiece all the way down.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[AlexR]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

^ You do seem to have this penchant for confusing personal opinion with fact.

I'd list the number of logical fallacies in the above post, but it might go past the word count limit for this forum.........best for you to simply to keep quiet - that is if you want to maintain credibility

 

[Archer250]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

Top wrapping is ugly. It’s like the person doesn’t know how to string a guitar. Same person will have a million wraps around the tuning posts going the wrong way. [emoji23]

You can leave the tailpiece the way it came from the factory. They know how to set it up.

With top wrapping people are screwing the tailpiece all the way down.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

See, thankfully I've never been of a mind to give a single **** what people think of my teching when they look at my guitars' bridges.

I guess I consider myself blessed.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Tapatalk

 

[jeremy]

Re: Which Duncans use Butyrate bobbins?

as long as the strings arent hitting the back edge of the bridge then i dont think its too low. too high means not enough down pressure on the saddles to keep the strings in place which makes it just a bit hard to play