How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

[Soulcrusher_X]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

Some of the brightness might be a little to do with that CL80. They do have a fairly neutral tone, but they can sometimes be bright. Sometimes, the V30s can be harsh. IF you still think it's bright when you get the tubes situated, maybe try some Greenbacks or G1265 variants?

[mwalluk]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

Is that a JJ ECC83S? Or the ECC803S? If it's got less than an inch between the plates, it's the former. If it's the long-plate version, I would argue it's a better tube, and it shouldn't sound too bad in V2. I think if you still want to tame the brightness, you should replace the V2 tube, and you should probably do it with a well-selected Chinese tube or a long-plate JJ. I like the Chinese ones better, but if you've already got an ECC803S, give that a shot. Soulcrusher_X likes the Penta brand, and I've never tried them. I like Ruby 12AX7AC5 HG+.

I wouldn't blame you if you were turned off to JJs altogether. I don't really like them in the preamp at all, but I can understand where someone would find a use for the ECC803S. The ECC83, though, fuggeddaboudit.

It was the short platted one, ecc83.

[Edgecrusher]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

The cathode follower is not the same as the phase inverter. The cathode follower's purpose is to lower the impedance of the circuit at that point to drive the tonestack. The Deliverance is a bit unorthodox in that one of the gain pots actually changes the EQ actively, so the tonestack isn't the only thing providing the EQ, but it needs some current to maintain signal integrity through the filters. I could put up some equations with filter frequencies and R and C values to prove all this stuff, but that would require a lot of confusing equations and not much real-life applicability. It would also be testing portions of my brain I shut off long ago.

Actually im well aware of that. The reason i didnt explain the difference between a cathode follower and a phase inverter for him is it would have done nothing but confuse him. My point was some people will refer to V4 in his amp as a PI and some will refer to it as a cathode follower either way its the same position.

Ive read the stuff Myles Rose has written about the PI slot I once had a long conversation with Doug Roccaforte about it and you are right people wont come to an agreement about it.

[Burruss]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

Also a D60 owner, the thread is awesome!!! I know nothing about the "guts" of the amp, but according to my research and experience, if your cab doesn't say VHT or Fryette on it, the sound wont be as good. For whatever reason, these heads are picky about what cabs they like and which ones they don't. So if you have access to a VHT cab somewhere, it might be worth your time to try one out.

[mwalluk]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

Also a D60 owner, the thread is awesome!!! I know nothing about the "guts" of the amp, but according to my research and experience, if your cab doesn't say VHT or Fryette on it, the sound wont be as good. For whatever reason, these heads are picky about what cabs they like and which ones they don't. So if you have access to a VHT cab somewhere, it might be worth your time to try one out.

It's more so speakers than it is cab. Though dimensions do play a role.

Also did you retube your amp at all? If so, what did you have luck with?

[Burruss]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

No, I haven't done it yet, but I will be in the next few months. There's this guy who sells tube sets designed specifically for a certain amp that you want. I don't remember the name, but I've sent an email to a friend, will be re-learning the name of the guy. I think he uses JJ's exclusively, if that helps.

[Burruss]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

the speakers in the cab I use, VHT Fatbottom 4x12, are P-50-E's. Custom made for Steve Fryette by Eminence I believe. They sound fantastic!

[mwalluk]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

No, I haven't done it yet, but I will be in the next few months. There's this guy who sells tube sets designed specifically for a certain amp that you want. I don't remember the name, but I've sent an email to a friend, will be re-learning the name of the guy. I think he uses JJ's exclusively, if that helps.

You talking about Eurotubes? If so, I wouldn't recommend that option. They only sell JJ's. All JJ's in the VHT will sound bad.

That being said JJ KT88's rock and a ECC803 should sound good in V1-V2.

But unfortunately that's it.


I would recommend going through Dougstubes or Tubedepot.

Try a mix first, you can always swap some later.


Power Tubes:

JJ KT88s
Gold Lion Kt88s
Tungsol 6550
EHX 6550
Winged C's 6550

should all be pretty good.


Pre amp:

Tungsols, EHX, Sovtek LPS have all worked well for me. Looking to pick up a Mullard and a JJ Ec803 down the line.

[mwalluk]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

the speakers in the cab I use, VHT Fatbottom 4x12, are P-50-E's. Custom made for Steve Fryette by Eminence I believe. They sound fantastic!

Yea the P50E's were designed by Fryette. Frequency and Schematic wise, they are similar to Vintage 30s. I'm almost thinking that they are probably really similar to EVM 12L's.

I hear the Fat Bottom cabs are real nice. Bigger dimensions. I would love to pick up the 212 cab down the line.

[Burruss]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

You talking about Eurotubes? If so, I wouldn't recommend that option. They only sell JJ's. All JJ's in the VHT will sound bad.

That being said JJ KT88's rock and a ECC803 should sound good in V1-V2.

But unfortunately that's it.


I would recommend going through Dougstubes or Tubedepot.

Try a mix first, you can always swap some later.


Power Tubes:

JJ KT88s
Gold Lion Kt88s
Tungsol 6550
EHX 6550
Winged C's 6550

should all be pretty good.


Pre amp:

Tungsols, EHX, Sovtek LPS have all worked well for me. Looking to pick up a Mullard and a JJ Ec803 down the line.

Yes I was talking about euro tubes. I wouldn't have ever thought that talking to Bob over at euro tubes would be a bad idea.

[Burruss]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

Yea the P50E's were designed by Fryette. Frequency and Schematic wise, they are similar to Vintage 30s. I'm almost thinking that they are probably really similar to EVM 12L's.

I hear the Fat Bottom cabs are real nice. Bigger dimensions. I would love to pick up the 212 cab down the line.

I HIGHLY recommend it. Best cab I've heard, and even luckier to own it.

[mwalluk]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

Yes I was talking about euro tubes. I wouldn't have ever thought that talking to Bob over at euro tubes would be a bad idea.

No, don't get me wrong. Bob is awesome, really good person, great customer service. You have to keep in mind that he sells JJ's, so that's what he would suggest for you. That's all they sell, so ofcourse he's going recommend you a full set of..... JJs.

[Soulcrusher_X]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

Yea the P50E's were designed by Fryette. Frequency and Schematic wise, they are similar to Vintage 30s. I'm almost thinking that they are probably really similar to EVM 12L's.

I hear the Fat Bottom cabs are real nice. Bigger dimensions. I would love to pick up the 212 cab down the line.

If the P50E is similar to the V30, then it is WAYYYY difference than the EVM12L. The EVM is a 200 or 300 watt speaker depending on the version, 160oz magnet, large dome, straight cone. Nowhere near V30.

[Soulcrusher_X]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

Actually im well aware of that. The reason i didnt explain the difference between a cathode follower and a phase inverter for him is it would have done nothing but confuse him. My point was some people will refer to V4 in his amp as a PI and some will refer to it as a cathode follower either way its the same position.

Ive read the stuff Myles Rose has written about the PI slot I once had a long conversation with Doug Roccaforte about it and you are right people wont come to an agreement about it.

Well, I think also, in this amp, the PI being a Cathodyne rather than a long-tail is also a little confusing probably for some. So, technically, yes it is a cathode-follower and yes, it is a phase inverter.

[mwalluk]

Re: How to enhance my tone and how the V spots react to my amp?

If the P50E is similar to the V30, then it is WAYYYY difference than the EVM12L. The EVM is a 200 or 300 watt speaker depending on the version, 160oz magnet, large dome, straight cone. Nowhere near V30.

I meant that in this way. P50E has some characteristics of the V30, almost if they took one and tweaked it out. Same could be said with EVM 12L specifically speaking of Zakk Wylde who used to use V30s but wanted something more. So almost like Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.