FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

[justFred]

anyone ever tried it...would adding one let you use, like a reverb pedal and not ruin the tone as when you put one in front???

[Blille]

FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

I have not but I am a happy user of reverb (and delay) in front of my 5e3

I did try splitting the signal and sending the main tone to the hotter channel and the reverb only to the other one. Didn’t really add much.

The Mesa Fillmore 25 has a loop and I believe Frenzel 5e3 amps can add one as well.

I think it may be tricky because at least to me the characteristic overdrive “blowing up” tone of a 5e3 is a lot from the power amp.

[Jacew]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

I agree.

I did add loop to my Tiny Terror, which teached very practically how useless loop can be in such amp. There's very little distortion from preamp in that too, 5e3 even less. So even if you add loop to it it's not going to make much difference from having effects in front.

Joey Voltage posted a complex (to me at least) schematic for a mod to add loop between phase inverter and power tubes. If it indeed works that might be usable for 5e3 as well. I didn't quite get the way it works, and eventually opted to just change the amp.

[Boogie Bill]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

I would not do an irreversible mod to a vintage amp. A clone, maybe.

It was a simpler time back then. Today, with all the pedals and effects, a loop is a handy addition to an amp's feature set, and one of the myriad of reasons I went from using vintage BF Fenders and JCM800s to the Mesa amps.

The problem is practice use for most people. On a big stage or a recording studio, you can crank the amp, run it through the PA and have the engineer add outboard effects at the board. But at home and small clubs, not having a loop is a problem. That's the situation I ran into, and solving it meant buying a modern amp with modern features. Neil Young does it with a Rube Goldberg contraption.

I wonder if some of the boutique builders of tweed clones would have ideas about this. I'm sure it has been done. I know Randy Smith of Mesa is lover of tweed tone and design, and many of his amps get that tone. The TWEED mode of my Mark V's CLEAN channel, at the 10-watt setting, is one of my favorite settings when pushed. My Maverick and Mark IV can also get me there. His new California Tweed amp is directly aiming for that tone...one I'm going to take a hard look at.

Good luck.

Bill

[IM4Tone]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

I have not but I am a happy user of reverb (and delay) in front of my 5e3 ..............

I do likewise and it sounds good to me.

[67Mopar]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

A loop on a 5E3 tweed?

[PFDarkside]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

Look into something like the Universal Audio OX Box that will attenuate, then give a Loop for Effects, then remap with a Tube amp. Pretty popular online now since you can take your loud amp down to nothing and send a signal to a computer for recording.

[Blille]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

Look into something like the Universal Audio OX Box that will attenuate, then give a Loop for Effects, then remap with a Tube amp. Pretty popular online now since you can take your loud amp down to nothing and send a signal to a computer for recording.

Can I have the $99 version of that?

Looks amazing.

[Chickenwings]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

The sound of a 5e3 is the sum of its parts. The dirt comes from all three stages including the phase inverter and the power tubes. It is really not the kind of circuit that lends itself to effects loops if your goal is getting a crunchy sound that does not compress the reverb. As a long time user of the 5e3 (and many other vintage fender circuits) I have learned to work with both its strengths and its shortcomings. Try running both channels jumpered and having a reverb pedal into the cooler channel, or experiment with a slapback delay in front of the pre for a kind of "retro rockabilly" fake reverb.
A big part of the reward of the 5e3 is learning to make the best of its strengths and embrace the character that it can give your tone. I believe that the touch sensitivity, the rich chocolatey tone and old fashioned funkyness of its sound can give you so much more than what can be accessed by a more modern, more modular kind of amp.
If the jumpering channels is no good for you, nor the slapback option then perhaps start looking for a more modern (something with more headroom in the later stages of the circuit) style amp.
What you are looking for is something many people want but due to the nature of the beast, have not been able to manage.
Unless you are in the studio....then you can add the reverb in the mixing stage, or if you want to go digital and use a 5e3 impulse etc, or even check out the bad cat unleash.
Having said all that, after playing what would be at least a hundred gigs with a 5e3, once the band is playing, you really don't miss the reverb. Just enjoy the fun you get from the great tone they pump out.

[justFred]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

The sound of a 5e3 is the sum of its parts. The dirt comes from all three stages including the phase inverter and the power tubes. It is really not the kind of circuit that lends itself to effects loops if your goal is getting a crunchy sound that does not compress the reverb. As a long time user of the 5e3 (and many other vintage fender circuits) I have learned to work with both its strengths and its shortcomings. Try running both channels jumpered and having a reverb pedal into the cooler channel, or experiment with a slapback delay in front of the pre for a kind of "retro rockabilly" fake reverb.
A big part of the reward of the 5e3 is learning to make the best of its strengths and embrace the character that it can give your tone. I believe that the touch sensitivity, the rich chocolatey tone and old fashioned funkyness of its sound can give you so much more than what can be accessed by a more modern, more modular kind of amp.
If the jumpering channels is no good for you, nor the slapback option then perhaps start looking for a more modern (something with more headroom in the later stages of the circuit) style amp.
What you are looking for is something many people want but due to the nature of the beast, have not been able to manage.
Unless you are in the studio....then you can add the reverb in the mixing stage, or if you want to go digital and use a 5e3 impulse etc, or even check out the bad cat unleash.
Having said all that, after playing what would be at least a hundred gigs with a 5e3, once the band is playing, you really don't miss the reverb. Just enjoy the fun you get from the great tone they pump out.

Thank you sir....that really does nail the nature of the 5E3...I continue fighting against the inevitable fact that it's tone is as you say "a sum of it's parts"...take away or add anything but a guitar and that simple equation that creates it's gorgeous tone is compromised...but then...maybe could add a spring reverb circuit...

[Blille]

Re: FX loop in 5E3 Tweed Deluxe?

This thread made me think that before I just started to embrace reverb in the front I had thought of two things:
- doing a small dry-ish wet setup. I thought of gettting a custom cab with a 12” and an 8”. Splitting the signal at the input or between amp and speaker and have the dry+delay signal into the 12” and the reverb only into the 8”. For the 8” I would get a small SS amp like the Hotone Mojo Diamond.
- just getting a tweed in a box like Les Lius or Formula 55, putting reverb after that and going into a higher headroom amp

Ended up loving reverb in the front end but what I’ve done recently is to add a limiter at the end of the chain, after reverb. What this does is a sort of ducking reverb where when you dig in it still distorts but the reverb doesn’t get out of hand and when you play more softly the reverb is a bit more present. Maybe that does it for you.